Digital Foundry: next-gen PlayStation and Xbox to use AMD's 8-core CPU and Radeon HD

[dastral]

I'm still surprised they went with x86 jaja
Is all this info mostly xbox Next? Main question being, by the rumors, are both MS and Sony using Jaguar cores?

X86 is by far the best possible choice, as you have a zero learning curve.
Using "Standard" GPU will also facilitate coding & porting, having a "fixed numbers of cores" and "less layers (API)" will make everything even easier. (1 core for IA, 1 core for Physics, 1 core for Kinect, etc etc).

I'm surprised they didn't go that route sooner.

 

[USER8000]

I put the following in the Temesh and Kabini thread,but realised it is more relevant here!!

SemiAccurate leaked this in 2011:

http://semiaccurate.com/2011/10/27/amd-far-future-prototype-gpu-pictured/

http://semiaccurate.com/forums/showpost.php?p=140928&postcount=26

http://semiaccurate.com/forums/showpost.php?p=144203&postcount=35

There is a better picture in this document:

http://www.i-micronews.com/upload/Rapports/3D_Silicon_&Glass_Interposers_sample_2012.pdf

i.imgur.com/I634RfM.jpg

Amkor lists gaming consoles and Sony in the same segment,so it appears,the arrangement is being used for the GPU in the PS4 with stacked memory.

 

[VulgarDisplay]

http://kotaku.com/5977849/the-plays...ncy-user-accounts-and-impressive-specs-so-far

From about a half hour ago.

PS4 specs, and these sound real. They are saying this comes from the official "Orbis" documentation.

System Memory: 8GB
Video Memory: 2.2 GB
CPU: 4x Dual-Core AMD64 "Bulldozer" (so, 8x cores)
GPU: AMD R10xx
Ports: 4x USB 3.0, 2x Ethernet
Drive: Blu-Ray
HDD 160GB
Audio Output: HDMI & Optical, 2.0, 5.1 & 7.1 channels

The 160gb HD is for the dev kit, the actual console will probably have more. Although I would gladly take a 160ssd in the consoles. Could see some interesting things with texture streaming off an SSD.

 

[inf64]

Thanks for sharing the link!
These specs look far more believable than previous "Jaguar core" rumor. This might be a custom made 4 module Piledriver part. I wonder what is the GPU supposed to be? Radeon R10xx? Is that GCN based or not and is it on the same die? Anyway CPU part is maybe a little overpowered but it's good news for AMD as the games will probably be coded for this architecture in mind and with multithreading support.

 

[moonbogg]

http://kotaku.com/5977849/the-plays...ncy-user-accounts-and-impressive-specs-so-far

From about a half hour ago.

PS4 specs, and these sound real. They are saying this comes from the official "Orbis" documentation.

System Memory: 8GB
Video Memory: 2.2 GB
CPU: 4x Dual-Core AMD64 "Bulldozer" (so, 8x cores)
GPU: AMD R10xx
Ports: 4x USB 3.0, 2x Ethernet
Drive: Blu-Ray
HDD 160GB
Audio Output: HDMI & Optical, 2.0, 5.1 & 7.1 channels

The 160gb HD is for the dev kit, the actual console will probably have more. Although I would gladly take a 160ssd in the consoles. Could see some interesting things with texture streaming off an SSD.

I wonder what the reason to go with AMD was. I assume price but I just don't know. I guess bulldozer is fast enough for a console. Anyway, I am happy seeing those specs. I get the feeling this will be great for PC gaming.

 

[MightyMalus]

X86 is by far the best possible choice, as you have a zero learning curve.
Using "Standard" GPU will also facilitate coding & porting, having a "fixed numbers of cores" and "less layers (API)" will make everything even easier. (1 core for IA, 1 core for Physics, 1 core for Kinect, etc etc).

I'm surprised they didn't go that route sooner.

I said surprised. I know x86 should have been the obvious choice, heck, the fact that the 360 didn't use it was unexpected for me.

But, I did think that they were gonna go ARM and push gaming towards that end.

