Donald Trump: The Paragon of Genetic Inheritance

BonzaiDuck

Lifer
Jun 30, 2004
15,936
1,581
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Here's a link to an LA Times Op-Ed that I found irritating -- even disgusting.

Not irritated nor disgusted at D'Antonio, the author. Irritated and disgusted at his subject:

http://www.latimes.com/opinion/op-ed/la-oe-1203-dantonio-trump-race-horse-theory-20151203-story.html

He's got his whole family believing this tripe!

I've acquired some observations and facts over my lifetime. I "earned" my Mensa membership, but passing some tests isn't the last word about anything. I read somewhere else that there was a sizeable portion of Mensans earning poverty-level income, or collecting welfare.

Back in the '80s, a Georgia real-estate tycoon had published a book entitled "Mothers, Leadership and Success." it concluded that the "gains" attributable to innate inherited ability explained much less than environment, preparation, character, perseverance and other aspects.

If the author's analysis is in the ball-park, I only double-down on my view that this guy doesn't belong anywhere near the White House.

If I have a keen perception about Trump or anything else, if I have "insight," it was never an inheritable facet. I stayed in school until I was nearly 40. I read anything I could get my hands on. I put in 70-hour work-weeks over some 15 years. I would like to say, at this age, I own some degree of "wisdom."

Trump is an asshole now, and he'll be a President worthy of the term. Not a "term" in office, but the term "A-S-S-H-O-L-E."

Bush was merely stupid. Trump? He's an asshole!
 

Fern

Elite Member
Sep 30, 2003
26,907
173
106
Trump's usual over-the-top-hype notwithstanding, I see nothing but the old argument of nature vs. nurture.

Fern
 

BonzaiDuck

Lifer
Jun 30, 2004
15,936
1,581
126
Trump's usual over-the-top-hype notwithstanding, I see nothing but the old argument of nature vs. nurture.

Fern

In my list from the book, I failed to throw in a major factor . . . . LUCK. And the "high ground" of the checkerboard square from which one starts.

The man has a serious character flaw on top of his personality flaw, or the two go hand in hand.
 

Fern

Elite Member
Sep 30, 2003
26,907
173
106
In my list from the book, I failed to throw in a major factor . . . . LUCK. And the "high ground" of the checkerboard square from which one starts.

The man has a serious character flaw on top of his personality flaw, or the two go hand in hand.

Yeah. I think "luck" is often more important than many realize or wish to admit.

And in this person's case (Trump) being a member of the 'Lucky Gene Club' likely had a huge impact. There's not only the money, but his father was in the same business and no doubt taught him much that was useful as well as introduced him to many good 'connections'.

Typical case of 'being born on 3rd base and thinking you hit a home run'.

Fern
 

MongGrel

Lifer
Dec 3, 2013
38,466
3,067
121
I've never thought of Mensa as being a big deal myself.

Had at least 3 tests I passed that I could have, but I just never joined myself. I am not meaning to dismiss/demean Mensa in any way however.

That was not the intent.

I have seen my share of brilliant people that are not high money earners, or have fallen from grace academically in my lifetime.
 
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MongGrel

Lifer
Dec 3, 2013
38,466
3,067
121
Yeah. I think "luck" is often more important than many realize or wish to admit.

And in this person's case (Trump) being a member of the 'Lucky Gene Club' likely had a huge impact. There's not only the money, but his father was in the same business and no doubt taught him much that was useful as well as introduced him to many good 'connections'.

Typical case of 'being born on 3rd base and thinking you hit a home run'.

Fern

+1

Personally, I'd think it more the "Born with a Silver Spoon in my Mouth" club.

I've never really seen where he is too bright, other than he's had a large bank of lawyers/CPA's around him all his life ever since he was born.

Looks mostly like he just goes all Rush Limbaugh with a lot of money to me.

Visually, he appears like a baby crying most of the time to me.
 
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BonzaiDuck

Lifer
Jun 30, 2004
15,936
1,581
126
I've never thought of Mensa as being a big deal myself.

