DirecTV & Comcast Install + Structured Wiring Cabinet Install Question

[frush73]

I have a question and an issue. We are getting a new home built with the close date January 10th. First the issue, I am not pleased with the upgrade from a 18" cabinet to a 42"; however how they pulled the cable is my issue. Feel free to leave comments to share my headache. =)

My question is how will DirecTV and Comcast approach this situation? Where I am renting now it was like a "race" on who could get here first. Furthermore, at the design center I paid the $300 upgrade to run CAT6E all throughout the house. Furthermore there is 21 drops throughout the house. I only have a modem (with wireless capability) and a wireless router. To have all of the drops hot, what kind of equipment should I install in this OnQ/Legrand cabinet?

 

[ch33zw1z]

My question is how will DirecTV and Comcast approach this situation? Where I am renting now it was like a "race" on who could get here first.

Who is providing service for you now? They'll race if you let them, but try to know what you need for tv, internet, and phone by the time you're ready to call one of them.

Furthermore, at the design center I paid the $300 upgrade to run CAT6E all throughout the house. Furthermore there is 21 drops throughout the house. I only have a modem (with wireless capability) and a wireless router. To have all of the drops hot, what kind of equipment should I install in this OnQ/Legrand cabinet?

Good info here, but lots to cover.

So for the 21 drops network drops, there's three colors. there's light green, green, and dark green.

-It appears that the light green and the green are all terminated with RJ45's, and 9 of these are already plugged into a OnQ/Legrand switch.

The only thing I would be concerned with is what types of cables they are, take a look at the cable and note what type they are. Post the specs up here if you need to. If they're stranded (or "patch") cables, then terminating with RJ45's is ok. If they're solid cable, then they're supposed to be terminated into a patch panel or keystone connectors, using a punch down tool.

-The dark green are not terminated, it looks like there's 7 of these.

Same as above, see what the cable type is so you can plan the right way to terminate them.

-The switch in the cabinet is a Legrand, but I can't tell what model it is. Onq/Legrand makes all sorts of good stuff to fit in there cabinets.

http://www.legrand.us/categories/networking/wired-networks/routers-and-switches.aspx

So things that would help us help you better:

1. Existing cable:
-What type of cables are these?
-Are these cables labeled or mapped out in any way so you know where they go in the house? Or what they're for? (Data or Voice, etc...)

Setting up this can be a project, and getting the drops activated the right way in the places you need them first can be done...and then more when you have time later.

-What is the model of the Legrand switch that's already in there?

2. Other questions:
-What model are the modem w/ wireless, and the wireless router?
-What type of Internet do you have now, and what do you plan on getting at the new place?

For the COAX, all the drops are terminated and put in the 9-way splitter, should be a matter of running the main drop from DirectTV or Comcast into that splitter, then putting the boxes where you need them in the rooms.

Are these labeled at all so you can tell what rooms they go to?

 

[frush73]

Many thanks such an expedient response. This means a lot. Where I live now I have DirecTV for tv and Comcast purely for the internet and I plan to continue to use them when I move into the house.

Section 1.
-What type of cables are these?
CAT6E & RG6
-Are these cables labeled or mapped out in any way so you know where they go...)
-What is the model of the Legrand switch that's already in there
The cables are labeled to indicate which room they are routed to; however, I am not sure of the model of switch except that the technician said it was for phone.

To properly respond I wanted to explain what the 21 CAT6E cables are:

• 2 CAT6E - network drops in Master
• 2 CAT6E - network drops in Bedroom 2
• 2 CAT6E - network drops in Bedroom 3
• 2 CAT6E - network drops in Bedroom 4
• 2 CAT6E - network drops in Family Room
• 3 CAT6E - network drops in Media Room
• 1 CAT6E - network drop in Gameroom
• 1 CAT6E - network drop in Kitchen
• 6 CAT6E - runs for CCTV cameras (just pre-runs)

Totaling 21 CAT6E cables. The ones plugged into the OnQ/Legrand switch again are for phone.
My understanding from the technician is that the additional drops can be used for telephone; however, I made it explicitly clear that I wanted them to be networked (DVR, PS3, Laptop are in the family and media rooms along with IP devices in the bedrooms).

