do americans think they will 'win' in iraq?

[robh23]

and what do they think of the administrations efforts there recently, and the administrations presentation of the situation? also woul dkerry be better, and what would he do?

i think the people running it are military goofballs who have alienated the locals, and cant conduct an adequate intelligence op, and should transfer control to the state dept, who should get the iraqies running it asap, also dirct elections should be fast forwarded, and they shouldnt worry so much about the sunnis not liking it.

kerry would do some or most of this, i dont think bush ever understands more than he is briefed by his dad's mates.

 

[tnitsuj]

English MotherF&c$ker? Do you speak it??

 

[robh23]

Originally posted by: tnitsuj
English MotherF&c$ker? Do you speak it??

retard

 

[SuperTool]

If win means turning it over to iraqis, yes, we will "win"
If it means building turkey 2.0 democracy in the middle east, no we will not "win"

 

[Sahakiel]

No, for two reasons :

We have an idiot at the head of the U.S. military.
We have idiots at the head of the U.S. beauracracy.

If we had any significant amount of brains in either branch of the government, there might be a chance.

 

[Strk]

Originally posted by: SuperTool
If win means turning it over to iraqis, yes, we will "win"
If it means building turkey 2.0 democracy in the middle east, no we will not "win"

If the system isn't similar to Turkey's the democracy will never last.

 

[Witling]

It was clear before we went in that we

(1) Were very distrusted;
(2) The people dealing with the Iraqis were not sufficiently familiar with the culture
(3) We were unwilling to spend the resources, time, and lives necessary,
(4) This was an opportunity to test toys for boys (the military), and
(5) The infrastructure necessary for a representative government in Iraq was COMPLETELY missing.

It was a third world country with a disfunctional government when we came and three years after we leave it will be a difunctional third world government. Many people have died needlessly and we've expended billions. Other than that, I don't see a change.

EDITED: BTW, TnitWit is out of line.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

Of course we will win.

Saddam is kicked out.

We can set up a dysfunctional puppet government with perpetual turmoil.

We can leave

That's winning. All the right wingers have to hear is Bush give a speech saying we won, well we have won!

If it doesnt happen, they will blame the Left or the French.

That way they can still "win"

 

[Crimson]

Originally posted by: Witling
It was clear before we went in that we

(1) Were very distrusted;
(2) The people dealing with the Iraqis were not sufficiently familiar with the culture
(3) We were unwilling to spend the resources, time, and lives necessary,
(4) This was an opportunity to test toys for boys (the military), and
(5) The infrastructure necessary for a representative government in Iraq was COMPLETELY missing.

It was a third world country with a disfunctional government when we came and three years after we leave it will be a difunctional third world government. Many people have died needlessly and we've expended billions. Other than that, I don't see a change.

EDITED: BTW, TnitWit is out of line.

1. Did you mean "we're"? I'm tempted to have an outburst like tnitsuj..
2. The Iraqi's understand their culture so well it has resulted in years of peace.. oh wait.. it hasn't. Their culture is based on hate for anyone that doesn't agree with them.. and that includes their own people of different Muslim faiths. The one thing they understand is a gun in their face telling them to knock it the F*** off!
3. Wait, did you miss the paragraph you just posted below this? You said many people have died, and we spent billions.. Which is it, we ARE willing to spend money and lives, or we ARE NOT? Can't have it both ways.
4. We should spend even more on military "toys" as you call them. Gives us the ability to pull an Iraqi war off without 10's of thousands of our military men and women dying..
5. No kidding? What was it that clued you in.. the brutal dictator for the past 30 years? Maybe we should have just asked Saddam to step down and form a ruling congress. ;roll;

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by: Crimson

Originally posted by: Witling
It was clear before we went in that we

(1) Were very distrusted;
(2) The people dealing with the Iraqis were not sufficiently familiar with the culture
(3) We were unwilling to spend the resources, time, and lives necessary,
(4) This was an opportunity to test toys for boys (the military), and
(5) The infrastructure necessary for a representative government in Iraq was COMPLETELY missing.

It was a third world country with a disfunctional government when we came and three years after we leave it will be a difunctional third world government. Many people have died needlessly and we've expended billions. Other than that, I don't see a change.

EDITED: BTW, TnitWit is out of line.

1. Did you mean "we're"? I'm tempted to have an outburst like tnitsuj..
2. The Iraqi's understand their culture so well it has resulted in years of peace.. oh wait.. it hasn't. Their culture is based on hate for anyone that doesn't agree with them.. and that includes their own people of different Muslim faiths. The one thing they understand is a gun in their face telling them to knock it the F*** off!
3. Wait, did you miss the paragraph you just posted below this? You said many people have died, and we spent billions.. Which is it, we ARE willing to spend money and lives, or we ARE NOT? Can't have it both ways.
4. We should spend even more on military "toys" as you call them. Gives us the ability to pull an Iraqi war off without 10's of thousands of our military men and women dying..
5. No kidding? What was it that clued you in.. the brutal dictator for the past 30 years? Maybe we should have just asked Saddam to step down and form a ruling congress. ;roll;

The Iraqi's aren't worth one American Soldiers life. The main reason that the American Public supported Dub's excellent adventure is because he and his Neocon Minions hoodwinked us into believing that they were a threat to us with their non existant Stockpiles of WMDs, their non existent adanced nuclear weapons program the their yet to be proved ties to Al Qaeda.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

"The Iraqi's understand their culture so well it has resulted in years of peace.. oh wait.. it hasn't. Their culture is based on hate for anyone that doesn't agree with them.. and that includes their own people of different Muslim faiths. The one thing they understand is a gun in their face telling them to knock it the F*** off!"


