DFI or ASUS

datamestonic

Member
Nov 8, 2005
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I searched for this and found somewhat useful threads but not exaclty what I wanted to ask.

I was planning on getting the ASUS A8N32-SLI Deluxe Socket 939 for my 4400+ dual core and SLI system that I will be building. This is the first time I'm building a computer on my own, I've only done upgrades and things in the past but I thought it would be a fun project to build one.

Anyway my question is, is there a similar board by DFI that I should consider instead?

Which one is better price-wise? Is one or the other easier to install or setup with things like dual layer RAM or SLI setups or SATA HDDs?

I don't plan to overclock but it would be nice to know that I could later on if I change my mind...
 

QuixoticOne

Golden Member
Nov 4, 2005
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Hi -- this is DFI's latest and hopefully greatest board.
It's VERY new, and is still in the process of becoming available through retail sales.
In that respect it's similar to the ASUS A8N32, which is also the ASUS "latest and greatest"
model, is very new, and is still in the process of becoming readily available through retailers.

They're both NVIDIA chipset boards, and are essentially incremental improvements
over the other other dozens of Nvidia N-Force 4 (NF4) series of chipset based motherboards.


LANPARTY UT NF4 SLI-DR Expert
http://www.dfi.com.tw/Product/xx_produc..._ID=3872&CATEGORY_TYPE=LP%20UT&SITE=NA

The main differences that I know of are
a) the ASUS uses a substantially newer NVIDIA NF4 chipset, and it's a two-chip solution
rather than the 1-chip one used in essentially all other NVIDIA NF4 series motherboards.
The extra chip and capabilities added on the ASUS gives it the opportunity to have
two PCI EXPRESS true x16 slots running in X16 width mode simultaneously, so each
graphics card of a SLI pair of graphics cards would have the ultimate possible speed
and bandwidth in talking to the rest of the motherboard. In practice this in
itself is of only very questionable practical benefit because in almost all real world
cases, graphics cards just don't come close to needing as much speed and PCI-Express
handwidth as X16 offers, so really a X16 slot split into serving two cards (as ALL other
SLI motherboards now available do) is probably just fine.

b) the ASUS has an "8-phase" CPU power generation circuit. basically there are
eight voltage regulators that all share equally in the task of generating the approximately
90 watts of power an X2 4400 needs to run. During the peak demands of intense
computation and when overclocking, you CPU could be using well over 100 Watts of
power, and that is quite a lot. Most other motherboards divide the CPU power
generation task among either three or four voltage regulators, that end up being
on the verge of being overloaded with an X2 4400's power needs. The 3-phase
and 4-phase voltage regulation circuits common on most motherboards therefore
run at undesirably high temperatures, and they are not so capable as giving a
stable, clean, high capacity flow of power to your CPU as the ASUS's 8 phase
circuit seems to be. The ripples and "noise" in the CPU power from inadequate
3 or 4 phase voltage regulators may contribute to system crashes when overclocking
and under intense computational loads, especially if the airflow, heatsinking, cooling
of the power regulators and inside the case isn't extemly good.

c) The ASUS has its chipset and some of its CPU power regulators cooled by heatsinks
connected together with special copper "heat pipe" units. This brings the heat from
the chipset chips and transports it up the pipe to the heatsink near the rear of the
motherboard where it is better able to be cooled by airflow in the case. This
eliminates the noise, unreliability, bulkiness, and power requirements of having
heatsinks with their own little fans on the mothrboard chipset. The ASUS design
supposedly works well and can result in superior quietness and cooling for your
motherboard.

d) the way they arranged the amount and type of regular old style PCI slots and
other slots is different, so you may have preference for one or the other depending
on how many cards of what types you'll put into the PC. The main complaint about
the ASUS slots is that if you use two PCI Express graphics cards simultaneously
in SLI mode, it's a tight squeze to fit two or three regular PCI cards into the same
motherboard as the two PCIE SLI graphics cards. In some extreme configurations
with unusually large (ones purchased seperately and manually retrofitted onto the
graphics cards by the end user) graphics card heatsinks that take up two slots of
space as opposed to the standard one-slot-wide ones, you end up with only
a single free PCI slot, and that one can't have an unusually tall card in it since
it'll have to fit underneath the SLI bridge between the SLI PCIE gfx cards.

Anyway Anandtech reviews gave a VERY favorable review of the
ASUS for its quality, features, and overclocking performance.
http://anandtech.com/mb/showdoc.aspx?i=2589

The ASUS board beat the DFI Expert board to market by about two weeks.
I was impressed by the 8-phase power supply and other quality features of the
ASUS board. ASUS is well reputed for makng stable, reliable, well performing
motherboards, and this one may be the best they've made yet if you're into
overclocking X2 or FX or similar CPUs.