Section 2:
-What model are the modem w/ wireless, and the wireless router?
Modem: Motorola SURFboard 3.0 SBG6580
Router: Netgear WNDR3700v2
-What type of Internet do you have now, and what do you plan on getting at the new place?
Cable and intend to continue with Comcast's cable service.

I also did notice outside that I had CAT6E and RG6 Coax hanging out of the side of the house that homeruns into the structured wiring cabinet. If Comcast or DirecTV "arrives" first will they attempt to take everything for themselves?


I only have one TV now and will purchase a second one in the Spring. One TV for the family room and the other for the media room. I will expand later, but those two areas are what we'll be taking care of first. The builder stated it will have its own box and what not like the meter to the left. What I am not sure is how to "manage" both DirecTV and Comcast as they are both scheduled to install services next Friday the 10th of January. Please advise.

 

[ch33zw1z]

I only have one TV now and will purchase a second one in the Spring. One TV for the family room and the other for the media room. I will expand later, but those two areas are what we'll be taking care of first. The builder stated it will have its own box and what not like the meter to the left. What I am not sure is how to "manage" both DirecTV and Comcast as they are both scheduled to install services next Friday the 10th of January. Please advise.

I'll just address this at this time. Neither will take over anything that you tell them not to touch. If you tell both installers that those external cables are not for them, then they won't touch them.

That being said, Direct TV will need to get the dish cable into the house somewhere. If they can run the cable into the same hole there, then great.

Same goes for Comcast, they will need to get a cable into the house somewhere.

You have some time before the 10th. Think about where you want the cables to come in. In my opinion, closer to the cabinet the better. The thing to remember when dealing with Telco's is to have a realistic picture of what you want in the end. You can always change stuff around on your own later, but if you get it the way you want the first time...even better. Be assertive.

Again, if both Comcast and Direct TV can get a cable through that hole, and it's close to the box, then awesome.

I'll be back to comment on the rest eventually, it's New year's Eve though


Are the network cables actually labeled as Cat 6e?

 

[JoeMcJoe]

Looks nice.

I would replace that small switch with a 16 or 24 port switch, one that supports POE for the security cameras. One would fit in there.

I'm assuming that yellow wire at the bottom is going to be used to install a power socket. Install a small UPS in there, this would be used for the surge protection for the coax/phone.
Install the cable modem and router in there, don't use wireless in that cabinet.

Lots of other options for wireless, install one or more APs in the other rooms to give great coverage.

 

[smitbret]

I'll just address this at this time. Neither will take over anything that you tell them not to touch. If you tell both installers that those external cables are not for them, then they won't touch them.

That being said, Direct TV will need to get the dish cable into the house somewhere. If they can run the cable into the same hole there, then great.

Same goes for Comcast, they will need to get a cable into the house somewhere.

You have some time before the 10th. Think about where you want the cables to come in. In my opinion, closer to the cabinet the better. The thing to remember when dealing with Telco's is to have a realistic picture of what you want in the end. You can always change stuff around on your own later, but if you get it the way you want the first time...even better. Be assertive.

Again, if both Comcast and Direct TV can get a cable through that hole, and it's close to the box, then awesome.

I'll be back to comment on the rest eventually, it's New year's Eve though


Are the network cables actually labeled as Cat 6e?

DirecTV will be coax only and won't utilize any of your Cat cables.

The number of coax cables they need will depend on how many tuners you have for the Receivers/DVRs in your home. If your tuner total is under 8 then you will only need 1 coax from the dish to the cabinet and 1 coax line to each DirecTV box. If it's going to be more than 8, then you'll need 4 coax runs into the cabinet from outside. DirecTV's wireless client boxes have been out in test markets since September so if you live in Pittsburgh, St Louis, San Diego or Dallas you may not need coax drops to each room either. You'll still need one from the cabinet to the main box at your main TV and another coax run for a wireless video bridge in a central location. If you want to hardwire your internet connection instead of use wireless then you'll need a DirecTV coax near a live ethernet connection. It can be spliced into any existing line going to any receiver or DVR, too, though.

