DrPizza's project: turn garage into ... apartment

[DrPizza]

Not trying to be a party pooper at all, but reality beckons.

You obviously know what you're doing AFA construction goes. Framing, drywall, electrical, gas, etc. Looks good to me. But in most towns/cities/states you need not only a permit to do the work, but it must be inspected/certified as well. Also, if someone is living in the new space, zoning and fire safety laws etc come into play.

Long ago, I checked with the town supervisor - if I'm not increasing the square footage of my property, nope. We had some friends from Long Island come for a visit a few years ago. It blew their minds that people around here have a right to work on their property.

 

[EagleKeeper]

I only got him a 50" plasma for Christmas. And, it'd have been a 40", but the only local stores that carry them were out of the models I was interested in. And, sorry, Walmart, I'll never buy an electronic device branded "Hi-Sense."

His plan is to stay here for 3 years, pay off his student loans, save a bundle of cash to get a good start out in the rest of the world, then move on with his experience. Ditto his girlfriend; she graduates this spring as an RN and is considering doing just about the same thing (may even wind up here in the garage.) I expect them to be engaged in a few years. Their ability to save up 100k or more between them over 3 years should really help get them off to a good start.


And, after he moves out, then there's the possibility that my mother (retired) may come back to NY for a while & stay there. Else, I'll rent it out as a "spare room." It's roughly 15x21 on one side, 12x21 on the other side, so 550+ square feet; electric, gas, water, internet, cable (satellite) provided. I doubt I'd have trouble finding a favorable person willing to pay the right price.

FYI - What parents' dream does not become reality for the children in many cases. :whiste:

 

[Doppel]

The whole plan to me sounds like a huge win. Most guys can't even use a circular saw, so he's learning to do something that scares many people throughout their lives (doing something handy) plus save a ton of money in the meantime.

How long did this take so far?

In the 1950's if your child lived at home at age 26 you put them in the attic and told the neighbors they died of tuberculosis.

In the 1950's if you got high school you went off to a factory making decent pay with pension and benefits. Now you have a degree and you may be struggling.

Long ago, I checked with the town supervisor - if I'm not increasing the square footage of my property, nope. We had some friends from Long Island come for a visit a few years ago. It blew their minds that people around here have a right to work on their property.

Really, that is surprising. In some parts of the country a permit is needed to put an a pool in place, a deck, a shed, and finish a basement. A lot of people don't bother, particularly for things that cannot be found out (e.g. basement). I've never had a clear picture of what the repercussions are of something like doing a basement without permit. I think it depends substantially on which town you're in. Talking to a guy recently and in his town he said that if you finish a basement with no permit, when you go to sell the house the town will make you rip it down to studs to get it the necessary inspection. And inspection includes rough plumbing, water supply, framing & insulation, and electric. I have heard that in some places you're not even allowed to do electric yourself--need a licensed electrician, but this sounds so absurd I'm not sure it's actually true. Generally if electric inspection is needed you can have your three year old do it if you like, just as long as a licensed electrician does the final inspection. The only real downfall of getting a permit if it's required is the increase in taxes you may pay when property value goes up. Otherwise, most inspectors are not generally aholes.

 

[edro]

All of the localities I have lived require a permit if you are changing anything structurally, modifying plumbing drain circuits or adding electrical branch circuits.

That's the requirement... it doesn't mean it has to be followed.

 

[Newbian]

All of the localities I have lived require a permit if you are changing anything structurally, modifying plumbing drain circuits or adding electrical branch circuits.

That's the requirement... it doesn't mean it has to be followed.

Remember...goats eat anything including inspectors poking around.

 

[CPA]

That's not sheetrock on the ceiling. There's 1" of ordinary 4'x8' sheets of styrofoam covering most of the ceiling, with 6" of fiberglass on top of that. There are furring strips holding the insulation up. I've gotten some long construction screws that have more than enough holding power to beef up the furring strips - I don't have faith in their fasteners. Then, most likely, I'll use tongue and groove on the ceiling. It's fast & easy (and I hate doing drywall overhead.) On the other side - bathroom & bedroom, I'll use drywall (and green board in the bathroom.) By "other side" - I meant the other side of the garage - not the other side (above) of the ceiling. The other half of the garage was largely uninsulated. For the recessed lighting to work, the cans have to be extended as far as they go (else the metal won't extend to the edge of the ceiling. Otherwise, I would have attempted to take down the foam insulation. But, the insulation above it is just laying there; not stapled in place. It'd have been a pain in the neck.

ahhh, didn't catch that was styrofoam. I only saw this:

I just started insulating the ceiling on the other side, but ran out of daylight & wasn't happy with just the one worklight.

I figured you had a way (attic) to get to the topside of the ceiling and work from there.