So who else sees the massive irony in this statement?

 

[calbear2000]

Originally posted by: Crimson

Originally posted by: Witling
It was clear before we went in that we

(1) Were very distrusted;
(2) The people dealing with the Iraqis were not sufficiently familiar with the culture
(3) We were unwilling to spend the resources, time, and lives necessary,
(4) This was an opportunity to test toys for boys (the military), and
(5) The infrastructure necessary for a representative government in Iraq was COMPLETELY missing.

It was a third world country with a disfunctional government when we came and three years after we leave it will be a difunctional third world government. Many people have died needlessly and we've expended billions. Other than that, I don't see a change.

EDITED: BTW, TnitWit is out of line.

1. Did you mean "we're"? I'm tempted to have an outburst like tnitsuj..
2. The Iraqi's understand their culture so well it has resulted in years of peace.. oh wait.. it hasn't. Their culture is based on hate for anyone that doesn't agree with them.. and that includes their own people of different Muslim faiths. The one thing they understand is a gun in their face telling them to knock it the F*** off!
3. Wait, did you miss the paragraph you just posted below this? You said many people have died, and we spent billions.. Which is it, we ARE willing to spend money and lives, or we ARE NOT? Can't have it both ways.
4. We should spend even more on military "toys" as you call them. Gives us the ability to pull an Iraqi war off without 10's of thousands of our military men and women dying..
5. No kidding? What was it that clued you in.. the brutal dictator for the past 30 years? Maybe we should have just asked Saddam to step down and form a ruling congress. ;roll;

1) He wrote "we... were very distrusted" I'm tempted to have an outburst like tnitsuj..
2) This line is classic sig material... evokes all sorts of emotions: laughter, pity, fear, shame
3) Exactly... Americans aren't willing to spend the resources and lives (except for yourself) but the Administration is... can't have it both ways
4) I'm sure Patriots like yourself would love more toys to pull the same Iraqi invasion stunt in other countries...
5) Maybe we should ask all rulers of non-democratic countries to step down and form a ruling congress. I guess with more toys, we can eventaully get this done ourselves since the only thing these people understand is a gun in their face.

 

[Witling]

Crimson, ever Crimson, would that you were.

"1. Did you mean "we're"? I'm tempted to have an outburst like tnitsuj.." Yes, Crimson, I meant "We're." How perceptive of you to figure out the typo. I've sent the finger that's supposed to type the ' to stand in the corner.

"2. The Iraqi's understand their culture so well it has resulted in years of peace.. oh wait.. it hasn't. Their culture is based on hate for anyone that doesn't agree with them.. and that includes their own people of different Muslim faiths. The one thing they understand is a gun in their face telling them to knock it the F*** off!"

My point was that we don't understand their culture. When you say, the only thing they understand is a gun in their face, you mean, like the Palestinians. You can see how well force has worked there.

"3. Wait, did you miss the paragraph you just posted below this? You said many people have died, and we spent billions." We're willing to spend billions to buy a short term "solution." Unfortunately, it won't be a solution. And the 127 Billion or so we've spent until now are just the beginning.

"4. We should spend even more on military "toys" as you call them. Gives us the ability to pull an Iraqi war off without 10's of thousands of our military men and women dying." To what end? You can't capitalize on the "victory" without occupying the country. And the days of successfully doing that are over.

5. No kidding? What was it that clued you in.. the brutal dictator for the past 30 years? Maybe we should have just asked Saddam to step down and form a ruling congress. ;roll; On number 5, you didn't see fit to repeat the thrust of my number 5. It was, Iraq ain't ready for this. You think this is a brilliant observation on my part. Perhaps, the administration certainly didn't perceive it. They still think they're going to establish a a "beacon of democracy" in the middle east. Take a place like Jordan, which didn't have "the brutal dicatator for the past 30 years" (let's forget about us helping him). It does not have an effective democracy. Nowhere in the Middle East does, so don't try to shove it off on the "brutal dictator."

Crims, why did we go there?

 

[Drift3r]

Originally posted by: Crimson

Originally posted by: Witling
It was clear before we went in that we

(1) Were very distrusted;
(2) The people dealing with the Iraqis were not sufficiently familiar with the culture
(3) We were unwilling to spend the resources, time, and lives necessary,
(4) This was an opportunity to test toys for boys (the military), and
(5) The infrastructure necessary for a representative government in Iraq was COMPLETELY missing.

It was a third world country with a disfunctional government when we came and three years after we leave it will be a difunctional third world government. Many people have died needlessly and we've expended billions. Other than that, I don't see a change.