DFI usually has several more highly technical and obscure BIOS settings for
minutely detailed timings of the RAM chips and things like that than other mothrboard
companies usually provide. This is handy for some extreme overclockers, but most
people can achieve a decent overclock on decent CPUs / RAM sticks without even
using 70% of the manual adjustment features the DFI BIOS supplies.

ASUS has a decent set of BIOS overclocking / timing / voltage / frequency control
options in the A8N32 BIOS. A much better set of options than the fairly decent ones
they've had on their past motherboards. I think that the vast majority of people will
never need much more than the timing / voltage / overclocking options the ASUS
provides, even if they're overclocking for practical purposes.

DFI's got a fairly sketchy reputation for "quirks", "bugs" and "finicky" weird problems
that creep into their BIOS software versions and to a lesser extent into the hardware
of their mothrboards. I think all companies have this to SOME extent, but it impresses
me that DFI has had it with some boards to such an extent that the only reasonable
conclusion that one can draw is that they've got incompetence and mismanagement
going on in their quality control, engineering, and BIOS / technical support departments.
Some people have had DFI motherboards that were virtually unusable for months
until DFI finally decided to come out with a working BIOS fix to some very simple
and serious problems with some of their motherboards. It's enough to make be
wary about trusting that I'm going to have an easy, fun, quick experience of getting
the most out of a new computer built with a new model of DFI motherboard.
Six months from now, I'm sure they'll have ironed out most of the bugs.. Until then,
well, I would be careful trusting the thing to work quite right.
In very extreme cases some people have even physically burned out RAM sticks
and CPUs and their DFI mothrboards because of badly designed motherboard features
that weren't working quite right either in the hardware or in the BIOS.

I put my money where my mouth is and bought the A8N32 ASUS board.
It was available 2-weeks sooner than the DFI, and all the features I feel I really
need, and I have more trust in the quality and reliability of it, especially it being
a new revision product, than I would with a DFI board.

I'd suggest you do the same. I think the DFI probably has a 4-phase CPU power
circuit which is probably borderline "ok", but for my $500 X2 I really thought the
extra quality of the ASUS board's 8-phase CPU power supply was useful and worthy.

I'm sure more reviews of the DFI Expert and A8N32 will be posted in the next two
weeks. I'm building my A8N32 X2 box tomorrow, and will post some results when
I finish.

It can be hard to find a store with EITHER the DFI or the ASUS board in stock now
since they're both new, but if you look around, I bet you can find the ASUS more
quickly and cheaply than the DFI...

 

datamestonic

Member
Nov 8, 2005
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Wow... Thank you so much for spending the time to reply with that post. That was very indepth, exactly what I was looking for. And you're very convincing, I'm certainly sold on the ASUS board now =)

Thanks again!
 

shiznit

Senior member
Nov 16, 2004
424
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81
and if it wasnt for the RETARDED layout i would sell my dfi and get the asus imediately. as its is, there is no way for me to use sli and my soundblaster on that asus.
 

datamestonic

Member
Nov 8, 2005
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Originally posted by: shiznit
and if it wasnt for the RETARDED layout i would sell my dfi and get the asus imediately. as its is, there is no way for me to use sli and my soundblaster on that asus.

Really? That's not good that's the same sound card I was planning on getting...
 

SPQQKY

Senior member
Jul 6, 2004
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Why not? You can put your Audigy in the slot above the bottom PCI-E slot or under it. The new bridge is also a flexible one, not a solid pcb like previous bridges which helps for working other components between gfx cards. With 8 phase power regulation (amazing) and great features, if I had the dough I'd be all over that Asus.
 

shiznit

Senior member
Nov 16, 2004
424
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but stock gpu cooling is loud and there's no room for aftermarket coolin on asus. i guess it could be done with the zalman if you dont use the bottom pci slot, but theres no way to use 2 nv silencers. also good luck fitting any kind of cooling on the 2nd graphics slot if you have to use the bottom pci slot. look at the layout of the new MSI sli board, much better. now if creative would come out with a pci-e 1x card, i would use the top slot and shut up.
 

Skott

Diamond Member
Oct 4, 2005
5,730
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The new x32 SLI mobos are new and IMO I couldnt reccomend one company over another since they are so new and little is known about them. From the official reviews I have seen so far (and I constantly watch for them and read them) I'm dissapointed with the reviewers. They really dont touch on wether extra pci cards will fit with two video cards or not. This creates problems for us consumers. What to get? What works?

