Does a grocery store have the right to refuse out of state IDs for alcohol purchases?

[Jittles]

I'm an Alaska resident, 21 years old, and I go to school at Cal Poly in California. Recently the police department told all the stores around town, Albertsons and Rite-Aid to be specific, that they can't accept any out of state ID for alcohol purchases. I know this is obviously because there's so many college kids around that fake IDs are probably a pretty big problem, but it just seems weird that they can deny me service based solely on the fact that I'm holding an out of state ID.

So... any legal experts or otherwise know if this is completely legit? If it's not I want to have some sort of basis to lodge a complaint so I can buy myself booze which I can legally buy in this state because I'm 21 years old.

The only thing that makes me think otherwise is that I believe I can go to the DMV and get myself a California ID card. I have no transportation down here and it'd be a much bigger trouble than I want to go through to get, as I'm sure I'd need proof of identity such as a social security card or birth certificate, both of which are at my parents' house in Alaska.

 

[swtethan]

we reserve the right to refuse service to anyone.... ever heard of THAT?

 

[hjo3]

AFAIK, private businesses can refuse service to people for virtually any reason they want. Government-run liquor stores might be another kettle of fish.

 

[Mo0o]

Originally posted by: swtethan
we reserve the right to refuse service to anyone.... ever heard of THAT?

Yep, they dont gotta sell you sh1t

 

[BlancoNino]

If that's the law then the police can tell grocers they "can't" sell to those with out-of-state ID's. If that's not the law, then the police can only ask grocers not to sell alcohol to those with out-of-state ID's and a lot of them will comply. Our city has asked retailers not to sell spray paint to those under 21 and stores are actually following through with it even though they don't have to. It's really pissed off a lot of my friends who do body work on their cars.

Edit: And yes, any store has the right to refuse service to anyone, however they wouldn't just turn away business from good paying customers for no reason.

 

[doze]

It depends on the store, it has happened to me in several different places generally near college campuses. I doubt you need a SS card or birth cert. to get a cali. drivers license. Think about all the non US citizens who have one. Your Alaska license and a phone bill or something proving that you live in Cali. is probably all you need.

 

[Jittles]

Originally posted by: BlancoNino
If that's the law then the police can tell grocers they "can't" sell to those with out-of-state ID's. If that's not the law, then the police can only ask grocers not to sell alcohol to those with out-of-state ID's and a lot of them will comply. Our city has asked retailers not to sell spray paint to those under 21 and stores are actually following through with it even though they don't have to. It's really pissed off a lot of my friends who do body work on their cars.

Edit: And yes, any store has the right to refuse service to anyone, however they wouldn't just turn away business from good paying customers for no reason.

This makes sense... They're just "asking" that they not sell booze to out of state ids, and because they're just asking, it falls under the right to refuse service deal.

And to think, I specifically got rid of my old laminated license when Alaska finally switched over to the scannable printed-on white card version so I wouldn't be denied down at school for having such a fake looking ID.

 

[HendrixFan]

The reason we refuse (where I work) is that none of the checkout clerks nor the managers are experienced enough with any or all of the other 49 states to know if its fake. They are all required (by the state) to take a 4 hour class every two years to know what a Texas ID looks like and how to tell if its fake. Since they arent trained for other states, the company doesnt allow it.

Of course, for those who look 28 or older, we dont have to card them, so it doesnt matter what state their ID is from.

 

[tommywishbone]

When that happens, just steal the booze. You tried to pay. F'em.

 

[tjalan1960]

Whoever tells you that the crap about "we reserve the right to refuse service to anyone" is valid is a moron. No business can refuse to serve you without a valid reason for it. The civil rights act of 1964 specifically prohibits such establishments as restaurants, grocery stores etc, from refusing to serve people based on race, national origin, religion and so on. Additionally, in most cases the courts will rule against establishments that refuse to serve a customer for reasons that are arbitrary and capricious. I am a paralegal so I am very well educated in federal and state legislation in this area. Fight back and DO NOT listen to morons who say things based on absolute ignorance. Good luck.

 

[MagnusTheBrewer]

Whoever tells you that the crap about "we reserve the right to refuse service to anyone" is valid is a moron. No business can refuse to serve you without a valid reason for it. The civil rights act of 1964 specifically prohibits such establishments as restaurants, grocery stores etc, from refusing to serve people based on race, national origin, religion and so on. Additionally, in most cases the courts will rule against establishments that refuse to serve a customer for reasons that are arbitrary and capricious. I am a paralegal so I am very well educated in federal and state legislation in this area. Fight back and DO NOT listen to morons who say things based on absolute ignorance. Good luck.

