Detroit Water Act: Inhumane or Necessary

[shortylickens]

Thats the way we feel about healthcare in Canada actually.

No you dont.
You think it should cost 4 out of every 7 dollars you make.

 

[vi edit]

Flow regulating seems like a reasonable compromise to this. Not sure what the actual work effort and cost effectiveness is from the utility side though to do it on a mass scale. Aren't flow regulators buried somewhere between the house and the curb?

 

[boomerang]

In the case of Detroit, you have a perfect storm. A city built on a single industry that collapsed. Which led to wealthy people and businesses packing up and leaving. Which eroded both the the tax and capital bases. Which exacerbated the unemployment issue. Now the city has to deal with raising rates of crime and poverty, and has no money left to deal with them because they can't get loans.

I'm sorry but I have to correct this misunderstanding whenever I read it. The decline of Detroit started in the 60's. Detroit did not fall because the auto companies got competition from overseas. Detroit was already in its death throes at that point. Detroit declined because of the tenure of 50+ years of elected officials with the same fiscal philosophies that were doomed to failure.

 

[roguerower]

Flow regulating seems like a reasonable compromise to this. Not sure what the actual work effort and cost effectiveness is from the utility side though to do it on a mass scale. Aren't flow regulators buried somewhere between the house and the curb?

Exactly. Not sure how they can regulate the water without hitting up the gate valve at each residence unless it's already built into the infrastructure. They could probably limit large sections, but then those who ARE paying their bills are unjustly affected.

 

[Northern Lawn]

No you dont.
You think it should cost 4 out of every 7 dollars you make.

We pay half per capita then what americans pay and get the superior health care because we cut out the middlemen. There is no insurance agents between us and our doctor deciding what we need and don't.

 

[soulcougher73]

It is neccessary to thin the gene pool at times.

 

[Exterous]

I agree that people should pay their bills, but I'm sick of this kind of idiocy. "You don't have money because you spent it all on luxuries." Some people are just broke, asshole.

The lowest 20% spends $450 a year on alcohol and tobacco so its a good bet, statistically, that a fair number of these delinquents accounts had money spent on alcohol and tobacco instead of the water bill

http://www.bls.gov/cex/csxann12.pdf

But Detroit is so fucking awful that 'city hires people to loosely enforce nationwide standard restricting paid utilities to people who are paying for them' is a headline? Jesus christ Detroit.

Honestly its not that big of a headline in the area and many welcome it. A minor ruckus from a couple dozen protesters and a single congressman

I'm sorry but I have to correct this misunderstanding whenever I read it. The decline of Detroit started in the 60's. Detroit did not fall because the auto companies got competition from overseas. Detroit was already in its death throes at that point. Detroit declined because of the tenure of 50+ years of elected officials with the same fiscal philosophies that were doomed to failure.

Thats not entirely true either. The population peaked in the 1950s and was already declining by the 1960s. In the mid to late 50s the auto industry, which had been centered in the city, began to decentralize their operations. Driven by a mix of politics, city taxes\land costs, racial tensions, the rise of the freeway and the high car ownership of the region the auto industry moved fairly quickly out of the city itself

 

[Angry Irishman]

Has nothing to do with Obama....thank God you cannot ask McCain or Romney...

Yea but it has everything to do with this culture of free entitlement. It just so happens that Mr. Obama usually is advocating adding gas to that fire. Detroit is a perfect example of where this country is heading.

 

[surfsatwerk]

Yea but it has everything to do with this culture of free entitlement. It just so happens that Mr. Obama usually is advocating adding gas to that fire. Detroit is a perfect example of where this country is heading.

Get back in your hole

http://forums.anandtech.com/forumdisplay.php?f=24

 

[CPA]

Feds have no jurisdiction in this issue and should not.

 

[Angry Irishman]

Get back in your hole

http://forums.anandtech.com/forumdisplay.php?f=24

Great response....all our problems are solved.

 

[surfsatwerk]

Great response....all our problems are solved.

It's terrible, now git.