Had at least 3 tests I passed that I could have, but I just never joined myself.

I have seen my share of brilliant people that are not high money earners, or have fallen from grace academically in my lifetime.

They're just a buncha tests. If you learned to read at age 4 or 5, you get a head start. You can pretty much study for those tests.

My Indian-American insurance agent back in the late '70s talked me into sitting for those tests. That's all I did. I got my little yellow pin. I'd only brought it up to show that there are a lot of people out there who can match Trump.

As to Fern's remark. There is common-sense wisdom passed on from generation to generation. That stuff is important. To that, I can belabor why I'm challenged in street smarts. It wasn't there for me; it passed away when I was 9. And all my life, I was telling myself "Oh, it doesn't matter . . . it doesn't matter . . . "

But it does. Coming to grips with it "mattering" early in life -- probably helps. I didn't.

And I think this all goes to the idea about "class struggle." If you wipe your background from your mind as I seemed to have stuffed the first ten years of my life, you don't face the reality of where you came from. You could have "unreasonable expectations." With realistic expectations based on "where you came from," a person could actually do better than expected.
 

rudder

Lifer
Nov 9, 2000
19,441
86
91
Meh.... No difference than a sitting president who consistently spews fud from the White House and is egotistical enough to claim he would win a third term.

Hell... I would vote for trump just to make all the Obama fanbois understand what it is like to have a goofball in the White House. Whatever stupid crap trump would do I would just say but but Obama.
 

MongGrel

Lifer
Dec 3, 2013
38,466
3,067
121
They're just a buncha tests. If you learned to read at age 4 or 5, you get a head start. You can pretty much study for those tests.

My Indian-American insurance agent back in the late '70s talked me into sitting for those tests. That's all I did. I got my little yellow pin. I'd only brought it up to show that there are a lot of people out there who can match Trump.

As to Fern's remark. There is common-sense wisdom passed on from generation to generation. That stuff is important. To that, I can belabor why I'm challenged in street smarts. It wasn't there for me; it passed away when I was 9. And all my life, I was telling myself "Oh, it doesn't matter . . . it doesn't matter . . . "

But it does. Coming to grips with it "mattering" early in life -- probably helps. I didn't.

And I think this all goes to the idea about "class struggle." If you wipe your background from your mind as I seemed to have stuffed the first ten years of my life, you don't face the reality of where you came from. You could have "unreasonable expectations." With realistic expectations based on "where you came from," a person could actually do better than expected.

Never even bothered to study for one, I was eating books when I was young and was reading at about a Senior High school level around grade 4 I think. I used to read like everything in site, I just had CLEP and ASVAB tests that would have done it.

Doesn't matter really I guess, I never did get a degree personally.
 
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MongGrel

Lifer
Dec 3, 2013
38,466
3,067
121
Meh.... No difference than a sitting president who consistently spews fud from the White House and is egotistical enough to claim he would win a third term.

Hell... I would vote for trump just to make all the Obama fanbois understand what it is like to have a goofball in the White House. Whatever stupid crap trump would do I would just say but but Obama.

You, on the other hand, are a bit embarrassing to watch when you post sometimes.

I'm just saying.
 
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Charmonium

Lifer
May 15, 2015
10,055
3,211
136
Faith can be a powerful motivator. That includes having faith in your own superiority. If you really believe that you're better than everyone else, then when you fail, it's not your fault but other people or circumstances or bad luck, etc.

Think of it as Mr. Magoo syndrome. Even if you walk around virtually blind all of the time, you're eventually going to luck out and get where you're going - assuming that you don't get squashed by a passing vehicle in the meantime.

Success doesn't depend mainly on intelligence. It depends on being able to manipulate people into acting the way you want them to act. Sociopaths for example are notoriously good at doing this because they can act in whatever way they need to in order to elicit the desired response.

And growing up in an environment where you're exposed early on to the best ways of manipulating people gives you a distinct advantage that you then interpret as being an expression of how awesome you are. And to some extent you are awesome. Just not in the way that you believe.
 

