Do you think it was a mistake for the military to stop discriminating?

[Anarchist420]

It only made the state more powerful because it allowed more people to enlist, stay in, and die/get injured as well. Being allowed to serve in the military is the antithesis of a right.

100% equality before the law in a Republic or a monarchy is not possible and decreases liberty in certain cases. That said, in the cases in which equality before the law decreases liberty, equality before the law needs to be worked against.

I have nothing against gays or straights, but we'd be better off if at least one of them was banned from military service... we'd be best off if both, as well as if bisexuals, non-sexuals (asexuals), and people who weren't sure were all banned from military service.

 

[Mixolydian]

What does discrimination accomplish, exactly?

 

[Geosurface]

On my submarine we had a handful of gay guys, and they fit in fine and there was no problem.

 

[Steeplerot]

LOL, hate to break it to you, but war and buggery go back to the beginning of time.

You cannot have one without the other. It's a overstimulated testosterone power trip thing.

The more overcompensation with masculinity/homophobia a guy has in public the faster he will be slobbing some other dudes knob after a 12 pack with the boys. Watch your 6.

 

[nehalem256]

I think we should just privatize the military. That way the next time some Neocons want to invade a ME country we wont have to listen to a bunch of whining hippies.

Only those who support the invasion will be required to pay. They can pool their money and hire Blackwater to do the job.

Think of the increased efficiency which will be brought about by the free market if various mercenary companies are forced to compete with each other!

 

[Steeplerot]

Think of the increased efficiency which will be brought about by the free market if various mercenary companies are forced to compete with each other!

Yes, knowing these cheap labor capitalists they will hire the taliban to save a quick buck.

Which is how in a twisted way the whole Afganistan thing started.

You righties are genius, you know that? We can fight our OWN army. On the cheap. Think of the profits!

 

[Moonbeam]

I remember reading a story a naturalist told about something he observed in the jungle. A leopard began to stalk a baboon troupe. Two young males dropped back in wait. They attacked the leopard and were killed almost instantly, but not before one tore open the leopards throat which then bled to death.

 

[MrColin]

I think we should just privatize the military. That way the next time some Neocons want to invade a ME country we wont have to listen to a bunch of whining hippies.

Only those who support the invasion will be required to pay. They can pool their money and hire Blackwater to do the job.

Think of the increased efficiency which will be brought about by the free market if various mercenary companies are forced to compete with each other!

This is an excellent idea. This socialized war profiteering has bankrupted our government already.

About the gays, the strongest argument against discrimination was that they will get in anyway or discover their orientation after enlisting. In a discriminatory environment, they become susceptible to extortion, creating a major security vulnerability.

About women, I believe they have a place in the military, but not as combatants. Accounts from women who have served (related to me personally and in the press) support this view. Women who enlist and serve without getting raped at least once are the exception from what I hear. Some of them just enjoy it so they don't feel it was rape while other women having the same experience are seriously traumatized.

 

[OCGuy]

WTF is this thread about? DADT being repealed didnt add more gay people to the military, they were already there.


Why is this guy still allowed to make threads?

 

[blankslate]

LOL, hate to break it to you, but war and buggery go back to the beginning of time. You cannot have one without the other.
It's a overstimulated testosterone power trip thing.

The more overcompensation with masculinity/homophobia a guy has in public the faster he will be slobbing some other dudes knob after a 12 pack with the boys. Watch your 6.

or as it was put more humorously here...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1CQg9f7z9eg

If you're homophobic your probably (80% chance of being aroused by gay porn) gay.

a psychology study is referenced at about 1 min. 30. seconds into the comedy bit.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

WTF is this thread about?

Here's my snap analysis.

1) He's anti-government.
2) The military is a subset of government.
3) Removing an obstacle to enlistment potentially increases the size of 2, which increases the size of 1
4) Ending discrimination against gays removes one block to this.


Therefore:
Ending discrimination can allow gays to enlist.
That increases the potential for the increase of government.
That works against his ideology which is against that which supports anything related to government.

Conclusion.
Discrimination is good (and probably other violations of civil liberties as well) providing it prevents any government entity from having a deeper pool of resources.

 

[CrackRabbit]

Here's my snap analysis.

1) He's anti-government.
2) The military is a subset of government.
3) Removing an obstacle to enlistment potentially increases the size of 2, which increases the size of 1
4) Ending discrimination against gays removes one block to this.


Therefore:
Ending discrimination can allow gays to enlist.
That increases the potential for the increase of government.
That works against his ideology which is against that which supports anything related to government.

Conclusion.
Discrimination is good (and probably other violations of civil liberties as well) providing it prevents any government entity from having a deeper pool of resources.

Good analysis!
Here's the Cliff Notes version: Anarchist420 is an idiot.

 

[Anarchist420]

LOL, hate to break it to you, but war and buggery go back to the beginning of time. You cannot have one without the other. It's a overstimulated testosterone power trip thing.

War go back to the beginning of states and to uneducated tribes who were statist but didn't realize it. If there was no state, then there would be less war. As for Caesar-like behaviour, I'll admit that point almost nullifies my argument (about arbitrarily banning groups based upon their sexual orientation), due to what I've heard and due to what I understand about testosterone. Still, maybe if there was discrimination in the military (like segregation), then fewer people would join it. I mean, why would Truman's racist hateful ass want black people to be better off? The answer is that he didn't, he just wanted to increase the size of the military and to have a bigger pool to pick from in the future... kind of like how Lieberman championed repeal of DADT so even more people would be tricked into serving assholes like him. I don't understand how the average IQ of people in the military is around the population average because most of them do the dumbest shit. I'm not saying that all people who were in the military are awful and I admire many veterans for being far more intelligent than myself, but I can't understand how they could feel okay with what they do and they're going to hell if it exists for killing all of those innocent brown people.

