Do Micro Center CPU's OC as well as standard retail CPU's?

[ehume]

Do Micro Center CPU's OC as well as standard retail CPU's?

I ask this because I sprang for a late i7 875k from MC, and it was never was as good an overclocker as my relatively early i7 860. I thought that late chips were better overclockers than earlier chips, so I'm uncertain if the problem came from the 875k, the luck of the draw, or a special arrangement between Intel and MC that allows MC to sell the Intel CPU's so cheaply.

I ask this because I am looking at the possibility of getting an i7 3770k for $229. I know where I can get a good board for it. I have a copy of Win7. I have RAM. I have the itch to build another machine.

So, anything wrong with getting a cheap MC 3770k?

 

[vshah]

just luck of the draw. mc chips are no different from newegg chips or any other chips.

 

[RaistlinZ]

I think it's just blind luck.

 

[tweakboy]

Yes, just depends on the batch. gl

 

[ShintaiDK]

As said, MCs sells the exact same chips as everyone else.

 

[Idontcare]

Do Micro Center CPU's OC as well as standard retail CPU's?

In theory there ought to be no difference between buying a retail chip from MC versus Newegg.

But there is one mechanism in play that has a bias towards MC and which can result in the common Joe having increased odds of getting a lemon - the return policy.

If I buy three 3770K's from Newegg, OC the hell out of them to find the most golden chip of the three, and return the other two to Newegg for a refund then I am out the restocking fee plus shipping for two cpus.

If I were to do the same thing by driving to a local Microcenter, then I am only out the restocking fee, but not the shipping and handling fee (just my gas and my time driving back to the store).

So it is reasonable to expect that to whatever extent this natural selection process is placing pressure on the outstanding inventories at hand in retailers versus etailers, filtering out the best of the best OC'ing chips faster at retailers than etailers because of the price differential that comes with the territory, then it does lead one to conclude that your odds of randomly getting a golden sample from a retailer are less than that of randomly getting one from an etailer.

That much it seems we are safe to conclude. What we can't deduce is just how much of an impact, statistically speaking, this bias introduces. Are your chances lessened by 0.1%? Or 10% Or 50%?

Unrelated to today's situation, but related tangentially, years ago I use to buy my CPUs from an etailer called atacom.com. Their differentiating value-add was that they would pre-test and bin CPUs for their OC potential - if you wanted "guaranteed" 550MHz OC from a 333MHz celeron then they were the people to buy from (at a price premium of course)...but you knew not to buy CPUs from their "stock inventory" because you knew they had already filtered through it and removed all the premium OC'ing chips from the population.

I think you can see how that anecdotal tale, a true one at that, relates to the hypothetical one I outlined at the beginning of this post.

 

[IntelEnthusiast]

We only sale to our Distributors (i.e. Ingram Micro, Tech Data, Synnex, etc.); who than in turn will sale to the reseller (i.e. Newegg.com, Microcenter, Amazon, etc.). So all the processors for all the resellers are all coming out of the same big stock that goes to the disti. So no there is no differences from one to the other.

 

[Eureka]

In theory there ought to be no difference between buying a retail chip from MC versus Newegg.

But there is one mechanism in play that has a bias towards MC and which can result in the common Joe having increased odds of getting a lemon - the return policy.

If I buy three 3770K's from Newegg, OC the hell out of them to find the most golden chip of the three, and return the other two to Newegg for a refund then I am out the restocking fee plus shipping for two cpus.

If I were to do the same thing by driving to a local Microcenter, then I am only out the restocking fee, but not the shipping and handling fee (just my gas and my time driving back to the store).

So it is reasonable to expect that to whatever extent this natural selection process is placing pressure on the outstanding inventories at hand in retailers versus etailers, filtering out the best of the best OC'ing chips faster at retailers than etailers because of the price differential that comes with the territory, then it does lead one to conclude that your odds of randomly getting a golden sample from a retailer are less than that of randomly getting one from an etailer.

