disabling SPI on a router

[Niflheim]

Hey yeah. I downloaded Windows Vista 5600 RC-1 and stuff. I had the previous version too,but the networking never worked. So I downloaded the latest one, thinking it might work. But it doesn't. I've been googling around and I saw that I'm not the only one. Apparently, SPI (stateful packet inspection) on routers makes that Vista won't go on the Internet.Well I can ping sites, it says that everything works and that there are no problems, but I can't load any site or anything.

So is there any way to disable that SPI thing on my router? I have a D-Link DI-604. If you know something about that, well thanks a lot!

 

[stash]

Disabling SPI probably isn't a great idea. You can disable the autotuning behavior in Vista that causes this with some router's SPI implementations.

Open an elevated command prompt and run: "netsh int tcp set global autotuninglevel=disable"

There were some fixes in beta2 for this, but most of the work needs to be done in the router firmware, so it is up to the vendors to fix it.

 

[spidey07]

Originally posted by: stash
Disabling SPI probably isn't a great idea. You can disable the autotuning behavior in Vista that causes this with some router's SPI implementations.

Open an elevated command prompt and run: "netsh int tcp set global autotuninglevel=disable"

There were some fixes in beta2 for this, but most of the work needs to be done in the router firmware, so it is up to the vendors to fix it.

WHAT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Is microsoft up to there bullcrap again? It is up to microsoft to adhere to the standards of the Internet.

This just can't be true, this just can't be the mindset of microsoft. Do they still not understand how the internet/networking works?!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Good thing I'm meeting with MS next week. I'm gonna tear them a new one.

Can I pretty please have some white papers to tear into them with? Please?

 

[Niflheim]

Wow juste give me your adress I'll send you high quality paper to cut them with, oh yes I will.
And I don't understand either. It worked on the previous versions of Windows but now, on Vista, it doesn't. I wonder if they will fix it. Probably not. I guess that router and modem manufacturer will have to cope with Microsoft and change the way they make their protections.

ahahahah

 

[stash]

Originally posted by: spidey07

Originally posted by: stash
Disabling SPI probably isn't a great idea. You can disable the autotuning behavior in Vista that causes this with some router's SPI implementations.

Open an elevated command prompt and run: "netsh int tcp set global autotuninglevel=disable"

There were some fixes in beta2 for this, but most of the work needs to be done in the router firmware, so it is up to the vendors to fix it.

WHAT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Is microsoft up to there bullcrap again? It is up to microsoft to adhere to the standards of the Internet.

This just can't be true, this just can't be the mindset of microsoft. Do they still not understand how the internet/networking works?!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Good thing I'm meeting with MS next week. I'm gonna tear them a new one.

Can I pretty please have some white papers to tear into them with? Please?

Lol good luck with that. Receive window auto-tuning is not violating any standards. This is the same thing as a user manually setting the window size to a larger or smaller value, except that it does it dynamically.

Receive windows auto-tuning allows up to a 16MB window size, which is well within the limits defined in
RFC 1323

http://www.microsoft.com/technet/community/columns/cableguy/cg1105.mspx#E2B

 

[spidey07]

<---looks at number of RFC, looks at the date, looks at the obsolescance track

<---laughs out loud uncontrollably.

You guys just don't get it. Thanks though, I'll have fun in the meeting.

 

[stash]

Wow juste give me your adress I'll send you high quality paper to cut them with, oh yes I will

I'm curious, what is this high quality paper?

 

[stash]

Originally posted by: spidey07
<---looks at number of RFC, looks at the date, looks at the obsolescance track

<---laughs out loud uncontrollably.

You guys just don't get it. Thanks though, I'll have fun in the meeting.

I wonder, if this is breaking the spec, why is it that D-Link routers appear to be the only ones having a problem?

 

[spidey07]

Stash, to my knowledge even win2000 supported window scaling.

But I'm happy that you are finally adhering to a 14 year old standard.

 

[stash]

Um, did you read the link I posted (not the RFC). I never said the changes in Vista implemented that standard. The RFC is noted in the article as a reference to how the old stack worked.

http://www.microsoft.com/technet/community/columns/cableguy/cg1105.mspx#E2B

 

[spidey07]

oh yes, I'm gonna have fun with MS.

I'm tearing them a new one. Thanks for the article. It only proves my point even more.

It's a shame really, because the stack has been getting better and better. But I still don't like the "MS way of TCP/IP" and then there's "Everybody else"

-edit-
Stash,
Sorry for being so harsh. I'll stop.