EDITED: BTW, TnitWit is out of line.

1. Did you mean "we're"? I'm tempted to have an outburst like tnitsuj..
2. The Iraqi's understand their culture so well it has resulted in years of peace.. oh wait.. it hasn't. Their culture is based on hate for anyone that doesn't agree with them.. and that includes their own people of different Muslim faiths. The one thing they understand is a gun in their face telling them to knock it the F*** off!
3. Wait, did you miss the paragraph you just posted below this? You said many people have died, and we spent billions.. Which is it, we ARE willing to spend money and lives, or we ARE NOT? Can't have it both ways.
4. We should spend even more on military "toys" as you call them. Gives us the ability to pull an Iraqi war off without 10's of thousands of our military men and women dying..
5. No kidding? What was it that clued you in.. the brutal dictator for the past 30 years? Maybe we should have just asked Saddam to step down and form a ruling congress. ;roll;

Iraqis had a brutal dictator but then you go ahead and say that they are a hate filled people. If so then why waste good American lives on hate filled people that were held in check by a U.S. installed brutal dicatator ? That is unless you want us to turn into a hate filled nation which keeps Iraq in control via brutal means.

 

[etech]

Iraqis had a brutal dictator but then you go ahead and say that they are a hate filled people. If so then why waste good American lives on hate filled people that were held in check by a U.S. installed brutal dicatator ? That is unless you want us to turn into a hate filled nation which keeps Iraq in control via brutal means.

Prove it. I want documented proof that the U.S. installed Saddam into power.

Saddam himself now, that is what you typed and I challenge you to prove it.

 

[CrazyHelloDeli]

I love Politics & News. You get more interpretations of reality than you do at a Psych Ward.

 

[BugsBunny1078]

 

[Dragnov]

I don't see how anyone seriously all will be better in Afghanistan/Iraq such a short amount of time.

The occupation of Japan took what 6-7 years? And that was with an already industrialized society, as well as a fairly cooperative government/business sector, and much more compliant population. Not to mention the massive amount of monetary investment put in.

Am I saying that Afghanistan/Iraq will be as succesful in time? Nah, personally I don't see much improvement in the next decade at least. I'm just saying we don't really know yet, as long as steps are being made than so far so good.

 

[Drift3r]

Originally posted by: etech

Iraqis had a brutal dictator but then you go ahead and say that they are a hate filled people. If so then why waste good American lives on hate filled people that were held in check by a U.S. installed brutal dicatator ? That is unless you want us to turn into a hate filled nation which keeps Iraq in control via brutal means.

Prove it. I want documented proof that the U.S. installed Saddam into power.

Saddam himself now, that is what you typed and I challenge you to prove it.

It's been well documented as a fact that the CIA funded/supported his raise to power to counter and promote a anti-communist regime in Iraq. Later on he was also viewed as a key ally in the region to check Iran and it's islamic revolution despite gassing the Kurds and having the U.S. Army trying to shift the blame onto Iran.

http://www.newsmax.com/archives/articles/2003/4/10/205859.shtml

 

[robh23]

Originally posted by: etech

Iraqis had a brutal dictator but then you go ahead and say that they are a hate filled people. If so then why waste good American lives on hate filled people that were held in check by a U.S. installed brutal dicatator ? That is unless you want us to turn into a hate filled nation which keeps Iraq in control via brutal means.

Prove it. I want documented proof that the U.S. installed Saddam into power.

Saddam himself now, that is what you typed and I challenge you to prove it.

it is well suspected that the cia encouraged saddam to become president in the late 1970's, they then supported him against the mullahs in iran

 

[etech]

Drift3r

'Newsmax', you've got to be kidding.

 

[Red Dawn]

I remember when Iraq hit the USS Stark with an exocet missile during the Iraq/Iran war and the US didn't do a damn thing about it because I raq was fighting our arch enemy at the time Iran. Back then we supported Hussien because the enemy of our enemy is our friend, just ask Rumsfeld.

 

[Alistar7]

The Iraqi's aren't worth one American Soldiers life.


I disagree, and I will gladly state the freedom of 27,000,000 is worth 1,000+ lives, yes, even American lives.
Don't dishonor what they fought and died for, especially because you feel one group of people don't deserve the same rights you enjoy.

Is anyone going to mention the fact that the Kurds have been living autonomously for 12 years and have open elections. 1/3 of the country made the transition very well, I see no reason the rest can't or won't. Might take some time for things to settle into a groove there but they will....

 

[Tab]

Originally posted by: robh23
and what do they think of the administrations efforts there recently, and the administrations presentation of the situation? also woul dkerry be better, and what would he do?

i think the people running it are military goofballs who have alienated the locals, and cant conduct an adequate intelligence op, and should transfer control to the state dept, who should get the iraqies running it asap, also dirct elections should be fast forwarded, and they shouldnt worry so much about the sunnis not liking it.

kerry would do some or most of this, i dont think bush ever understands more than he is briefed by his dad's mates.

Your education in grammer shows your understanding of moderen affairs as well.