 

[imagoon]

I want to preface this with: "I don't like the wired home enclosures." Like the one you have. Mostly because they cost a ton of money (more than most commercial gear! I have seen it at almost 6x as expensive.) It also limits you to only that cabinet companies gear unless you don't mind just laying things around inside.

I consider it installed incorrectly. The cables all should have been terminated to 110 patch panels such as this one:

http://www.amazon.com/On-Q-Legrand-A...pd_sim_sbs_e_3

Please note OnQ love to have 50 differing "standards" so that panel might not fit in yours.

The should have then left you to get patch panels to connect that little switch and or phone service. Personally I would demand they fix it. Crimped connectors on the wire = poor and amateur job. You paid for a professional install and I would demand one.

Otherwise Comcast and DTV simply will run their own stuff and leave you to plug it all in. If anything is faulty they will simply tell you to fix it yourself.

 

[imagoon]

DirecTV will be coax only and won't utilize any of your Cat cables.

Depends on the install. All of my boxes use my home network. In addition to the coax. If you have the cables, use it as it generally performs better that that media to network gateway thing they have.

The rest of the information is valuable.

 

[ch33zw1z]

DirecTV will be coax only and won't utilize any of your Cat cables.

Depends, I advised based on the photo. It looks like a couple ethernets and a couple coax on the outside of the house.

 

[smitbret]

You could use ethernet cables for your whole home dvr, but all DirecTV installs since February are SWM that makes ethernet connections pointless. You won't use ethernet with DirecTV anymore.

 

[kevnich2]

Just me but I would take all of those cat6a and punch all down to a 110 patch panel. After that if you want a few runs for phone use, you can use patch cables to go to either a phone module or to a network switch. It's called structured wiring this way, makes changing things very simple as it just requires a change in patch cable to make an outlet a Dara connection or phone connection. Coax should be fine as is. How many coax and cat6 do you have run outside? Comcast nor directv should need cat6 outside, just the coax.

 

[imagoon]

You could use ethernet cables for your whole home dvr, but all DirecTV installs since February are SWM that makes ethernet connections pointless. You won't use ethernet with DirecTV anymore.

I use Ethernet with SWM. That way I didn't have to buy that little media gateway box. One less device doesn't make it pointless. It also consumes a SWM channel which reduces the device count which actually matters to me.

 

[frush73]

I really do appreciate everyone's feedback. Looking on OnQ's site and following the comments on here, does this setup make sense?


Cable Internet (Comcast)
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Motorola SURFboard 3.0 SBG6580 Cable Modem
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OnQ/Legrand 4-Port Gigabit Router/Switch
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OnQ/Legrand 8-Port Gigabit Switch with PoE (for IP Cameras) & OnQ/Legrand 12-Port Cat 6 Network Interface Module (for all other drops in the house) |
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Connect the Netgear WNDR3700v2 wireless router to one of the drops in the house to act as an access point or is this overly redundant?

 

[JoeMcJoe]

I would recommend not using any OnQ router, you want a real one that has firmware update support.
For a wired only compact model, look at the Ubiquiti Edgemax lite model, less than $100.
http://www.ubnt.com/edgemax#EdgeMAXhardware

You can mount these kind of switches and routers on stand offs real easy flat against the wall there.

For the most part switches are switches, but those ones you selected, you're paying a premium for their physical design.

Connecting the Netgear router in AP only mode in a central location is the best choice I think, simple. Other options once you want to know about networking.

 

[imagoon]

I would recommend not using any OnQ router, you want a real one that has firmware update support.
For a wired only compact model, look at the Ubiquiti Edgemax lite model, less than $100.
http://www.ubnt.com/edgemax#EdgeMAXhardware

You can mount these kind of switches and routers on stand offs real easy flat against the wall there.

For the most part switches are switches, but those ones you selected, you're paying a premium for their physical design.

Connecting the Netgear router in AP only mode in a central location is the best choice I think, simple. Other options once you want to know about networking.

Agreed. Esp since you can get far better for cheaper. Like my post above: way more expensive because it is "designer." The metal box it self is very expensive, much more than something commercial.