MongGrel

Lifer
Dec 3, 2013
38,466
3,067
121
Faith can be a powerful motivator. That includes having faith in your own superiority. If you really believe that you're better than everyone else, then when you fail, it's not your fault but other people or circumstances or bad luck, etc.

Think of it as Mr. Magoo syndrome. Even if you walk around virtually blind all of the time, you're eventually going to luck out and get where you're going - assuming that you don't get squashed by a passing vehicle in the meantime.

Success doesn't depend mainly on intelligence. It depends on being able to manipulate people into acting the way you want them to act. Sociopaths for example are notoriously good at doing this because they can act in whatever way they need to in order to elicit the desired response.

And growing up in an environment where you're exposed early on to the best ways of manipulating people gives you a distinct advantage that you then interpret as being an expression of how awesome you are. And to some extent you are awesome. Just not in the way that you believe.

Many valid points right there.

Personally I grew up hating manipulative people from a young age, and that wouldn't be just your average childhood things.

I won't dwell on it, but it probably affected me later in life as far as seeing it happening in a work environment and despising it when it is occurring, even when not to myself.

Just rambling myself a bit about that at this point, I'll let it just sit there.
 

Greenman

Lifer
Oct 15, 1999
21,106
5,695
136
Here's a link to an LA Times Op-Ed that I found irritating -- even disgusting.

Not irritated nor disgusted at D'Antonio, the author. Irritated and disgusted at his subject:

http://www.latimes.com/opinion/op-ed/la-oe-1203-dantonio-trump-race-horse-theory-20151203-story.html

He's got his whole family believing this tripe!

I've acquired some observations and facts over my lifetime. I "earned" my Mensa membership, but passing some tests isn't the last word about anything. I read somewhere else that there was a sizeable portion of Mensans earning poverty-level income, or collecting welfare.

Back in the '80s, a Georgia real-estate tycoon had published a book entitled "Mothers, Leadership and Success." it concluded that the "gains" attributable to innate inherited ability explained much less than environment, preparation, character, perseverance and other aspects.

If the author's analysis is in the ball-park, I only double-down on my view that this guy doesn't belong anywhere near the White House.

If I have a keen perception about Trump or anything else, if I have "insight," it was never an inheritable facet. I stayed in school until I was nearly 40. I read anything I could get my hands on. I put in 70-hour work-weeks over some 15 years. I would like to say, at this age, I own some degree of "wisdom."

Trump is an asshole now, and he'll be a President worthy of the term. Not a "term" in office, but the term "A-S-S-H-O-L-E."

Bush was merely stupid. Trump? He's an asshole!

For all your hard work and accomplishment, you're views are still driven by emotion.
 

mizzou

Diamond Member
Jan 2, 2008
9,734
54
91
posting in a pasive brag thread which will soon devolve into poverty level $100k salaries in new york city and 2015 luxory sedan complaints
 

Blanky

Platinum Member
Oct 18, 2014
2,457
12
46
There is no denying he is wildly successful at business in ways that cannot just be taught. He is at the top tier of leadership in the country.

I enjoy his lack of political correctness and honesty, yet at the same time he does lie a lot in other ways.

I found him interesting at first but would now be opposed to him being in the white house, just because he crosses the red line on a few issues, such as mass deportation of millions of people, registration of a religion group (fucking insane), endorsement of torture, etc.
 

BonzaiDuck

Lifer
Jun 30, 2004
15,936
1,581
126
For all your hard work and accomplishment, you're views are still driven by emotion.

Actually that's a good point -- that emotion is a general factor among a lot of voters.

It was a mistake to personalize my argument that way. But for all my personal shortcomings -- and I have many -- I've observed that we live in a world where Chaos masquerades as Order, and we use simplistic measuring sticks in evaluating celebrities and politicians as if Order prevails.

I'll still stand by my original point, though. There's certainly some variation of attitudes among "Two-percenters," although one might compare the distribution between that group and The Great Unwashed.

