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Do absentee abllots in PA support or abet voter fraud?

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her209

No Lifer
Oct 11, 2000
56,361
8
0
It's not the personal attacks, but rather the lack of substance, the acceptance & dissemination of propaganda by you that I find objectionable.

Your very first post in this Pennsylvania voter fraud thread was about how Al Franken somehow cheated in Minnesota, as if there were some conspiracy allowing ex offenders to vote, with added slime about Dems being happy about fraud rather than Franken winning.

When called on that, when it was pointed out that it's impossible to know how they voted, anyway, you retrench, dig a little deeper, believe a little harder.

And now you're all huffy & puffy about it, as if you had something pertinent to offer but were persecuted instead.

Uhhh-Waaahhh!
:thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup:
 

monovillage

Diamond Member
Jul 3, 2008
8,445
0
0
It's not the personal attacks, but rather the lack of substance, the acceptance & dissemination of propaganda by you that I find objectionable.

Your very first post in this Pennsylvania voter fraud thread was about how Al Franken somehow cheated in Minnesota, as if there were some conspiracy allowing ex offenders to vote, with added slime about Dems being happy about fraud rather than Franken winning.

When called on that, when it was pointed out that it's impossible to know how they voted, anyway, you retrench, dig a little deeper, believe a little harder.

And now you're all huffy & puffy about it, as if you had something pertinent to offer but were persecuted instead.

Uhhh-Waaahhh!
The Dems did cheat in Minnesota and that's why the comedian Franken is in the Senate. There's certain proof that voter fraud happened in Minnesota there have been hundreds of convictions. You and your partisan Democrats want to deny what is obviously true and proven.
 

Bowfinger

Lifer
Nov 17, 2002
15,776
392
126
The Dems did cheat in Minnesota and that's why the comedian Franken is in the Senate. There's certain proof that voter fraud happened in Minnesota there have been hundreds of convictions. You and your partisan Democrats want to deny what is obviously true and proven.
False. Several hundred felons "cheated" in Minnesota. We have no data on their party affiliation, if any. You swallowed the propaganda because it supported your bias, never stopping to apply a little critical thought to their allegations. You, and so many RNC faithful like you, have been played again.
 
Jan 25, 2011
16,084
7,573
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The Dems did cheat in Minnesota and that's why the comedian Franken is in the Senate. There's certain proof that voter fraud happened in Minnesota there have been hundreds of convictions. You and your partisan Democrats want to deny what is obviously true and proven.

You are relying on faith that all votes went for Franken. This has been repeatedly spelled out to and you choose to ignore this fact.

I can also say that Franken won in the face of fraud from Republicans. I have just as much proof they voted against Franken during the election as you have that they voted for Franken.
 

monovillage

Diamond Member
Jul 3, 2008
8,445
0
0
You are relying on faith that all votes went for Franken. This has been repeatedly spelled out to and you choose to ignore this fact.

I can also say that Franken won in the face of fraud from Republicans. I have just as much proof they voted against Franken during the election as you have that they voted for Franken.
They were felons and ex-convicts, of course they voted Democrat, don't be silly.
 

monovillage

Diamond Member
Jul 3, 2008
8,445
0
0
'Voter ID laws boost democracy'

http://www.bostonherald.com/news/opinion/op_ed/view/20220815voter_id_laws_boost_democracy_four-deck_subhead_goes_right_here/

But the Supreme Court has addressed that issue. In a 2008 decision upholding Indiana’s voter ID law, the opinion of the court, written by Justice John Paul Stevens — certainly no conservative — dismissed the poll tax argument on the grounds that the state had a legitimate interest in preventing voter fraud. Five justices agreed with him.

Critics of ID requirements assert that voting is special — a right, not a privilege, and therefore not comparable to things like driving a car or gaining access to the NAACP convention. But the distinction is not so clear. Medicaid is arguably a right for those who are income eligible.

And rights are not absolute. Nine-year-olds cannot vote; nor can illegal immigrants. An estimated 1 million illegal immigrants live in Texas. If many of them turned up at the polls and were able to vote in the absence of a requirement for government-issued identification, the right of all Texas citizens to choose their representatives might be seriously compromised.
 

monovillage

Diamond Member
Jul 3, 2008
8,445
0
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And this is why your points are never taken seriously.
And being taken seriously in a thread by HomerJS that says:
Republicans in PA support voter fraud
is supposed to matter to me?
I'm supposed to care that a Democrat/leftie whiny poster like yourself takes me seriously? Why ? Go snivel to someone that cares.