A couple people that post here got some mobos this week so we should get some reliable info soon. Also MSI and ABIT got their versions coming out soon as well. So right now we're just at the tip of the x32 iceberg.
 

shiznit

Senior member
Nov 16, 2004
424
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agreed. i just read that someone that posts on xtremesystems.org got one of these boards to test (i guess he's in the biz), and reported that it has killed 2 cpu's already, and he overclocked only one of them. even if i liked the layout i wouldnt buy one any more until i had more information. i would wait for other reports to come in, and maybe the next revision board to come out. first revisions usually have issues and the price might be lower by then.
 

datamestonic

Member
Nov 8, 2005
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Grrr... I've been reading around alot on this now as well, so much chaos going on haha. I'm just about ready to give up on this SLI idea and just get a 7800 512 when it comes out. But don't quote me on that.
 

Capt Caveman

Lifer
Jan 30, 2005
34,543
651
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Actually, the DFI-SLI Expert should be available in quantity by the end of the week where the Asus A8N32-SLI won't be available in quantity for another couple of weeks. Monarch is shipping the DFI-SLI Expert this friday. Mwave and Newegg only had a couple of the A8N32-SLI and do not have a time table for new availability and everyone's else is showing ETA's as early as Nov 17 to the 25.

Also, at xtremesystems, one person has had two cpus die on his A8N32-SLI while another can't get their SATA drives recognized. I was planning on upgrading to the A8N32-SLI but plan to wait to see for more feedback from owners.
 

Madellga

Senior member
Sep 9, 2004
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I used to like Asus but got tired of cold boot issues - rig would not start unless a warm boot/reset was done (several different socket A boards) and with an episode which a mobo had sudden death within 3 months (it was the first Nforce2 from Asus, don't recall the model name). This board was running at default clock, using an Enermax PSU.

Since then, I had a couple of Gigabytes and MSIs - no problems, but sold them while upgrading.

I have now a DFI and I'm very happy with it. Top quality (japanese capacitors), top performance. Requires Bios "education" though, you have to learn a lot before getting the most of the mobo.

As long as DFI makes products like this one, I will be buying from them.

As for bugged products, I think this might be the NF3 S.939 board. I friend of mine bought one but can't run it at stock. He tried to RMA but DFI blames PSU, CPU, memory etc. He is not experienced so it is possible he is missing something also.
 

Cheezeit

Diamond Member
Apr 21, 2005
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DFI is great, even for beginners. They are usually sterotyped as being only a good deal for overclocking and all that, but thats not really accurate. I used a DFI ultra-d for my first build, and everything went out perfectly. I did my good share of research so I just got all my parts, slapped them together and hit the power button. Everything worked great and fine. I just installed windows and was ready to roll.

So compared to the ASUS, here are some homework i haven't forgotten.

*The DFI has a much more potential OC if you decide thats what you are going for.

*The DFI is known to be very stable although the ASUS dosent seem lacking in that shape.

*The DFI chipset fan is way better. Its quiet enough and dosent break within a month like that huge ASUS chipset fan crisis.

*The DFI board has firewire with it while the ASUS does not, so if you need it for an IPOD, camera or something, its there.

*DFI the overall company has great support, with its own forums at www.dfi-street.com employed with two DFI engineers.

I used to like ASUS alot, but their quality has really gone downhill. The Intel side of their boards are awesome, but they have really been lagging back for the AMD side. They just arn't what they were before. So for now, my recommendation goes to DFI.

Ah wait, I just realized you were talking about the SLI boards and the new ones comming out. Sorry, I don't know too much about that so some of the things I just rambled about might not apply. :p

Anyways, hope that helps and PM me if you have any questions.;)
 

caz67

Golden Member
Jan 4, 2004
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Simple rules to remember. If you overclock DFI always, if you aren't then Asus offers the best board, features and stability.
 

Arcanedeath

Platinum Member
Jan 29, 2000
2,822
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The new Asus board looks good but I'm wary of their bios support, I've just had such horrible luck w/ the Asus bioses in the past (A7N8X 2.0 Deluxe and CUSL2 mostly) that as good as their hardware is I'm just sick of all the bios bugs, then again DFI isn't much better in this reguard, but it OC's better :) I'm guessing the new 8 phase power design may actualy OC better w/ Dual Core CPU's unless you have active cooling on the power circutry for the DFI or really good case airflow. so its kinda a toss up, I've already got a DFI NF4 SLI-DR that I'm sticking with .
 

shiznit

Senior member
Nov 16, 2004
424
13
81
im gonna mod my dfi to sli and go from there. when this new asus has proven itself i might get it, if i can figure out how to work with the layout.
 