That much it seems we are safe to conclude. What we can't deduce is just how much of an impact, statistically speaking, this bias introduces. Are your chances lessened by 0.1%? Or 10% Or 50%?

Unrelated to today's situation, but related tangentially, years ago I use to buy my CPUs from an etailer called atacom.com. Their differentiating value-add was that they would pre-test and bin CPUs for their OC potential - if you wanted "guaranteed" 550MHz OC from a 333MHz celeron then they were the people to buy from (at a price premium of course)...but you knew not to buy CPUs from their "stock inventory" because you knew they had already filtered through it and removed all the premium OC'ing chips from the population.

I think you can see how that anecdotal tale, a true one at that, relates to the hypothetical one I outlined at the beginning of this post.

I don't think it works that way. Once you return a CPU, you can't resell it as new, so it's out of the loop. When the next person buys a CPU, they have just as likely a chance to pick a good CPU out of the remainder, as anyone else. Random distribution across distributors and across batches ensures that the next CPU you pick up is just as random as the first 10 that were sold.

BTW, that's a biased title... MC CPUs are standard retail CPUs.

 

[KingFatty]

So then is Microcenter just taking a huge loss when they have those awesome CPU (and/or motherboard) blowout deals that beat Newegg etc.?

 

[ShintaiDK]

So then is Microcenter just taking a huge loss when they have those awesome CPU (and/or motherboard) blowout deals that beat Newegg etc.?

MC still earn money on them. Newegg just earns more.

 

[lehtv]

So then is Microcenter just taking a huge loss when they have those awesome CPU (and/or motherboard) blowout deals that beat Newegg etc.?

I would guess, having worked at an electronics distributor, that MC has a deal with their distributor to purchase CPUs on a discount. And the distributor has a deal with Intel specifically for CPUs sold to MC. In the end, the customer gets a better price mostly at the expense of Intel's margins, while both MC and the distributor are pretty well off.

 

[LagunaX]

Here is my $229 ($248 with tax) Micro center 3770k I just bought last week.

The newer 2013 Costa Rica batches seem incredible, might be time to sell my trusty low voltage 4.8ghz 2500k and 2600k

 

[Idontcare]

I don't think it works that way. Once you return a CPU, you can't resell it as new, so it's out of the loop.

Haven't worked in retail returns, have you?

Its all based on appearance, so long as it doesn't appear to have been opened, its not considered open and goes back on the shelf as if it had never left the store before.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/11/14/south-florida-family-buys_n_2130001.html

When CBS Miami got in touch with the company, a representative said someone must have bought an iPad and then returned it with the fake, repackaging it so well that it look factory-sealed.

Now that there is simple outright fraud, but the point is just that returns policies based on the premise that the person returning the item has done nothing to its contents provided the returns dept employee (making minimum wage) can discern whether or not the returned item has been opened...you are naive if you don't understand how frequently "opened and tested" items are returned as unopened items for full refund.

It has gotten so bad at Home Depot that I won't walk out of the store anymore before opening the box of whatever I buy just to make sure all the parts are actually still there. Bought a router last year that clearly had been bought, used, returned without all the parts, and restocked on the shelf as a "new, unopened" router for any unsuspecting customer to buy.

This happens, there is no arguing there. My point is just that it is far less likely to happen with etailers where the person returning the "used but looks unopen" product must pay the return shipping, whereas retail outlets are not going to charge that additional "rental" fee per se.

 

[Arkaign]

MC is just as random as any other. Got a 3770k that was unstable at STOCK. Also got a 2700K that is happy at 5ghz. Go figure.

 

[Zap]

I would guess, having worked at an electronics distributor, that MC has a deal with their distributor to purchase CPUs on a discount.