 

[T_Yamamoto]

Awesome project!

Sent from Galaxy Nexus (4G/LTE)

 

[BarkingGhostar]

not true, it saves a ton of money.

Reminds me of the blood-sucking leech defense.

 

[dmcowen674]

Out on Long Island (down in the big city) you can't run a new outlet in the bathroom without building permits and two inspections without ruining the value of your home and risking fines.

That can't be.

 

[7window]

wow!! nice project. Just need a disposable area rug no carpet needed and you are all set.

 

[slightlyhuman]

looking good doc! i'll snap a few pics of my shop-converted mancave.

 

[Rubycon]

Are you concerned about Formosan termites? Since you're quite handy, renting a percussion drill, pump and injector to treat the soil below the slab and in the block wall cavities should be no problem. (obtaining termiticide may be however)

In the sticks you can probably find some unused chlordane, aldrin, or even dursban concentrate un used. As long as you're not near a cistern/well etc. it should be fine.

 

[Train]

His plan is to stay here for 3 years, pay off his student loans, save a bundle of cash to get a good start out in the rest of the world, then move on with his experience. Ditto his girlfriend; she graduates this spring as an RN and is considering doing just about the same thing (may even wind up here in the garage.) I expect them to be engaged in a few years. Their ability to save up 100k or more between them over 3 years should really help get them off to a good start.

Assuming they stay together, they would have to save over $1300 EACH for 36 months to approach $100k.

That's a pretty lofty goal for any recent college grad.

 

[alkemyst]

nothing at all wrong with living at home after school for a bit to get some cash saved up

Only those that did say this. Most that didn't get out right away on their own regretted it. They also usually don't leave home until they fall into a committed relationship based on their parents support.

To each their own, but I'd rather have my dad just subsidize my rent for a few years rather than build me a bachelor pad in their home.

 

[Old Hippie]

You're a handy dude.

Good Luck Doc!

 

[Saint Nick]

Only those that did say this. Most that didn't get out right away on their own regretted it. They also usually don't leave home until they fall into a committed relationship based on their parents support.

To each their own, but I'd rather have my dad just subsidize my rent for a few years rather than build me a bachelor pad in their home.

Amen to that brother. I asked Dad for a little help after I graduated and was looking for more work. He helped me out and soon enough I was on my feet. I couldn't stand the thought of living with my parents for three years after college. Even though the apartment I was living in wasn't that great, I was 60 miles away from my parents and had my own space. Life is good.

However, not to knock the OP here, of course. I have many friends who have moved home and they are enjoying it. Different strokes, different folks.

 

[vi edit]

Only those that did say this. Most that didn't get out right away on their own regretted it. They also usually don't leave home until they fall into a committed relationship based on their parents support. To each their own, but I'd rather have my dad just subsidize my rent for a few years rather than build me a bachelor pad in their home. alkemyst is online now Add Infraction for alkemyst Report Post IP

You're 40 something years old, not a parent, and have an open history of credit problems in your past. I don't think you would understand.

College costs have gotten extremely high, interest rates on student loans were as high as 7% a few years back, and home prices are now priced at dual income levels rather than single incomes in many parts of the country vs what they were 15-20 years ago. Plus the job market blows.

The worst thing that a kid can do today is step out of college with a massive pile of debt around their neck and continue adding to it with a mortgage or other expenses. If both parents and children are happy with the living arrangement for a few years post grad then more power to them. Pay down your debts, build up some savings and jump from the nest without 80k in debt pulling you down.

 

[HomerSapien]

I would have loved to of lived at home for a little bit after college to pay off loans and save. My only problem was my job was too far away. The ability to pay off the student loans would have removed a substantial amount of stress in our lives as it is essentially an extra mortgage.

My sister did it and ended up buying twice the house we did on a smaller salary without being burdened.

Looks like a fun project.

 

[Pantlegz]

Assuming they stay together, they would have to save over $1300 EACH for 36 months to approach $100k.

That's a pretty lofty goal for any recent college grad.

Depending on how much they're saving on rent/utilities by living at home that's not out of the question. My monthly bills are easily 1000 if not more than that and I put 200 or so a month into savings the way it is and I'm still a student, with a great "student" job.

 

[Elbryn]

Assuming they stay together, they would have to save over $1300 EACH for 36 months to approach $100k.

That's a pretty lofty goal for any recent college grad.

certainly possible though depending on how you figure it. 401k's typically come with matches. lets say they each make 40k a year with 6% match on 12% contributions.
that nets each one 7.2k savings for a total of 14.4k for the pair of them. almost halfway there.

individually, taking the above 7.2k a year out, you only gotta save about 800 bucks a month.
with no rent/utilities/semi subsidized food/etc.. 800 a month can be done.

say take home on the remaining 35.2k is about 2100 a month, that leaves 1100 a month to play with if you save 1k for roth or whatever.