*Edit* yap, yap, yap ...........good puppy
 

HomerJS

Lifer
Feb 6, 2002
25,719
10,786
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The Dems did cheat in Minnesota and that's why the comedian Franken is in the Senate. There's certain proof that voter fraud happened in Minnesota there have been hundreds of convictions. You and your partisan Democrats want to deny what is obviously true and proven.
Show me the convictions of voter fraud in the Frankin election.

Evidence does not equal guilt.

BTW - Remember Republicans got their panties in a bunch when a bunch of absentee military ballots came in after the deadline. Counting them would be fraud in the same vein if a convicted felon voted if it is against the law.
 

HomerJS

Lifer
Feb 6, 2002
25,719
10,786
136
And being taken seriously in a thread by HomerJS that says:

is supposed to matter to me?
I'm supposed to care that a Democrat/leftie whiny poster like yourself takes me seriously? Why ? Go snivel to someone that cares.




*Edit* yap, yap, yap ...........good puppy
Using that title based on the logic Republicans created. They say if Dems are against picture voter ID they favor voter fraud. Next!

Meanwhile the GOP will continue to defy intelligence requiring a picture ID for in person voting but none for absentee. I have yet to get an excuse for this!!
 

Bowfinger

Lifer
Nov 17, 2002
15,776
392
126
Show me the convictions of voter fraud in the Frankin election.

Evidence does not equal guilt.

BTW - Remember Republicans got their panties in a bunch when a bunch of absentee military ballots came in after the deadline. Counting them would be fraud in the same vein if a convicted felon voted if it is against the law.
There actually have been close to 200 convictions IIRC, though I wouldn't call them voter fraud. They are all felons who were still registered to vote, but no longer eligible due to their criminal convictions. There were no cases of one voter impersonating someone else, however, which is the only type of fraud photo IDs might deter.
 

monovillage

Diamond Member
Jul 3, 2008
8,445
0
0
Here you go and this is funny, it's from Minnesota Public Radio. They find that at least 144 Minnesotans have been convicted, that's convicted of voter fraud since 2008, but it's "inconclusive" if there was voter fraud. Huh?

Capitol View
< New Hampshire staffers leave Bachmann campaign | Main | Bachmann camp pushes back on reports of staff departures >
PoliGraph: Voter fraud claim inconclusive

Posted at 2:00 PM on October 21, 2011 by Catharine Richert (6 Comments)
Filed under: PoliGraph

As a special panel created by Gov. Mark Dayton convened this week to make recommendations on the state's election rules, a group that supports a voter identification law is touting a new report about voter fraud convictions associated with the 2008 election.

"As of August 10th, 2011, 113 individuals are now known to have been convicted for voter fraud committed in 2008," the report from Minnesota Majority, a right-leaning group, states.

Minnesota Majority may be in range, but it is difficult to pin down a precise number.

The Evidence

Minnesota Majority's report largely focuses on felons who were ineligible to vote in the 2008 election, but did anyway. The group argues that the number may be much higher than that, but many who violate election rules avoid punishment if they can prove they did not know they were ineligible to cast a ballot.

The number of convictions represents weaknesses in the state's same-day registration policy, the group contends.

In Hennepin County, 23 people have been convicted of voter fraud and eight cases are pending. In Ramsey County, 36 convictions have resulted from the 2008 elections as of last spring, including cases involving ineligible voters who registered, but who did not end up voting.

PoliGraph also requested voter fraud conviction data for every county in the state. The data, collected by the Minnesota Supreme Court, shows that 144 people have been convicted of voter fraud since 2009.

The Supreme Court numbers are not a perfect comparison to the Minnesota Majority's report because the data include some cases associated with the 2010 election, and are not limited to cases involving felons who voted illegally.

Ramsey County Elections Manager Joe Mansky, who sits on the governor's special committee and is widely considered to be a state expert on voting, said that the vast majority of such cases involve people who have been convicted of a felony, are ineligible to vote, but do anyway.

But these are isolated cases that could not be solved by implementing a voter identification law, he said. And unlike other states, there's no evidence that Minnesota has had large, organized attempts to violate the law, Mansky said.

"This is just individuals acting on their own, with imperfect information, no information," he said.

Furthermore, those who were found to violate the law represent far less than 1 percent of the roughly 2.9 million Minnesotans who voted in the 2008 election.

The Verdict

Based on independent information, it appears that Minnesota Majority's estimate that 113 people have been convicted of voter fraud may be in the ballpark, though a precise number is elusive.