They probably do not have any special discount outside of whatever volume they purchase in. The low prices are probably one of the following:

1) Loss leader to get buyers into stores. They do specify "in store only" for CPU sales, so this is a likely scenario. Sure, I have gone there only for CPU/mobo combos. I have also purchased other stuff while I was there. Don't know exact ratio, but maybe about half the time. I'm sure many others go in for a CPU/mobo and leave with other stuff too.

2) Channel rebates. Does Intel still do these? Or any other kind of incentive (maybe advertising dollars), based on volume?

 

[exar333]

Haven't worked in retail returns, have you?

Its all based on appearance, so long as it doesn't appear to have been opened, its not considered open and goes back on the shelf as if it had never left the store before.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/11/14/south-florida-family-buys_n_2130001.html



Now that there is simple outright fraud, but the point is just that returns policies based on the premise that the person returning the item has done nothing to its contents provided the returns dept employee (making minimum wage) can discern whether or not the returned item has been opened...you are naive if you don't understand how frequently "opened and tested" items are returned as unopened items for full refund.

It has gotten so bad at Home Depot that I won't walk out of the store anymore before opening the box of whatever I buy just to make sure all the parts are actually still there. Bought a router last year that clearly had been bought, used, returned without all the parts, and restocked on the shelf as a "new, unopened" router for any unsuspecting customer to buy.

This happens, there is no arguing there. My point is just that it is far less likely to happen with etailers where the person returning the "used but looks unopen" product must pay the return shipping, whereas retail outlets are not going to charge that additional "rental" fee per se.

Drives-home the fact that you should always carefully inspect items purchased to ensure they are in-fact 'new' and not returned.

VERY valid point IMHO.

 

[Eureka]

Haven't worked in retail returns, have you?

Its all based on appearance, so long as it doesn't appear to have been opened, its not considered open and goes back on the shelf as if it had never left the store before.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/11/14/south-florida-family-buys_n_2130001.html



Now that there is simple outright fraud, but the point is just that returns policies based on the premise that the person returning the item has done nothing to its contents provided the returns dept employee (making minimum wage) can discern whether or not the returned item has been opened...you are naive if you don't understand how frequently "opened and tested" items are returned as unopened items for full refund.

It has gotten so bad at Home Depot that I won't walk out of the store anymore before opening the box of whatever I buy just to make sure all the parts are actually still there. Bought a router last year that clearly had been bought, used, returned without all the parts, and restocked on the shelf as a "new, unopened" router for any unsuspecting customer to buy.

This happens, there is no arguing there. My point is just that it is far less likely to happen with etailers where the person returning the "used but looks unopen" product must pay the return shipping, whereas retail outlets are not going to charge that additional "rental" fee per se.

Ah yes, I always check over anything I buy at a big box store. However, CPUs are sealed from the factory are they not? I don't remember from my last build but I was pretty sure they use a special sticker that the retailer doesn't (or shouldn't) have.

 

[dagamer34]

Is that not the entire point of Intel's special sticker covering the opening of the box? iPads only have generic shrink-wrapped plastic, which if you were enterprising enough, you could duplicate yourself with some special machines.

 

[BrightCandle]

Overclockers.co.uk still list already cherry picked CPUs. Despite having terrible support this is the other reason its not a really recommended place to buy CPUs as all the best ones have been picked out and used in their preoverclocked bundles and machines already.

I kind of wish Intel would give us a bit more detail on the packaging, like the default voltage. We could do with a way to differentiate the binning beyond just "its a top end K cpu". I would have liked to know if I was going to get a 4.4Ghz 3930k verses a 4.8 Ghz. There is someone out there running theirs at stock, with crappy air cooling and wasting all the extra performance while I am stuck with a chip indistinguishable for his usage pattern.

 

[exar333]

Overclockers.co.uk still list already cherry picked CPUs. Despite having terrible support this is the other reason its not a really recommended place to buy CPUs as all the best ones have been picked out and used in their preoverclocked bundles and machines already.