Welcome and WWYBYWB? Stores can discriminate based on age due to lack of acceptable identification. It is not a protected class and, as a paralegal, you should know this. Shame on you. I've got nothing against 'fighting the man' but, you need to pick battles you can win.

 

[Six]

Welcome and WWYBYWB? Stores can discriminate based on age due to lack of acceptable identification. It is not a protected class and, as a paralegal, you should know this. Shame on you. I've got nothing against 'fighting the man' but, you need to pick battles you can win.

HA HA...owned!

My business law professor said the same thing...it's not a protected class.

 

[BoomerD]

Holy shit...necro'd.

 

[vi edit]

The reason we refuse (where I work) is that none of the checkout clerks nor the managers are experienced enough with any or all of the other 49 states to know if its fake. They are all required (by the state) to take a 4 hour class every two years to know what a Texas ID looks like and how to tell if its fake. Since they arent trained for other states, the company doesnt allow it.

Of course, for those who look 28 or older, we dont have to card them, so it doesnt matter what state their ID is from.

HEB? I was 28 and visited San Antonio and the HEB there refused to honor my IL license. No beer for me

 

[tjalan1960]

<spam?>

Another moron. Check you case histories moron. Shepardize some cases and educate yourself. You seem like the type who would tell a pilot how to fly a plane when you've never flown one. In any event, a VALID state drivers license IS acceptable identification. Think about it for just a second and if you have just half a brain you will realize that American citizens go on vacation to other states ALL THE TIME!!!! Do you really think they all go to the motor vehicle department every time they hit a new state to get the id for that state to stay for a week? Don't be stupid. Of course they don't. I'm done educating you. Go to school like I did and stop spreading misinformation. PLEASE. There is enough ignorance in America alread without people like you spreading more.

 

[tjalan1960]

Opinions are like assholes everyone hase one and it usually stinks. Read this morons who have done absolutely NO research on this topic.

Does a Restaurant Have the Unrestricted Right to Refuse Service to Specific Patrons?

No. The Civil Rights Act of 1964 explicitly prohibits restaurants from refusing service to patrons on the basis of race, color, religion, or natural origin. In addition, most courts don&#8217;t allow restaurants to refuse service to patrons based on extremely arbitrary conditions. For example, a person likely can&#8217;t be refused service due to having a lazy eye.
But Aren&#8217;t Restaurants Considered Private Property?

Yes, however they are also considered places of public accommodation. In other words, the primary purpose of a restaurant is to sell food to the general public, which necessarily requires susceptibility to<link removed> Therefore, a restaurant&#8217;s existence as private property does not excuse an unjustified refusal of service. This can be contrasted to a nightclub, which usually caters itself to a specific group of clientele based on age and social status.
So Are &#8220;We Reserve the Right to Refuse Service to Anyone&#8221; Signs in Restaurants Legal?

Yes, however they still do not give a restaurant the power to refuse service on the basis of race, color, religion, or natural origin. These signs also do not preclude a court from finding other arbitrary refusals of service to be discriminatory. Simply put, restaurants that carry a &#8220;Right to Refuse Service&#8221; sign are subject to the same laws as restaurants without one.
What Conditions Allow a Restaurant to Refuse Service?

There a number of legitimate reasons for a restaurant to refuse service, some of which include:

• Patrons who are unreasonably rowdy or causing trouble
• Patrons that may overfill capacity if let in
• Patrons who come in just before closing time or when the kitchen is closed
• Patrons accompanied by large groups of non-customers looking to sit in
• Patrons lacking adequate hygiene (e.g. excess dirt, extreme body odor, etc.)

In most cases, refusal of service is warranted where a customer&#8217;s presence in the restaurant detracts from the safety, welfare, and well-being of other patrons and the restaurant itself.

 

[vi edit]

Another moron. Check you case histories moron. Shepardize some cases and educate yourself. You seem like the type who would tell a pilot how to fly a plane when you've never flown one. In any event, a VALID state drivers license IS acceptable identification. Think about it for just a second and if you have just half a brain you will realize that American citizens go on vacation to other states ALL THE TIME!!!! Do you really think they all go to the motor vehicle department every time they hit a new state to get the id for that state to stay for a week? Don't be stupid. Of course they don't. I'm done educating you. Go to school like I did and stop spreading misinformation. PLEASE. There is enough ignorance in America alread without people like you spreading more.

