Double standards in sexual assaults

[Lucky]

As in, why is it OK to ask "Kobe should not have put himself in the position of being alone and having sexual relations with her accuser" as a rationalization for "he got what he deserved", yet when the situation is reversed and someone says the woman should not have put herself in position to get raped (by being flirty, provacative, whatever)...then that's taboo?

 

[djheater]

Originally posted by: Lucky
As in, why is it OK to ask "Kobe should not have put himself in the position of being alone and having sexual relations with her accuser" as a rationalization for "he got what he deserved", yet when the situation is reversed and someone says the woman should not have put herself in position to get raped (by being flirty, provacative, whatever)...then that's taboo?

Raping is something one does.

Being raped is somehting one has done to them.

 

[tcsenter]

Raping is something one does.

Being raped is something one has done to them.

Accusing of rape is something one does.

Being accused of rape is something one has done to them.

I told a woman the same thing when the topic of men by the dozens, going on hundreds nationally, being released from prison after DNA exonerated them of the rape charge on which they were convicted.

First, its not always the suggestion that the woman is lying. There have in fact been cases where it was unquestionable the woman was raped, because she was severely assaulted or injured, but rather that she was simply mistaken about the identity of the man who raped her. This may happen with or without the 'coaching' of police who engage in flawed or unethical victim interrogation and suspect identification methods.

I distinctly remember one case where it was the brother of the man ultimately sent to prison who actually committed the rape. The woman positively identified the suspect due to the resemblence and the police had ruled-out the real rapist because he had an alibi (which turned out to be false). Imagine your brother being a rapist and letting you rot in prison for 20 years for a rape he committed? There has to be an excusible homicide exception in there some where.

But yes, in addition to mistaken identity, women have in fact been known to lie about rape, for a number of motives. Why do people lie about anything?

On top of that, there are women suffering from mental illnesses which cause them to believe in delusions. There was a case on one of the TV court shows where a woman was suing a man for emotional distress, pain and suffering, because he forced himself on her but did not rape her. It turns out, the woman was under psychiatric care for some kind of paranoid/delusional disorder and she had falsely accused two other men of rape in the past.

This was only discovered because the defendent in this case was good friends with the manager of the apartments in which the woman lived. The manager knew of her psychiatric status and was aware of the prior rape allegations. He appeared as a character witness for the defendant. He informed the judge of the woman's psychiatric status, whereas the judge began the line of questioning which would ultimately lead to the woman admitting her psychiatric condition.

Now you can imagine what might have occurred had nobody knew of this woman's psychiatric status to tell the judge. She did not give the appearance of being mentally unstable at all. She seemed quite composed and rational. The woman was certainly not going to volunteer this information. Had nobody been present who was aware of her psychiatric problems, the man would have lost his ass in a heartbeat.

Anyway, the woman I was talking with said she had gotten drunk and high at a party and a man raped her while she was unable to intelligently defend herself (passed-out). I basically told her, sorry bout your damned luck. This is but one extremely good reason among many to not get sloppy-ass drunk unless your with trusted friends who have a lot better judgement than you.

She was pretty upset and insisted she was raped. I asked, "How do you know? Did you not just admit that you were so drunk and high that you were not in a rational state of mind? How do you know it was rape and not consentual?"

Her answer was because "I wouldn't have done that no matter how drunk I was." OK! Whatever!

So let's send a man to prison for 20 years based on these circumstances? Ummm...no.

 

[Heisenberg]

Well, I was going to add something, but tscenter pretty much covered it. :beer:

 

[cheapgoose]

I could've swore in Cali, having sex with a woman who is drunk, is considered rape.

 

[heartsurgeon]

you're making this all to complicated..

either he raped her (possible, but not proven yet)
or
she is crazy (in the absence of any facts, equally possible in my experience, but not yet proven)

young successful overpaid athletes certainly have committed rapes

young women certainly can be crazy (I believe that SHE believes she was raped, but whether that is a rational belief has to be proven)

the sad truth of the matter is that both parties are going to suffer financially and mentally, and nobody is going to come out of this a winner, no matter what the findings are.

remember also that the legal definition of the "truth" is what a preponderance of people believe to be true..that ought to scare every one of you...

 

[Mean MrMustard]

Originally posted by: cheapgoose
I could've swore in Cali, having sex with a woman who is drunk, is considered rape.

Umm, that would mean about 65% to 75% of all men in "Cali"* are rapists.

* - indicates that anyone (male) who has sex with a woman who is inebriated(sp.) (wife, girlfriend, or one-night stand) would be a rapist. This is (of course) regardless if she had a choice to drink.

 

[Scouzer]

Originally posted by: ELP

Originally posted by: cheapgoose
I could've swore in Cali, having sex with a woman who is drunk, is considered rape.