As a result, their claim rates inconclusive.
http://minnesota.publicradio.org/collections/special/columns/polinaut/archive/2011/10/poligraph_voter.shtml

I'm sure you'll focus on the parts that support your voter ID stance. Understandable.
I just love that MPR says that ever though they have records of 144 convictions for voter fraud since 2008that evidence of voter fraud is inconclusive. Media bias anyone?
 

monovillage

Diamond Member
Jul 3, 2008
8,445
0
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Using that title based on the logic Republicans created. They say if Dems are against picture voter ID they favor voter fraud. Next!

Meanwhile the GOP will continue to defy intelligence requiring a picture ID for in person voting but none for absentee. I have yet to get an excuse for this!!
I want strict controls on absentee voting, don't pull that bullshit on me.
It's a troll thread title posted by a troll and you just got a response from a fellow troll.
 

HomerJS

Lifer
Feb 6, 2002
25,719
10,786
136
I want strict controls on absentee voting, don't pull that bullshit on me.
It's a troll thread title posted by a troll and you just got a response from a fellow troll.
Voter ID laws have been enacted nationwide by Republicans only. None of these new voter ID laws apply to absentee ballots. Yet you would have us believe the GOP is really interested in stopping voter fraud?

BTW - Relatively non-existant voter fraud.
 

dali71

Golden Member
Oct 1, 2003
1,116
21
81
Pennsylvania Voter ID Law - General FAQ

FAQ – GENERAL INFORMATION ON VOTING BY ABSENTEE BALLOT:

What are the changes
to the absentee voting
law and when do they
go into effect?

&#61656; Starting with November 2012 General Election,
Pennsylvania law now requires voters to provide proof of
identification with an Application for Absentee Ballot.


Is anyone exempt?

&#61656; A qualified absentee voter is not required to provide proof
of identification if the voter is entitled to vote by absentee
ballot under the Uniformed and Overseas Citizens
Absentee Voting Act (UOCAVA) or by alternative ballot
under the Voting Accessibility for the Elderly and
Handicapped Act.


What is proof of
identification for a
qualified absentee
voter?

&#61656; For a voter who has a current and valid Pennsylvania
driver’s license or PennDOT photo ID card, the voter must
provide the driver’s license number or photo ID number
on the Application for Absentee Ballot.

&#61656; For a voter who does not have a Pennsylvania driver’s
license or PennDOT photo ID card, the voter must provide
the last four digits of his or her Social Security Number on
the Application for Absentee Ballot.

&#61656; For a voter who has a RELIGIOUS OBJECTION to being
photographed, the voter must provide the Pennsylvania
valid without-photo driver’s license number or PennDOT
valid without-photo identification number on the
Application for Absentee Ballot, OR the voter must provide
a copy of either of these documents with the Application for Absentee Ballot.


What if a voter does
not have a
Pennsylvania driver’s
license or Social
Security Number?

&#61656; A voter without either must provide with his or her
Application for Absentee Ballot a copy of an ID that shows
a NAME, a PHOTO, and an EXPIRATION DATE that is
CURRENT, unless noted otherwise, such as:
Photo IDs issued by the U.S. Government or the
Commonwealth of Pennsylvania, including:
o U.S. passport
o U.S. military ID (active duty and retired military ID
may designate an expiration date that is
indefinite). Military dependents’ ID must contain a
current expiration date
Employee photo identification issued by Federal,
Pennsylvania, Pennsylvania County, or Pennsylvania
Municipal government
Photo identification issued by an accredited
Pennsylvania public or private institution of higher
learning
Photo identification issued by a Pennsylvania care
facility, including long-term care facilities, assisted
living residences and personal care homes


What does the county
board of elections do
with a voter’s proof of
identification?

&#61656; A county board of elections must verify the proof of
identification before counting an absentee ballot. If the
board is unable to do so, the board will contact the voter
so he or she will be able to provide acceptable proof of
identification.


What if the voter does
not include proof of
identification with the
Application for
Absentee Ballot?

&#61656; A voter who does not include proof of identification on or
with the Application for Absentee Ballot will still receive an
absentee ballot; however, the county board of elections
will send a notice to the voter with the absentee ballot
requiring the voter to provide proof of identification or the
ballot will not be counted.

&#61656; A voter should provide the proof of identification as soon
as possible so that the county board of elections can
verify the information and the ballot can be counted.