I kind of wish Intel would give us a bit more detail on the packaging, like the default voltage. We could do with a way to differentiate the binning beyond just "its a top end K cpu". I would have liked to know if I was going to get a 4.4Ghz 3930k verses a 4.8 Ghz. There is someone out there running theirs at stock, with crappy air cooling and wasting all the extra performance while I am stuck with a chip indistinguishable for his usage pattern.

That would be great, but the VID doesn't always tell the true OC potential of the chip. Some CPUs ramp-up steadily from the default, while others jump around, depending on the clock. A higher default VID could very well be a better OCer vs. a lower VID CPU. It's always the luck of the draw...

 

[Idontcare]

Ah yes, I always check over anything I buy at a big box store. However, CPUs are sealed from the factory are they not? I don't remember from my last build but I was pretty sure they use a special sticker that the retailer doesn't (or shouldn't) have.

Is that not the entire point of Intel's special sticker covering the opening of the box? iPads only have generic shrink-wrapped plastic, which if you were enterprising enough, you could duplicate yourself with some special machines.

It is not that difficult to remove stickers at the adhesive interface, any kind of alcohol will do it for example. Stickers are actually less secure than shrink-wrap. Most people have rubbing alcohol at home, not many of us have a shrink-wrapper at home.

Note - I do not condone this sort of activity, but I do know people who actively do it despite my admonishments of their actions. And knowing that such things are transpiring in the world, I am wary of it.

 

[ElFenix]

It is not that difficult to remove stickers at the adhesive interface, any kind of alcohol will do it for example. Stickers are actually less secure than shrink-wrap. Most people have rubbing alcohol at home, not many of us have a shrink-wrapper at home.

Note - I do not condone this sort of activity, but I do know people who actively do it despite my admonishments of their actions. And knowing that such things are transpiring in the world, I am wary of it.

with as liberal a return policy as most B&M have, i don't think most overclockers will be going through these steps just when searching for a better overclock.

 

[KingFatty]

It is not that difficult to remove stickers at the adhesive interface, any kind of alcohol will do it for example. Stickers are actually less secure than shrink-wrap. Most people have rubbing alcohol at home, not many of us have a shrink-wrapper at home.

Note - I do not condone this sort of activity, but I do know people who actively do it despite my admonishments of their actions. And knowing that such things are transpiring in the world, I am wary of it.

I wonder if this strategy, repackaging a returned "lemon" as a brand-new item, would cause the same mischief at Newegg and Microcenter?

If someone causes their return to appear in like-new condition, I would expect a vendor like Newegg would also re-sell it without marking it as a refurb or open box? Or do the brick & mortar stores have more leeway when they get a return, compared to online vendors?

 

[Idontcare]

I wonder if this strategy, repackaging a returned "lemon" as a brand-new item, would cause the same mischief at Newegg and Microcenter?

If someone causes their return to appear in like-new condition, I would expect a vendor like Newegg would also re-sell it without marking it as a refurb or open box? Or do the brick & mortar stores have more leeway when they get a return, compared to online vendors?

Absolutely, the difference in frequency just comes down to the price the customer is out of pocket in the returns. Returning to B&M just puts you out your gas money and time, returning to Newegg puts you out the return shipping.

So one imagines the frequency for this sort of nefarious "buy, try, return" process is presumably higher for the locally accessible B&M retailers.

But again, while we can be pretty confident it is happening at some non-zero rate, we have no way of knowing if this is a 0.1% phenomenon or a 10% problem.

Personally I just don't worry about it because I buy through etailers. The only way to really avoid it is to shop at places that have prohibitively expensive return policies that serve as good deterrence. Etailers do this in a way by requiring customer's to pay for return shipping.

 

[dqniel]

I've gotten all of my recent chips from MC. E8400, i7 860, i5 750, 2500k, 3570k, and possibly a few others I've forgotten. I've had some of them get average results, some fantastic- such as an E8400 that did 4.95Ghz on air.