Umm, that would mean about 65% to 75% of all men in "Cali"* are rapists.

* - indicates that anyone (male) who has sex with a woman who is inebriated(sp.) (wife, girlfriend, or one-night stand) would be a rapist. This is (of course) regardless if she had a choice to drink.

Its bullsh!t, too. If both parties were intoxicated and mutually agreed for some drunk sexx0r, the guy is always wrong. If girls are equal, they should be liable for their drunken choices too. It should be 50/50.

I'm ONLY talking about when both people are drunk and agreed without any hesitation. Even then, guys are always blamed.

 

[MagicianBdotCom]

At least she got raped by Kobe Bryant... could've been worse. Some gilrs might want to have... j/k!! Lightening up the mood

 

[Geekbabe]

Originally posted by: Lucky
As in, why is it OK to ask "Kobe should not have put himself in the position of being alone and having sexual relations with her accuser" as a rationalization for "he got what he deserved", yet when the situation is reversed and someone says the woman should not have put herself in position to get raped (by being flirty, provacative, whatever)...then that's taboo?

Please,as this trial progresses Kobe's accuser will be nailed to the cross with nasty speculations of all types.Just look at this thread for openers!

she's not that hot

 

[Heisenberg]

Originally posted by: Geekbabe

Originally posted by: Lucky
As in, why is it OK to ask "Kobe should not have put himself in the position of being alone and having sexual relations with her accuser" as a rationalization for "he got what he deserved", yet when the situation is reversed and someone says the woman should not have put herself in position to get raped (by being flirty, provacative, whatever)...then that's taboo?

Please,as this trial progresses Kobe's accuser will be nailed to the cross with nasty speculations of all types.Just look at this thread for openers!

she's not that hot

Huh? He's still the one on trial. At worst, she gets some bad press. At worst, he gets prison time. I'm not commenting on his guilt or innocence, but let's not delude ourselves about who's butt is really on the line here.

 

[Pliablemoose]

Originally posted by: heartsurgeon
you're making this all to complicated..

either he raped her (possible, but not proven yet)
or
she is crazy (in the absence of any facts, equally possible in my experience, but not yet proven)

young successful overpaid athletes certainly have committed rapes

young women certainly can be crazy (I believe that SHE believes she was raped, but whether that is a rational belief has to be proven)

the sad truth of the matter is that both parties are going to suffer financially and mentally, and nobody is going to come out of this a winner, no matter what the findings are.

remember also that the legal definition of the "truth" is what a preponderance of people believe to be true..that ought to scare every one of you...

I have the funny feeling that the woman in question will not suffer financially.

IMHO, if I were a rich & successful athlete, I'd videotape all my sexual encounters and have the woman acknowledge she was being taped on tape.

Guilty or not, this will cost Kobe millions.

 

[Geekbabe]

Originally posted by: Heisenberg

Originally posted by: Geekbabe

Originally posted by: Lucky
As in, why is it OK to ask "Kobe should not have put himself in the position of being alone and having sexual relations with her accuser" as a rationalization for "he got what he deserved", yet when the situation is reversed and someone says the woman should not have put herself in position to get raped (by being flirty, provacative, whatever)...then that's taboo?

Please,as this trial progresses Kobe's accuser will be nailed to the cross with nasty speculations of all types.Just look at this thread for openers!

she's not that hot

Huh? He's still the one on trial. At worst, she gets some bad press. At worst, he gets prison time. I'm not commenting on his guilt or innocence, but let's not delude ourselves about who's butt is really on the line here.

Do you seriousy think having every aspect of your life open to the public to examine,speculate and gossip upon is a day at the beach? Kobe is a wealthy and powerful figure,he'll have an excellent,aggresive lawyer
who will do his damndest to discredit his accuser.Even if she wins her case in court,she still loses in terms of what's been taken from her by the publicity.Rape victim privacy shield laws help a bit but make no mistake,this woman and her past sexual history are now fair game for public scrutiny and condemation.

 

[Heisenberg]

Originally posted by: Geekbabe

Originally posted by: Heisenberg

Originally posted by: Geekbabe

Originally posted by: Lucky
As in, why is it OK to ask "Kobe should not have put himself in the position of being alone and having sexual relations with her accuser" as a rationalization for "he got what he deserved", yet when the situation is reversed and someone says the woman should not have put herself in position to get raped (by being flirty, provacative, whatever)...then that's taboo?

Please,as this trial progresses Kobe's accuser will be nailed to the cross with nasty speculations of all types.Just look at this thread for openers!

she's not that hot

Huh? He's still the one on trial. At worst, she gets some bad press. At worst, he gets prison time. I'm not commenting on his guilt or innocence, but let's not delude ourselves about who's butt is really on the line here.