 

[alkemyst]

You're 40 something years old, not a parent, and have an open history of credit problems in your past. I don't think you would understand.

College costs have gotten extremely high, interest rates on student loans were as high as 7% a few years back, and home prices are now priced at dual income levels rather than single incomes in many parts of the country vs what they were 15-20 years ago. Plus the job market blows.

The worst thing that a kid can do today is step out of college with a massive pile of debt around their neck and continue adding to it with a mortgage or other expenses. If both parents and children are happy with the living arrangement for a few years post grad then more power to them. Pay down your debts, build up some savings and jump from the nest without 80k in debt pulling you down.

WTF are you talking about?

First, college has always been expensive. Your own argument that homes are at dual income levels is surprising as adults living with their parents is also having an affect at a lot of disposable income items. Housing is not so affected as many of these adults are still living at home 10+ years later and have nothing to show for it.

I went away to college and by the time I was 23 I was out, married and had a nice 3/2/2 pool home on the water in one of the more desirable communities. My parents took care of a lot of things like gas/insurance, but at the same time I was working up to 3 jobs at a time and saving money.

I qualified for little free college money and had to do loans for the rest and work summer's. I ended up with $7000 in debt for 7 years of education when I went the first time.

The second time I went back I had a life to support at my old income level. One year of college racked up a $40k tab...an ex added another $20k to that tab. This was not a problem, just the cost of doing business UNTIL my mortgage company screwed up my credit by incorrectly (and still incorrectly reporting) that I was not making my mortgage payments. They put me into some HAMP program without any agreement on my part.

Once that happened my 6-7% fixed rate credit lines went to 24%, my interest amounts were more than my full payments. That was my 'CREDIT PROBLEM'.

However; I fucking rocked that problem by doing some personal growth, working my salary up and basically paid off everything in a year.

Despite how messed up you think my credit is I qualified for a used car loan of $39,000 without even needing a downpayment at 3.75% which also includes GAP.

I was able to buy a new car too, I'd have qualified for the 2% rate, but my wife wanted to do it in her name only so she paid about 4%...we are paying the car off in about 3 years away so rate is not so important.

All those issues came 10+ years after I left home.

 

[vi edit]

First, college has always been expensive. Your own argument that homes are at dual income levels is surprising as adults living with their parents is also having an affect at a lot of disposable income items. Housing is not so affected as many of these adults are still living at home 10+ years later and have nothing to show for it.

College prices have skyrocketed in the recent years. Much faster than in many other periods of time. A college I went to 12 years ago was about $17,000 a year. Now it's almost $30,000. My wife's college was $25,000 at the time and is now almost $40,000. State tuitions have doubled or tripled. But salaries have not.

As far as housing goes, most parents have a locked in mortgage or a house paid off by the time they have teenage kids/college age kids. It's not like they are taking kids income and upgrading. Or expecting that income 5..10...15...20 years earlier when they took out their home loan. Extra income in the house *now* has jack shit to do with the house price when it was originally bought.

 

[ManyBeers]

Tell your son to pull his pants up.

 

[alkemyst]

College prices have skyrocketed in the recent years. Much faster than in many other periods of time. A college I went to 12 years ago was about $17,000 a year. Now it's almost $30,000. My wife's college was $25,000 at the time and is now almost $40,000. State tuitions have doubled or tripled. But salaries have not.

As far as housing goes, most parents have a locked in mortgage or a house paid off by the time they have teenage kids/college age kids. It's not like they are taking kids income and upgrading. Or expecting that income 5..10...15...20 years earlier when they took out their home loan. Extra income in the house *now* has jack shit to do with the house price when it was originally bought.

Very few have paid off houses.

Salaries of those graduating from those schools should have improved quite a bit in 12 years, their parents maybe not so much.

I think it just sets the kid for failure. My parents were in no hurry to see me leave, I could move in with them at anytime if I had to...however; there is no way I am going to do that and if one relies on that or thinks it's ok....they will never take the proper chances in life to grow.

 

[DrPizza]

Are you concerned about Formosan termites? Since you're quite handy, renting a percussion drill, pump and injector to treat the soil below the slab and in the block wall cavities should be no problem. (obtaining termiticide may be however)

In the sticks you can probably find some unused chlordane, aldrin, or even dursban concentrate un used. As long as you're not near a cistern/well etc. it should be fine.

I'm in NY; formosan termites are in the South. Too cold of a climate up here for them. In fact, only once have I heard of someone with a termite problem (an old barn with a leaky roof.)


As far as living "with" his parents, essentially this turns the house into a duplex, with a shared laundry room/sun room between the two.