 

[Arzachel]

One advantage AMD might have had in the competition for next gen console chips, is its licensable and not too slow x86 core, or better, CU. This in addition to licensable GPU logic.

That's purpose built to be low cost, low power and portable to different fabs and process nodes with as little modification as possible. AMD themselves said that they're aiming to partially adopt a business model similar to that of ARM with Jaguar, and have made it as appealing as they can to possible licensees.

 

[Arzachel]

You cant sell a x86 license design. Only the GPU part. So AMD would have to manufactor and sell all x86 based components. Also one of the big "issues" with the rumours.

AMD isn't exactly the one doing the manufacturing right now, isn't it?

http://kotaku.com/5977849/the-plays...ncy-user-accounts-and-impressive-specs-so-far

From about a half hour ago.

These could be the specs of the dev kit, but aren't likely to be the final specs

 

[amdisstaying]

http://semiaccurate.com/forums/showpost.php?p=176242&postcount=4

Today, 12:39 PM
charlie
Administrator

"Two CPU wins, PS4 and XBox Next, and GPUs in all 3."

I know Charlie isn't always right. I give Charlie the benefit of doubt.

Off-topic:

http://phx.corporate-ir.net/phoenix.zhtml?c=74093&p=irol-newsArticle&ID=1776993&highlight=

AMD Bolsters Engineering Talent With Appointment of Two Technology Experts

Why is Qualcomm & Apple employees joining AMD?

Isn't AMD a Technology Leader? Yes.

 

[BrightCandle]

It makes a lot of sense for them to make consoles out of x86 processors. AMD was probably much more willing than Intel to do some customisations to make the processor do well in these sorts of workloads and could also provide the GPU. Intel is far from a good partner for this sort of thing, they don't play well with others and any attempts to customise what they bring. Intel makes CPUs and you choose which models you want.

Using standard mass production parts will make it cheaper to design the consoles and AMD brings all the skills they need to make the hardware, something Intel nor ARM can do. Besides Arm really doesn't scale up to these power and performance workloads.

 

[Face2Face]

So does this mean that we may get some PC games eventually to take advantage of 8 cores? This may be a big deal for AMD, could it be possible for CPU's like Bulldozer to equal core i5 and i7 gaming performance once games can take advantage of 8 cores...?

 

[nehalem256]

I wonder what the reason to go with AMD was. I assume price but I just don't know. I guess bulldozer is fast enough for a console. Anyway, I am happy seeing those specs. I get the feeling this will be great for PC gaming.

The problem is that bulldozer is a huge die and power hungry. Not exactly good for a console.

Maybe the dev kit shipped with bulldozer since it was the only Octocore around?

 

[dagamer34]

http://kotaku.com/5977849/the-plays...ncy-user-accounts-and-impressive-specs-so-far

From about a half hour ago.

PS4 specs, and these sound real. They are saying this comes from the official "Orbis" documentation.

System Memory: 8GB
Video Memory: 2.2 GB
CPU: 4x Dual-Core AMD64 "Bulldozer" (so, 8x cores)
GPU: AMD R10xx
Ports: 4x USB 3.0, 2x Ethernet
Drive: Blu-Ray
HDD 160GB
Audio Output: HDMI & Optical, 2.0, 5.1 & 7.1 channels

The 160gb HD is for the dev kit, the actual console will probably have more. Although I would gladly take a 160ssd in the consoles. Could see some interesting things with texture streaming off an SSD.

I also wouldn't expect 2xEthernet or 8GB of RAM in retail models, since devkits almost always have more RAM (and 2x ethernet is silly for a shipping console).

Also, after reading this thread, I haven't heard most people comment on the fact that both consoles will probably have 1-2 cores reserved for system use for background tasks. I certainly expect the next Xbox to clearly be designed with a STB feel to with, with the ability to record TV, take a Skype call, watch Netflix, etc.. all without having to dump whatever game someone is playing.

 

[inf64]

The problem is that bulldozer is a huge die and power hungry. Not exactly good for a console.

Maybe the dev kit shipped with bulldozer since it was the only Octocore around?