Do you seriousy think having every aspect of your life open to the public to examine,speculate and gossip upon is a day at the beach? Kobe is a wealthy and powerful figure,he'll have an excellent,aggresive lawyer
who will do his damndest to discredit his accuser.Even if she wins her case in court,she still loses in terms of what's been taken from her by the publicity.

I agree it won't be a fun experience, but given the choice between that and prison time, I'd happily take the former. Besides, if the accusation is true, isn't that a small price to pay to have someone who assaulted you behind bars?

 

[Geekbabe]

Originally posted by: Heisenberg

Originally posted by: Geekbabe

Originally posted by: Heisenberg

Originally posted by: Geekbabe

Originally posted by: Lucky
As in, why is it OK to ask "Kobe should not have put himself in the position of being alone and having sexual relations with her accuser" as a rationalization for "he got what he deserved", yet when the situation is reversed and someone says the woman should not have put herself in position to get raped (by being flirty, provacative, whatever)...then that's taboo?

Please,as this trial progresses Kobe's accuser will be nailed to the cross with nasty speculations of all types.Just look at this thread for openers!

she's not that hot

Huh? He's still the one on trial. At worst, she gets some bad press. At worst, he gets prison time. I'm not commenting on his guilt or innocence, but let's not delude ourselves about who's butt is really on the line here.

Do you seriousy think having every aspect of your life open to the public to examine,speculate and gossip upon is a day at the beach? Kobe is a wealthy and powerful figure,he'll have an excellent,aggresive lawyer
who will do his damndest to discredit his accuser.Even if she wins her case in court,she still loses in terms of what's been taken from her by the publicity.

I agree it won't be a fun experience, but given the choice between that and prison time, I'd happily take the former. Besides, if the accusation is true, isn't that a small price to pay to have someone who assaulted you behind bars?

I actually think rape/sexual assault crimes are under reported and in a lot of cases aren't prosecuted even when reported because often the DA's office won't file charges in cases where they don't think they'll win.
ie: they wants lots of solid evidence and a victim with a very clean history.

The most common reaction to being violated is one of shame and humilation,very often the victim's family wants her to drop the issue rather than subject herself and the extended family to the public scrutiny of
a trial.

 

[Orsorum]

Originally posted by: Heisenberg
Well, I was going to add something, but tscenter pretty much covered it. :beer:

Pretty much.

 

[Heisenberg]

Originally posted by: Geekbabe
I actually think rape/sexual assault crimes are under reported and in a lot of cases aren't prosecuted even when reported because often the DA's office won't file charges in cases where they don't think they'll win.
ie: they wants lots of solid evidence and a victim with a very clean history.

The most common reaction to being violated is one of shame and humilation,very often the victim's family wants her to drop the issue rather than subject herself and the extended family to the public scrutiny of
a trial.

I'm sure a lot of cases are under reported. And proving rape is pretty tough, especially if the victim knew the person. Then you start to get into the question of what exactly constitutes rape or assault. It's a complicated problem and there aren't any easy solutions.

 

[Placer14]

Regardless of where everything stands, can you honestly tell me that this trial has nothing to do with Kobe's financial status? As far as this trial goes...Kobe could stands to lose MUCH more to this woman than she stands to lose to him...

Either way, I think she felt she had a shot at his money and even if that wasn't her sole objective, you KNOW it played a part in her decision to take this public.

 

[Isla]

n/m

 

[tcsenter]

Do you seriousy think having every aspect of your life open to the public to examine,speculate and gossip upon is a day at the beach? Kobe is a wealthy and powerful figure,he'll have an excellent,aggresive lawyer who will do his damndest to discredit his accuser. Even if she wins her case in court,she still loses in terms of what's been taken from her by the publicity. Rape victim privacy shield laws help a bit but make no mistake, this woman and her past sexual history are now fair game for public scrutiny and condemation.

lmao! Have you watched television in the past...oh...10 years? People go on talk shows and do this FOR ROUND TRIP FARE, TWO NIGHTS AT A HOTEL, AND A LIMO RIDE. Travel 1500 miles so they can tell their significant other in front of 50 million people they have genital warts or are a homosexual or are doing the mom and the daughter or bragging about how many sexually transmitted diseases they have contracted or how many dozens of partners they have slept with.

You don't believe there are a million who wouldn't put themselves in a degrading and humilitiating situation for much more? Degrading and humiliating to you and I, yes. You're presuming that we're dealing with people who possess an iota of decorum or dignity. The chance to say "I was raped by Kobe Bryant" alone is enough to tickle some sick fascination or obsession with fame or notoriety for some. There is no shortage of sick people out there.

A real rape victim would not likely put herself through that because she already feels degraded and humiliated enough. In fact, the more famous the individual accused, the more one has to be suspicious of the accuser's mental health.