 

[cubby1223]

Drinking water is a basic human right it should be free.

How do you make it "free"?

Someone has to build the products that collect the water. Someone has to collect the water. Someone has to maintain the products that collect the water. Build the products that clean the water. Perform the cleaning of the water. Maintain those products. Someone has to build & maintain the products that distribute the water.

How do you accomplish all that work with all those materials at no cost?

You could accomplish your tasks through enslaving the population into working for you at no cost... short of that, is there any other option to providing free drinking water?

 

[cubby1223]

I don't have a problem with it as an attention getting device. Get the people that can pay to pay, and the ones that are really poor should be given the water.

Regarding water as human right... I also tend to agree with that. All things being equal, I'd say people should be forced to forage their own water(if they don't want to pay). No one has a right to free delivery, but since most water has been polluted under the government's watch, it should be treated and given free. They broke it; they should fix it.

How exactly does government fix it for free? They charge you taxes then you forget about it and suddenly feel all warm and squishy inside when a politician says you are receiving these products and services for free?

And, water wasn't exactly sparking clean before the industrial revolution polluted waters. All sorts of nasty natural bacteria and parasites, feces from other living creatures...

 

[Angry Irishman]

It's terrible, now git.

Actually I thought this was P&N...my mistake. That said, I'll give the generic response for a topic that should be in P&N:

Yes, I think the water should be shut off or brought to a trickle for those who aren't paying the bill.

 

[xBiffx]

Drinking water is a basic human right it should be free.

Perhaps water is a basic human right. But purified water that is engineered to be pumped right to your home and out your tap is hardly a basic human right. You wan't that kind of luxury, pay for it. Otherwise, start collecting rain water or going down to the river with a bucket and purify it yourself.

 

[dave_the_nerd]

In the case of Detroit, the state or federal government really needs to step in and take over management of the city. I'm not sure what the legal ramifications of that are, but it's a pretty disgraceful situation for the world's richest country.

State took it over in 2013. Now it's all over but the screaming.

 

[poofyhairguy]

For my utility company if I don't pay a water bill and it gets 30 days past due then on the 31st day they cut my whole house off. And often it takes 48 hours to get them to get it back on.

I don't know why this is news.

 

[networkman]

The lowest 20% spends $450 a year on alcohol and tobacco so its a good bet, statistically, that a fair number of these delinquents accounts had money spent on alcohol and tobacco instead of the water bill

http://www.bls.gov/cex/csxann12.pdf

Honestly its not that big of a headline in the area and many welcome it. A minor ruckus from a couple dozen protesters and a single congressman

Thats not entirely true either. The population peaked in the 1950s and was already declining by the 1960s. In the mid to late 50s the auto industry, which had been centered in the city, began to decentralize their operations. Driven by a mix of politics, city taxes\land costs, racial tensions, the rise of the freeway and the high car ownership of the region the auto industry moved fairly quickly out of the city itself

Well stated by a fellow Michigander! Thank you!

 

[Veliko]

Here in the UK it's illegal to cut off power and water. For those customers who get in arrears the utilities will install a pay as you go meter.

 

[pcgeek11]

Cut that shit off! No payment, no water, No exceptions.

 

[unokitty]

On Monday, the U.N. Human Rights Council’s office in Geneva confirmed to WND that the U.N. plans to intervene directly in the Detroit water crisis, determined to apply international law to judge the U.S. in violation of human rights to safe water.

Looks like the UN, through their Human Rights Council, in Geneva Switzerland, has this handled. So Detroit has that going for them which is nice.

But now a hypothetical question.

Assume your current financial situation.

Imagine that you lived in a city where about half the people didn't pay for water and the government was going to bail them out.

Would you continue to pay?

Uno

 

[Vdubchaos]

don't pay you don't get water... pretty simple. If they force them to turn the water on, whats to stop everyone everywhere from stopping to pay their water bills.

this SHOULD be the only answer really

 

[dave_the_nerd]

It's in WND, so the opposite is probably true.

 

[piasabird]

Condemn their properties and kick them out on the street.