But Trump's beliefs and attitudes can't be ignored. He's downplayed his checkerboard-square starting point of advantage, attributing it to "DNA."

And again -- it only shows that he's bloated in being "full of himself."

I don't see that as an emotional reaction. it's just an observation.

Further, D'Antonio's "analysis only points up what we might have inferred or deduced all along about Trump.
 

Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
73,446
6,409
126
There is no denying he is wildly successful at business in ways that cannot just be taught. He is at the top tier of leadership in the country.

I enjoy his lack of political correctness and honesty, yet at the same time he does lie a lot in other ways.

I found him interesting at first but would now be opposed to him being in the white house, just because he crosses the red line on a few issues, such as mass deportation of millions of people, registration of a religion group (fucking insane), endorsement of torture, etc.

Yup, there are certain lines that when crossed you can't come back from. As much as I believe that Trump's OK, I can't any
longer take a chance. Bernie is the only guy left in the race.
 

trenchfoot

Lifer
Aug 5, 2000
15,093
7,621
136
Trump: A book with brightly gilded covers in 24K, a flourishing prologue and 500 blank pages in-between.
 

Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
73,446
6,409
126
You, on the other hand, are a bit embarrassing to watch when you post sometimes.

I'm just saying.

Embarrassing for you and other normal people, but not to CBDs. The CBD is caused by being shamed to conform as a child and shame is something they are now terrified they will be made to feel, something they would rather die than let happen. Your target here, just to prove the point, would rather self emulate by voting for trump than see he's totally deluded about Obama. Mostly, he just makes me sad. I have to read his posts, but he lives in his skin. Jesus save him. ;)
 

OverVolt

Lifer
Aug 31, 2002
14,278
89
91
Here's a link to an LA Times Op-Ed that I found irritating -- even disgusting.

Not irritated nor disgusted at D'Antonio, the author. Irritated and disgusted at his subject:

http://www.latimes.com/opinion/op-ed/la-oe-1203-dantonio-trump-race-horse-theory-20151203-story.html

He's got his whole family believing this tripe!

I've acquired some observations and facts over my lifetime. I "earned" my Mensa membership, but passing some tests isn't the last word about anything. I read somewhere else that there was a sizeable portion of Mensans earning poverty-level income, or collecting welfare.

Back in the '80s, a Georgia real-estate tycoon had published a book entitled "Mothers, Leadership and Success." it concluded that the "gains" attributable to innate inherited ability explained much less than environment, preparation, character, perseverance and other aspects.

If the author's analysis is in the ball-park, I only double-down on my view that this guy doesn't belong anywhere near the White House.

If I have a keen perception about Trump or anything else, if I have "insight," it was never an inheritable facet. I stayed in school until I was nearly 40. I read anything I could get my hands on. I put in 70-hour work-weeks over some 15 years. I would like to say, at this age, I own some degree of "wisdom."

Trump is an asshole now, and he'll be a President worthy of the term. Not a "term" in office, but the term "A-S-S-H-O-L-E."

Bush was merely stupid. Trump? He's an asshole!

But humans shape their environment, which is a function of the genetic influence on behavior.

People who are more inclined to keep wealth within the family then have children who I believe are also more inclined to keep wealth within the family and it snowballs from there as their capital yields returns. You see this as an environmental factor but I also think its a genetic factor over generations.

My family doesn't have much generational wealth and surprise surprise, my parents are mis-handling their assets into retirement.
 
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BonzaiDuck

Lifer
Jun 30, 2004
15,936
1,581
126
Yup, there are certain lines that when crossed you can't come back from. As much as I believe that Trump's OK, I can't any
longer take a chance. Bernie is the only guy left in the race.

Also referring to the post to which you respond . . .

I was a fence-sitter for much of my life. For a while, I was contributing money to the GOP. But I was always liberal in the sense that Colin Powell or Elliot Richardson were "liberal." Powell put it this way: "Americans should have those things provided publicly that they want provided publicly." Richardson paralleled my view of "big" government and the public service: (a) "It's a big country," and (b) "Why not the best?"