&#61656; If the county board of elections has not received the proof
of identification that can be verified by the sixth day after
the election, the voter’s absentee ballot will not be
counted.
Voter fraud not found. Thread reported for misleading title. Homer fails again.
 

monovillage

Diamond Member
Jul 3, 2008
8,445
0
0
Voter ID laws have been enacted nationwide by Republicans only. None of these new voter ID laws apply to absentee ballots. Yet you would have us believe the GOP is really interested in stopping voter fraud?

BTW - Relatively non-existant voter fraud.
When they ask me to write the voter fraud laws i'll include a section on absentee ballot voting.
 

HomerJS

Lifer
Feb 6, 2002
25,719
10,786
136
Pennsylvania Voter ID Law - General FAQ



Voter fraud not found. Thread reported for misleading title. Homer fails again.
Hey genius if you note in your own post the only proof required is writing the last 4 digits of your SSN on the application. They will then mail you an absentee ballot. You fill it out and send it back in.

State issued picture ID not required

I do not have to have a picture ID for an absentee ballot.

Maybe if in person they would accept a form everyone has such as a utility bill this would go away. But remember is is not about fraud!!!!

Remember Republicans say if you don't support strict voter ID laws you support voter fraud. Title follows GOP playbook.
 

cybrsage

Lifer
Nov 17, 2011
13,021
0
0
Its a voter suppression issue under the guise of voter fraud.
How is giving someone 189 days (7.5 months) to get a free photo ID (and free replacement copy of their birth certificate) considered voter suppression when each of them can be obtained in the same day(making it 2 days total) if you go in person?
 

cybrsage

Lifer
Nov 17, 2011
13,021
0
0
Why do so many people say "if we cannot stop ALL voter fraud in one fell swoop, we should do NOTHING at all"? That is silly. We should stop the easily stopped fraud first, then slowly work our way up.

First, you ensure that everyone who votes in person has a photo ID. After this is done, you then require a photocopy of your photo ID to obtain an absentee ballot. Neither of these things will stop all voter fraud, but it is a start.

Walking a mile starts with but a single step.
 

Jhhnn

No Lifer
Nov 11, 1999
61,662
13,746
136
They were felons and ex-convicts, of course they voted Democrat, don't be silly.
Mere assertion of opinion as fact, denial as reason. There is absolutely no way to accurately determine how they voted, which is obvious to anybody whose thinking processes haven't been poisoned by rightwing agitprop.

Ex-offenders aren't necessarily the brightest bunch, so their perception of self interest may well mirror your own.
 

HomerJS

Lifer
Feb 6, 2002
25,719
10,786
136
Why do so many people say "if we cannot stop ALL voter fraud in one fell swoop, we should do NOTHING at all"? That is silly. We should stop the easily stopped fraud first, then slowly work our way up.

First, you ensure that everyone who votes in person has a photo ID. After this is done, you then require a photocopy of your photo ID to obtain an absentee ballot. Neither of these things will stop all voter fraud, but it is a start.

Walking a mile starts with but a single step.
As long as that single step effects overwelmingly Democrats. I get it.

Meanwhile if absentee ballots come in after the deadline Republicans will suddely favor breaking the law.
 

HomerJS

Lifer
Feb 6, 2002
25,719
10,786
136
How is giving someone 189 days (7.5 months) to get a free photo ID (and free replacement copy of their birth certificate) considered voter suppression when each of them can be obtained in the same day(making it 2 days total) if you go in person?
Until you are a poor 93 year old woman who has voted for the past 50 years you may never understand. Assuming she get the news 7.5 months out.

Hey I have a idea for a new requirement. All polling places will have a closed 75lb door. You must open it on your own to enter. It's fair since it applys equally to everyone.
 

cybrsage

Lifer
Nov 17, 2011
13,021
0
0
As long as that single step effects overwelmingly Democrats. I get it.
Can you show me the part of the law which only applies to democrats? I missed it. Thanks!

Meanwhile if absentee ballots come in after the deadline Republicans will suddely favor breaking the law.
Can you show me the part of the law which says absentee ballots received after the deadline are allowed? Thanks!
 

cybrsage

Lifer
Nov 17, 2011
13,021
0
0
Until you are a poor 93 year old woman who has voted for the past 50 years you may never understand. Assuming she get the news 7.5 months out.
If she did not, then she got it when she voted in the last elections in April. The poll workers told EVERYONE about the new requirement and asked EVERYONE (not just the dems, which you seem to think for some odd reason) to see photo ID.

Do you even live in PA? I suspect not, or you would already know that.
 

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