 

[WackyDan]

I'll just address this at this time. Neither will take over anything that you tell them not to touch. If you tell both installers that those external cables are not for them, then they won't touch them.

That being said, Direct TV will need to get the dish cable into the house somewhere. If they can run the cable into the same hole there, then great.

Same goes for Comcast, they will need to get a cable into the house somewhere.

You have some time before the 10th. Think about where you want the cables to come in. In my opinion, closer to the cabinet the better. The thing to remember when dealing with Telco's is to have a realistic picture of what you want in the end. You can always change stuff around on your own later, but if you get it the way you want the first time...even better. Be assertive.

Again, if both Comcast and Direct TV can get a cable through that hole, and it's close to the box, then awesome.

I'll be back to comment on the rest eventually, it's New year's Eve though


Are the network cables actually labeled as Cat 6e?

There are two Rg6 outside the house. One is for Sat and one is for cable if the cable system is also using Rg6 drops to the house. Both those coax cables home run back to that panel. They don't need to fish anything to the panel at all.

 

[frush73]

So sorry for the stupid questions and again thanks for the input. So how does this sound?

Cable Internet (Comcast)
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Motorola SURFboard 3.0 SBG6580 Cable Modem
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Ubiquiti Edgemax lite model (router) - thanks for the recommendation!
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Gigabit Switch (Per the cabinet, what switch would you guys recommend to go into the cabinet?)
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Connect the Netgear WNDR3700v2 wireless router to one of the drops in the house to act as an access point
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Enclosure Power Strip Module, Half-Width (I know I would pay a premium, but it would take minimal space in the cabinet --- open to recommendations and biases to manufacturer I should install in the cabinet instead)

 

[frush73]

Because Ubiquiti Edgemax lite model is a router with two ports, does that mean I can connect two switches to it?

 

[ch33zw1z]

There are two Rg6 outside the house. One is for Sat and one is for cable if the cable system is also using Rg6 drops to the house. Both those coax cables home run back to that panel. They don't need to fish anything to the panel at all.

Yes, unless the OP had other plans for them. If not, then using those for Direct TV and Comcast is perfect.

 

[ch33zw1z]

Because Ubiquiti Edgemax lite model is a router with two ports, does that mean I can connect two switches to it?

that's correct.

You can also connect connect switches together, and then the chain or "stack" of switches to the router also.

 

[frush73]

The low-voltage company stated today they are going to re-cable manage everything via utilizing all three punch outs (left one for 1st floor CAT6E, middle for RG6 and telephone, and right one for 2nd floor CAT6E) to make things look a bit more aesthetically pleasing, redo the labeling following TIA-606-A guidelines and move everything as high possible leaving the CAT6E data/network cables hanging. The tech will perform the job Monday. I will post pictures of the completed job for y’all feedback.

 

[smitbret]

I use Ethernet with SWM. That way I didn't have to buy that little media gateway box. One less device doesn't make it pointless. It also consumes a SWM channel which reduces the device count which actually matters to me.

Depending on the particular models of IRD(s), the "media gateway box" (aka Cinema Connection Kit or Broadband Adapter) may not even be necessary. A network connected HR34 will deliver the network connection to all devices in the house. An HR44 has a built in wireless connection and does the same thing, providing a network connection to any location on the system.

Depending on how you connect the CCK, it may take up a coax connection on the multi-switch but using the CCK affects the number of SWM channels in absolutely no way. You will have 8 tuners available for your tuners or 16 if you have a SWM16 installed

 

[JoeMcJoe]

Because Ubiquiti Edgemax lite model is a router with two ports, does that mean I can connect two switches to it?

Here is a quickstart guide, showing you how to mount it too.

http://dl.ubnt.com/guides/edgemax/EdgeRouter_Lite_QSG.pdf

and the EdgeOS user guide.
http://dl.ubnt.com/guides/edgemax/EdgeOS_UG.pdf

Plug the Cable Modem into port 1 and use port 2 or 3 to connect to the switches.
The router is very configurable. Update the firmware when/if you get it.