AMD has locked the CPU deal with both IBM and Sony for both next gen consoles. Same goes for GPU in both of these products. They are providing the GPU only in WiiU.
So whatever it ends up being in xbox next and ps4 it will either be custom PD/SR X8 or X4 part with possible on die GPU.

 

[Concillian]

I wonder what the reason to go with AMD was. I assume price but I just don't know. I guess bulldozer is fast enough for a console. Anyway, I am happy seeing those specs. I get the feeling this will be great for PC gaming.

Who else are they going to go with?

Because of the Xbox / nVidia issues that happened with the Xbox360... with nVidia wanting MS to pay through the nose for a die shrink or was it not letting them integrate the GPU onto CPU to save cost once processes got small enough... I forget. Regardless, they are asking for rights to the design so they can have it fabbed on their own if they want. Who else will agree to those kinds of terms? Definitely not Intel, so that's right out. Not nVidia either, so they're out... That leaves CPU options of ARM, IBM, and AMD and Graphics options of AMD or PowerVR (lol).

You think these would be better off with PowerPC or ARM cores? I don't.

 

[nehalem256]

AMD has locked the CPU deal with both IBM and Sony for both next gen consoles. Same goes for GPU in both of these products. They are providing the GPU only in WiiU.
So whatever it ends up being in xbox next and ps4 it will either be custom PD/SR X8 or X4 part with possible on die GPU.

Or the a fore theorized Jaguar x8 part.

 

[cplusplus]

AMD isn't exactly the one doing the manufacturing right now, isn't it?



These could be the specs of the dev kit, but aren't likely to be the final specs

The article itself says that these are the specs of the current dev kit, and that they likely won't be the same specs as the console. They might not even be the final dev kit specs, for all we know. Double-Ethernet is definitely out, there probably won't be as much RAM, and it still leaves the possibility for 8 core Jaguar instead of Bulldozer.

 

[ShintaiDK]

Who else are they going to go with?

Because of the Xbox / nVidia issues that happened with the Xbox360...

Xbox360 uses AMD...

 

[cplusplus]

Xbox360 uses AMD...

It was the original Xbox that Microsoft had problems with nVidia with. They got stuck paying the cost of the GPU at launch well into the console cycle.

 

[ElFenix]

Who else are they going to go with?

Because of the Xbox / nVidia issues that happened with the Xbox360... with nVidia wanting MS to pay through the nose for a die shrink or was it not letting them integrate the GPU onto CPU to save cost once processes got small enough... I forget. Regardless, they are asking for rights to the design so they can have it fabbed on their own if they want. Who else will agree to those kinds of terms? Definitely not Intel, so that's right out. Not nVidia either, so they're out... That leaves CPU options of ARM, IBM, and AMD and Graphics options of AMD or PowerVR (lol).

You think these would be better off with PowerPC or ARM cores? I don't.

iirc intel wasn't particularly accommodating to MS with trying to shrink the xbox cpu either. as later year profitability for consoles depends on getting more processes onto the same piece of silicon, MS got burned by its "partners" and killed the xbox a little earlier than it otherwise might have (ps2 to ps3 was nearly 3 years longer than the xbox to 720).

 

[ShintaiDK]

It was the original Xbox that Microsoft had problems with nVidia with. They got stuck paying the cost of the GPU at launch well into the console cycle.

Actually the issue with Xbox1 was the CPU. It costed the same throughout its life. Seems its gonna be repeated. The GPU was a license that Microsoft was in full control over.

 

[MightyMalus]

Actually the issue with Xbox1 was the CPU. It costed the same throughout its life. Seems its gonna be repeated. The GPU was a license that Microsoft was in full control over.

Why does it seem its gonna be repeated?

 

[Enigmoid]

Is this rumour true?

http://www.tomsguide.com/us/Xbox-720-X-Surface-Rumors-Hoax,news-16653.html

or is it just a joke?

 

[inf64]

No that's a joke. The guy wanted to see how easy it is to spread false info/disinfo by claiming to have inside knowledge about nextgen xbox. It worked great lol.

 

[ShintaiDK]

LoL.