 

[Steeplerot]

or as it was put more humorously here...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1CQg9f7z9eg

If you're homophobic your probably (80% chance of being aroused by gay porn) gay.

a psychology study is referenced at about 1 min. 30. seconds into the comedy bit.

Sometimes I wonder if the modern Republican power structure is really a bunch of down low gay dudes making complete asses out of the ignorant bigots all over rural America. I would actually kinda feel far better about America if this was true.

Can you imagine the convention where the GOP comes out with the rainbow streamers...SURPRISE!!! *The social conservatives sit there staring blanky* "I dont get it?" -They never will.

It's the only rational explanation for the GOP I can find logically.

*I came up with this theory while sitting reading this insane statistic that the only neighborhood that votes GOP in San Francisco is the...Castro!

Now all the Republicans being outed made some sense. It must be a meat market to be a Republican with all these 'phobes. Such easy 'pickins!

 

[OCGuy]

Sometimes I wonder if the modern Republican power structure is really a bunch of down low gay dudes making complete asses out of the ignorant bigots all over rural America. I would actually kindafeel far better about America if this was true.

Can you imagine the convention where the GOP comes out with teh rainbow streamers...SURPRISE!!! *The social conservatives sit there staring blanky* "I dont get it?" -They never will.

It's the only rational explanation for the GOP I can find logically.

I really hate to keep shitting on your thinly-veiled constant attack on white people, but blacks and hispanics (and muslims) are far less intolerant in regards to homosexuality.

Something tells me that you knew this already.

 

[Steeplerot]

I really hate to keep shitting on your thinly-veiled constant attack on white people, but blacks and hispanics (and muslims) are far less intolerant in regards to homosexuality.

Something tells me that you knew this already.

Yes, because of the socioeconomic situation at the bottom of the food chain of capitalism the reality is they tend to have a larger number of religious and quite a few uneducated. Thus they have more reactionary folks easily manipulated. We call this trend the lupenproletariat in socialist terms.

The underclasses of capitalism are always pit against each other in the worst ways, and because of their disadvantage in a society they unfortunately usually fall for it. (what else do you have to lose when you are hopeless with no future but the hope of a god to save you or reactionaryism -or drugs/booze)?) I literally live next to skid row. This is a daily reality for myself in helping people.

 

[OCGuy]

Yes, because of minorites socioeconomic situation the reality is they tend to have a larger number of religious and quite a few uneducated. Thus they have more reactionary folks easily manipulated. We call this trend the lupenproletariat in socialist terms.

The underclasses of capitalism are always pit against each other in the worst ways, and because of their disadvantage in a society they unfortunately usually fall for it. (what else do you have to lose when you are hopeless with no future but the hope of a god to save you or reactionaryism -or drugs/booze)?) I literally live next to skid row. This is a daily reality for myself in helping people.

Are you saying that the majority of the far-right Republicans in the Red states aren't poor and religious too?

You just proved my point, it isn't about race or political party, it is about religious indoctrination and cultural pressue.

 

[Steeplerot]

it isn't about race or political party, it is about religious indoctrination and cultural pressue.

Which stems from poverty. That's the reality right wingers cannot grasp and would rather blame the victim to keep up their pseudo religious moralist chip on their shoulder about others not "pulling themselves up by the bootstraps" -its the same social darwinist mindset as younger homeless guys robbing a disabled person who cannot get up anymore and lie dying on the street.

 

[OCGuy]

Which stems from poverty. That's the reality right wingers cannot grasp and would rather blame the victim to keep up their pseudo religious moralist chip on their shoulder about others not "pulling themselves up by the bootstraps" -its the same social darwinist mindset as younger homeless guys robbing a disabled person who cannot get up anymore and lie dying on the street.

Yes, and much of the (R) base lives in poverty right alongside the (D) base. Unless you think the trailer park full of meth labs is somehow more glamorous than the projects full of crack heads.

 

[Steeplerot]

Yes, and much of the (R) base lives in poverty right alongside the (D) base. Unless you think the trailer park full of meth labs is somehow more glamorous than the projects full of crack heads.

Then you are leveling the playing field, of the two groups I would say that the worse ones are the trailer park foxnews folks, they have some measure of political power because of their color. And the numbers are vastly on the sides of poor whites.

You are being distracted by colors.
It is not a color thing, its a class/economic thing.

The color/religion/sex/gay/bi -and even party thing is just another tool for the elites to divide the underclasses so they can continue the rape and pillage of America while the reactionaries blame Mexicans, blacks, and whoever else they are told is at fault.

Knowing damn well no one is smart enough to just go pull the curtain back and see, the wizard is really just some jerk behind a big mic and flashy pyrotechnics trying to scare everyone into focusing on each other.

 

[nehalem256]

Yes, and much of the (R) base lives in poverty right alongside the (D) base. Unless you think the trailer park full of meth labs is somehow more glamorous than the projects full of crack heads.

Note the large blue bars on the left

 

[shortylickens]

It only made the state more powerful because it allowed more people to enlist, stay in, and die/get injured as well. Being allowed to serve in the military is the antithesis of a right.

You know absolutely jack about shit.

 

[feralkid]

I think we should just privatize the military. That way the next time some Neocons want to invade a ME country we wont have to listen to a bunch of whining hippies.

Only those who support the invasion will be required to pay. They can pool their money and hire Blackwater to do the job.

Think of the increased efficiency which will be brought about by the free market if various mercenary companies are forced to compete with each other!

Yeah, I remember being eleven...

 

[rudder]

Hard to say. Some units with gays might not work well if you have people within the unit threatened by that. Then again the military kicked out a lot of people they needed like linquists, etc. just because they were gay. Overall it was probably a good move because I think more skilled people were lost vs. conflicts that arose.