Chacranajxy

Member
Oct 18, 2005
142
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I had the same question a little while back but I decided to go with the DFI simply because it's supposed to be fast, stable, and really really good for overclocking. If you go the 512MB GTX route or only get one card instead of going SLI, definitely get the DFI Ultra D.
 

Capt Caveman

Lifer
Jan 30, 2005
34,543
651
126
A couple of corrections:

Asus boards except a few have firewire onboard. And they also external SATA connectors.

New Asus boards don't have the chipset fan issue. And Asus's newer higher-end boards use a passive heatsink, bypassing the need for a chipset fan at all.

Originally posted by: Cheezeit
DFI is great, even for beginners. They are usually sterotyped as being only a good deal for overclocking and all that, but thats not really accurate. I used a DFI ultra-d for my first build, and everything went out perfectly. I did my good share of research so I just got all my parts, slapped them together and hit the power button. Everything worked great and fine. I just installed windows and was ready to roll.

So compared to the ASUS, here are some homework i haven't forgotten.

*The DFI has a much more potential OC if you decide thats what you are going for.

*The DFI is known to be very stable although the ASUS dosent seem lacking in that shape.

*The DFI chipset fan is way better. Its quiet enough and dosent break within a month like that huge ASUS chipset fan crisis.

*The DFI board has firewire with it while the ASUS does not, so if you need it for an IPOD, camera or something, its there.

*DFI the overall company has great support, with its own forums at www.dfi-street.com employed with two DFI engineers.

I used to like ASUS alot, but their quality has really gone downhill. The Intel side of their boards are awesome, but they have really been lagging back for the AMD side. They just arn't what they were before. So for now, my recommendation goes to DFI.

Ah wait, I just realized you were talking about the SLI boards and the new ones comming out. Sorry, I don't know too much about that so some of the things I just rambled about might not apply. :p

Anyways, hope that helps and PM me if you have any questions.;)

 

INM8

Senior member
Sep 20, 2005
274
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Go for the ASUS simply because its newer tech. DFI should have went SLI X16 too. I like the heatpipe cooler ASUS use, it definatly beats those damm chipset fans. Lets face it, most people who buy the DFI will take their chipset fan off and put something else there anyway.

I have got an Asus A8N Premium, and i have had no problems with it so far. I have used Gigabyte in the past, and their boards have been reliable too.

Im sure you'd be happy with both the DFI and the ASUS. The only reason you should go for the ASUS is that its newer tech, and as we've seen in reviews, that newer tech makes a difference. Unless the DFI is substantially cheaper, id go for the Asus on the grounds of futureproofing.

GL choosing and ENJOY :)
 

QuixoticOne

Golden Member
Nov 4, 2005
1,855
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Work for ASUS? No, actually the A8N32 is my first ASUS motherboard.
I've just been researching the ASUS / DFI / Grouper boards for a few months
anxious to build the best X2 box I could for overall stability and functionality.

I just finished putting the A8N32 + X2 4400 together last night and I'm still loading
software on it. So far so good, I'm happy with the way it's working, minus
the usual Windows / driver glitches you have with any system.

 

evilKat

Junior Member
Nov 12, 2005
1
0
0
I have a major question about the DFI motherboard and no one can seem to give me a straight answer for it. According to the spec sheet for this board:


From: (http://www.dfi.com.tw/Product/xx_pr...LP%20UT&SITE=US)

Single VGA mode
- 1 PCI Express graphics card on the PCIE1 slot operates at x16 bandwidth.
- The other PCI Express x16 slot (PCIE4) operates at x2 bandwidth.

Now what the hell does that mean?

Looking at the layout for Dual card mode seems simple enuff:

x8
x1
x4
x8

Total: 21 lanes

But single:

x16
x1
x??
x??

It could be (based on the spec):

x16
x1
x2
x2

But that would be insane! That means the x4 slot will be running at half speed What if you want to upgrade ur machine with a Physx card later on down the road? You could run into a bottle neck issue there

Does anyone know what exactly DFI is doing with the lane allocations?

Why didn't they do
x16
x1
x4
x0

=(

Confused.
 

g0dMAn

Lifer
Nov 10, 2005
12,499
5
81
This is exactly the thread I've been looking for.

I need to choose between the two as well.