I love microsoft products and what they do and i didn't mean to bash. But it is their implementation of their stack that bugs me the most. I expect nothing but improvement with vista's stack, hopefully to "good/great" levels. I guess the "network guy who doesn't care what the OS is" got to me with the suggestion that it is a software problem with network gear. Maybe we can learn a little bit from each other. Because the IETF standards, IMHO MUST adhered to. I'll even tear into cisco for their proprietary stuff. But I understand that as a leader in your field you have to use what is best before it becomes standard. But man....fix your stack.

 

[stash]

Sorry for being so harsh. I'll stop

It's ok, I'm a big boy

I guess the "network guy who doesn't care what the OS is" got to me with the suggestion that it is a software problem with network gear

Yeah, that probably wasn't the most diplomatic way I could've put it. I was looking at the bugs opened on this, and I'm not sure if there is work ongoing in Vista on this. There may be fixes forthcoming.

Maybe we can learn a little bit from each other

I certainly hope so, since you know a hell of a lot more about this than I do, and I respect and admire that. I was actually hoping you would educate me (since I'm not involved with the development of the Vista stack in the slightest) on what you are troubled by with these changes. I agree that standards should be adhered to, and contrary to what you may believe, the product groups at MS also feel strongly about that. What standards are not being adhered to in this case?

I only ask the questions because you are the first person that I've seen that has raised this issue. That's not to say there aren't others, just that I have not seen them, and I'm curious.

Thanks...

 

[JackMDS]

Hmm.. I used Vista with Linksys, Netgear, and Buffalo. Does not seem to be bothered by the Routers.

:sun:

 

[spidey07]

Stash,

I'm not troubled with the changes, I applaud them. My gripe stems from a 'it's not a network problem' mentatlity that I cannot shake after 14 years. Windows stack has always been regarded as "piss-poor", but you guys are getting better and while I haven't run vista I have nothing but the best expectations, coupled with caution. Just get rid of the netbios way of thinking please.

Bottom line of my perspective:

1) MS has their way of doing things, sometimes that contradicts the IETF with respect to their stack. MS has however moved towards using some innovative features of the IETF and finally "getting with the program", and features of their own doing - just like any industry leader would do.

2) Network gear almost always adheres to any and all IETF/IEEE standard out there. But I plead ignorance in this respect because I'm used to commercial gear. If these manufactururers don't comply with these, then they are literally ripped a new one. It's just the mindset of a network guy. We obey the IETF and IEEE to tee, because if we do - we are successful, if we don't, then it sucks.

3) I cannot dispute that SOHO gear doesn't work with a MS standards compliant.

In the end, "It's not a network problem"

 

[Niflheim]

Hihihi
Oh and by the by, that line didn't fix the problem, even if I read that it did for some people. I typed it in the cmd while administrator. It said "Ok.". I rebooted. Nothing. Don't you have any other tricks up your sleeve?
I guess I'll have to reinstall XP. Anyway, I just use Windows for games and AutoCAD because these two aren't that wonderful on Linux. Oyoyoy, damned networking things.

the yuppies networking tutdutdu

 

[spidey07]

hi, hi, hi. um, uhn, uhn, uhn....uh, ohn, ohn, ohn, ohn.

hi, hi, hi. origato, hi, hi, hi. uhn, uhn, uhn.

god damned conference calls.

 

[WiseOldDude]

Your router is probably doing you a favor, else Vista would be spilling your guts and files to home-base.

Read the EULA if you don't believe me.

 

[funkbass81]

tighten your tinfoil, your brain is leaking info to M$!!!!!11!!!11onetwoeleventyomgwtfbbq

 

[stash]

Originally posted by: WiseOldDude
Your router is probably doing you a favor, else Vista would be spilling your guts and files to home-base.

Read the EULA if you don't believe me.

We're loving your pr0n collection over here. Oh wait sorry, you weren't supposed to know

 

[bsobel]

It's a shame really, because the stack has been getting better and better. But I still don't like the "MS way of TCP/IP" and then there's "Everybody else"

So much for getting better, the vista stack is a complete rewrite

 

[spidey07]

Originally posted by: bsobel

It's a shame really, because the stack has been getting better and better. But I still don't like the "MS way of TCP/IP" and then there's "Everybody else"

So much for getting better, the vista stack is a complete rewrite

Well hopefully it will be MUCH better. I haven't really gotten to deep into it, but from the snipets I've read it looks like a definate step in the right direction. We'll just have to figure out what "non standard" stuff is being done. If there's a good document out there that covers in detail exaclty what features/rfcs the stack is using it would be a good read.

 

[stash]

I just discovered this, but you might want to look through the posts on the Windows Core Networking blog: http://blogs.msdn.com/wndp/

I don't think there is a whole lot of good deep documentation out, but I'm hoping that will change after RTM. Maybe you can ask the MS folks when you see them.