I saw a sharp contrast between Obama and his predecessor-disaster. I stick by my choice. And I made that choice in 2007, when so-called "liberal" colleagues were telling me "Oh, no! The Dems f***ed us! The Black guy can't win!" And I was appalled by their thinking and attitude.

Trump made a big circus over the Birther nonsense. And while I was indifferently tolerant during much of my life, I've got an idea for a double bumper-sticker showing how I feel now:

Sticker #1: "Vote GOP and need emergency road-side assistance?"
Sticker #2: "No problem -- show me your birth certificate or go f*** yourself."

All my life, I've had this underlying belief that the Truth was more important than America, because America should be based on the Truth.

People wonder about Trump and Cruz and their Ivy League educations, or they speak about them.

To me, it doesn't make a hilla-beans difference where they went to school or how much schooling they have, if they play with the facts and promote all the Falsehood drivel in their palaver.

So -- yeah -- Show me your birth certificate. [Moonbeam's exempt.]
 

BonzaiDuck

Lifer
Jun 30, 2004
15,936
1,581
126
But humans shape their environment, which is a function of the genetic influence on behavior.

People who are more inclined to keep wealth within the family then have children who I believe are also more inclined to keep wealth within the family and it snowballs from there as their capital yields returns. You see this as an environmental factor but I also think its a genetic factor over generations.

My family doesn't have much generational wealth and surprise surprise, my parents are mis-handling their assets into retirement.

You know, I think that if people devote themselves solely to the task of making money and accumulating wealth -- they are likely to succeed in making money and accumulating wealth.

But there are many other worthy goals for a life, and some of those goals may attenuate wealth accumulation. And that's why I think you'll find more dummies in the wealth-accumulating category than you would expect.

It's a pretty simplistic ambition, and in pursuing it, there may be a lot less room in a person's daily thinking for other matters or even common-sense pursuits.

I think, if you're going to use that measuring stick and support somebody who could simply ask Daddy for a $1 million loan to start a business and get it, you're shorting your own self-interest if you couldn't do the same yourself.

With Trump, that issue would matter less if he weren't such a pandering jackass. It could boil down to who you can tolerate seeing on your TV weekly to offer up Oval Office chats.

It isn't Trump's money that I hate. I hate Trump because of his character, his personality, his pandering, his narcissism -- and for being a capital jackass.
 
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WHAMPOM

Diamond Member
Feb 28, 2006
7,628
183
106
Meh.... No difference than a sitting president who consistently spews fud from the White House and is egotistical enough to claim he would win a third term.

Hell... I would vote for trump just to make all the Obama fanbois understand what it is like to have a goofball in the White House. Whatever stupid crap trump would do I would just say but but Obama.

Why do youbring up Ronald Reagan?
 

Ancalagon44

Diamond Member
Feb 17, 2010
3,274
202
106
The way I think of this is that I refer to it as the lottery of your birth.

A number of things are completely random when you are born - the parents who will raise you, the genetic code you inherit, when you are born, where you are born, the environment in you grow up in.

All of that is completely out of control - you don't choose any of it. You get born into your circumstances.

As for hard work - what makes somebody a hard worker? Is it something they choose to do? No, I don't think it is. Those who think they are hard workers - make a conscious effort to stop being such a hard worker. Just for one week, slack off as much as you can. I bet it will be pretty difficult.

In other words, the things that led you to being the hard worker you are were not choices you made, but circumstances out of your control. As above, things like your genetic code, your parents and your environment.

So, Trump is right in a sense - the reason he is as successful as he is is because he was born with it. The right combination of genetics, environment, parents, time and place to be successful. The same with Bill Gates. Neither of them really chose their lives, if you really think about it.
 

thraashman

Lifer
Apr 10, 2000
11,108
1,575
126
It's impossible for a sane human being to not want to see this man punched in the face.