You insult people, tell them to read up and then post a link to a site that has no relevant information to the topic at hand. All it says is that restaurants can't refuse based on protected classes. Age is not one of them in this case.

You either are terrible at comprehension, or simply a subtle shill for the link you posted.

 

[tjalan1960]

If an establishment refuses you service and YOU ALLOW IT, that's on you. If someone cracks you in the head and you allow it, that's your choice. Most people are ignorant and they do not fight back. You DO have legal recourse if an establishment ARBITRARILY and CAPRICIOUSLY (and you have to know what those words actually mean) refuses to serve you, you can sue the crap out of them. I have done it successfully. These idiots are telling you their OPINIONS. Their opinions in this matter are worthless because they are simply wrong. Start with a formal letter of intent to sue based on discrimination and watch how quickly you get service. Have a great night.

 

[tjalan1960]

If there was a trophy for lack of comprehension, you would have the biggest trophy on the planet moron. I SAID arbitrary and capricious reasons for refusing service have been settled in courts of law repeatedly. Jeeeezzzzz!!! What an idiot.

 

[Six]

Sorry...I'd rather believe a business law professor who has made millions over....what looks like a chain mail.

 

[MagnusTheBrewer]

Another moron. Check you case histories moron. Shepardize some cases and educate yourself. You seem like the type who would tell a pilot how to fly a plane when you've never flown one. In any event, a VALID state drivers license IS acceptable identification. Think about it for just a second and if you have just half a brain you will realize that American citizens go on vacation to other states ALL THE TIME!!!! Do you really think they all go to the motor vehicle department every time they hit a new state to get the id for that state to stay for a week? Don't be stupid. Of course they don't. I'm done educating you. Go to school like I did and stop spreading misinformation. PLEASE. There is enough ignorance in America alread without people like you spreading more.

As you say, "a VALID state drivers license IS acceptable identification." However, employees of grocery and liquor stores are under no obligation to validate it. Are you suggesting a denied customer from another State take them to court? Bwahahahahahahahahahaha!

First, they still won't get any booze on the night in question.
Second, they will pay for legal representation.
Third, if they escape getting a judge who sees the case as frivolous and dismissed out of hand, they will probably win.
Fourth, when they return to the store after winning their court case and get a different clerk who knows nothing about it, they still won't get any booze.
Fifth, you actually advise people on legal issues? :biggrin:

 

[Capt Caveman]

Another moron. Check you case histories moron. Shepardize some cases and educate yourself. You seem like the type who would tell a pilot how to fly a plane when you've never flown one. In any event, a VALID state drivers license IS acceptable identification. Think about it for just a second and if you have just half a brain you will realize that American citizens go on vacation to other states ALL THE TIME!!!! Do you really think they all go to the motor vehicle department every time they hit a new state to get the id for that state to stay for a week? Don't be stupid. Of course they don't. I'm done educating you. Go to school like I did and stop spreading misinformation. PLEASE. There is enough ignorance in America alread without people like you spreading more.

Moron. Age is not a protected class.

So Are &#8220;We Reserve the Right to Refuse Service to Anyone&#8221; Signs in Restaurants Legal?

Yes, however they still do not give a restaurant the power to refuse service on the basis of race, color, religion, or natural origin.

Again, liquor stores can refuse to service customers with out of state licenses. For a noob, you're a noob.

 

[Dr. Zaus]

Responding honestly to a necro thread by an RPM/iPod salesman is what's illegal.

 

[FallenHero]

You insult people, tell them to read up and then post a link to a site that has no relevant information to the topic at hand. All it says is that restaurants can't refuse based on protected classes. Age is not one of them in this case.

You either are terrible at comprehension, or simply a subtle shill for the link you posted.

He sounds like someone who JUST got his paralegal edumication and is attempting (and failing) to show it off.

 

[tjalan1960]

Let me speak slowly so all you low forehead people can understand this. If you are from Canada, and a store will not sell you beer, they are discrimination against you based on NATIONAL ORIGIN!!!! Da. Being from Canada cannot be held against you. The federal law supercedes the grocery store rules idiot. My god!!! I cannot believe how stupid you people are.