Dems discussing siezure of 401K's, Individual Retirement Accounts; convert them into Social Security managed accounts

[Rainsford]

Man the OP (and the article) are full of complete bullshit, it's impressive, even for something from Republicans. Democrats aren't discussing anything of the sort, they LISTENED to a guy who wants to do that. On what planet is that the same thing?

You really should edit the thread title, it's a pretty transparent lie if you bother to read the article.

 

[spidey07]

I would like to think that it would never happen. But with the hairbrained stuff the house is coming up with it actually wouldn't surprise me.

 

[spidey07]

double

 

[DealMonkey]

Originally posted by: Rainsford
Man the OP (and the article) are full of complete bullshit, it's impressive, even for something from Republicans. Democrats aren't discussing anything of the sort, they LISTENED to a guy who wants to do that. On what planet is that the same thing?

You really should edit the thread title, it's a pretty transparent lie if you bother to read the article.

He didn't bother to read it - that's the thing. He just posted it right up and went off on some lame-ass rant about "socialism, hurdeehurhur."

 

[Rainsford]

Originally posted by: spidey07
I would like to think that it would never happen. But with the hairbrained stuff the house is coming up with it actually wouldn't surprise me.

I hate to burst the tin-foil bubble, but it's a ridiculous idea that no politician is going to support. Too many people have 401k accounts that any politician voting for any bill proposing it would be voted out of office the next time around.

 

[spidey07]

Originally posted by: Rainsford

Originally posted by: spidey07
I would like to think that it would never happen. But with the hairbrained stuff the house is coming up with it actually wouldn't surprise me.

I hate to burst the tin-foil bubble, but it's a ridiculous idea that no politician is going to support. Too many people have 401k accounts that any politician voting for any bill proposing it would be voted out of office the next time around.

Have you heard Barney Frank talk and his ideas? The guy is insane.

Again, you and GenX are most likely certainly correct. But some of the stuff they're proposing...I don't know man, it's dicey.

 

[Rainsford]

Originally posted by: spidey07

Originally posted by: Rainsford

Originally posted by: spidey07
I would like to think that it would never happen. But with the hairbrained stuff the house is coming up with it actually wouldn't surprise me.

I hate to burst the tin-foil bubble, but it's a ridiculous idea that no politician is going to support. Too many people have 401k accounts that any politician voting for any bill proposing it would be voted out of office the next time around.

Have you heard Barney Frank talk and his ideas? The guy is insane.

Again, you and GenX are most likely certainly correct. But some of the stuff they're proposing...I don't know man, it's dicey.

There are plenty of crazy people out there, my point is that they "they" you're talking about who are proposing this is too small a group to actually worry about. It's not "Dems", as soccerballtux and this idiot article want us to think, it's not even "some Dems" or "some politicians". It's a few nutballs who aren't going to get anywhere. I searched around, and all the right-wing blogs are trying really hard, I have yet to see any support among ANY Democrats (including Barney Frank) for this particular idea. The worst I can see is ending 401k tax deductions...which is stupid as well, but nowhere near "seizure".

 

[XZeroII]

Originally posted by: OneOfTheseDays
The most important thing going on in Congress right now is that we have lively discussion and debate as to what we need to do to fix our problem. Our entire nation needs to be having these kind of debates, instead of the same ol' ideological debates over abortion rights, gun control, etc. This is a good thing that we're talking about fresh new ideas even though clearly something like this would never get through Congress.

I tried having a rational conversation with you about something a couple days ago. What did you do? You insulted me, called me names and swore at me. Welcome to the new Democrat ruled world.

All of the rest of you Democrats can thank OneOfTheseDays for speaking for all of you.

 

[microbial]

McCain should have used this one. Whatever is left of your 401K after Bush finishes trashing it--The Dems are going to confiscate it afterwards...and Palin thinks Africa is a Country...and she hangs out with terrorists.

 

[Jhhnn]

Revvin' up the FUD machine, based on the testimony of *1* person before a congressional committee...

Does she have WMD's, or a reconstituted nuclear program?

Will the market regulate itself? Are the fundamentals of the economy strong?

Can the Sarah! see Russia from her front porch?

Gawd. The rightwing is apparently so scared shitless that they'll resort to anything.

 

[Blackjack200]

Seriously, the title of this thread needs to be edited as well as the OP. It's fine if this was an honest mistake, but you can't let this FUD just sit out there. Threads are locked for less than this.

 

[imported_gardener]

Repost

soccerball, how could you fail to recognize this is the same rightwing hype concerning the same Ghilarducci testomony you responded to in the thread from 2 weeks ago. See "Obama and nationalizing 401K plans." (link above)

Regardless, its still bullshit and a complete fabrication by the Rightwing propaganda machine.

My response from 2 weeks ago:

(There is no plan to take your 401k.)

Some rightwing bloggers are attempting to take a comments, out of context, from an early October house committee meeting on 401ks. One of the people who testified, Prof. Teresa Ghilarduccito, recommended giving workers the option of transferring 401k savings into a government guaranteed plan. Congressmen commented on it.

The context here is that this was a discussion, and many retirees have taken sizable hits in their 401k's.

Here's a quote, excerpted from a US News and World Report story.

Rep. Jim McDermott, a Democrat from Washington and chairman of the House Ways and Means Committee's Subcommittee on Income Security and Family Support, said that since "the savings rate isn't going up for the investment of $80 billion [in 401(k) tax breaks], we have to start to think about whether or not we want to continue to invest that $80 billion for a policy that's not generating what we now say it should."

 

[spidey07]

Thanks gardener, you're proving the point.

Jim McDermott is basically parroting what Ghilarduccito said - "stop the tax incentive of a 401k". ie, spread the wealth, spread it around, disincent saving for retirement. All your monies are belong to gubment.

 

[rudder]

Originally posted by: marincounty
I like the Republicans idea even better, let's let people invest their soc security funds in the stock market so they can make much better returns.......

How about not allowing the government to force lenders to make loans to people that can't afford them. Maybe then the stock market would not be such a mess.

But I will take the historic stock market rate of return over the government managing my money anyday. Imagine you pay your whole life into the government system. You are about to turn 62 years old and start collecting some of that social security. Ooops you die suddenly. Who do you think gets your money? Your offspring? nope the government. Now if I die... I can pass on a decent inheritance to my kids.

 

[jpeyton]

This thread is an example of the death of intellectualism in the Republican party.

 

[fskimospy]

Originally posted by: rudder

Originally posted by: marincounty
I like the Republicans idea even better, let's let people invest their soc security funds in the stock market so they can make much better returns.......

How about not allowing the government to force lenders to make loans to people that can't afford them. Maybe then the stock market would not be such a mess.

But I will take the historic stock market rate of return over the government managing my money anyday. Imagine you pay your whole life into the government system. You are about to turn 62 years old and start collecting some of that social security. Ooops you die suddenly. Who do you think gets your money? Your offspring? nope the government. Now if I die... I can pass on a decent inheritance to my kids.

If you think the CRA is why the stock market crashed, you have no clue what you're talking about. This has been gone over on here time and time again.

 

[StageLeft]

I believe (much of that hope, though), that 401ks will be left intact for now, but it certainly seems an issue that requires some observation. The government has done stupider things than mess up something like that.

 

[Blackjack200]

Originally posted by: Skoorb
I believe (much of that hope, though), that 401ks will be left intact for now, but it certainly seems an issue that requires some observation. The government has done stupider things than mess up something like that.

The government, as far as I know, has never had a mass seizure of trillions of dollars of private, tax sheltered assets. If they ever did that the American Financial system would collapse.

 

[StageLeft]

Originally posted by: Blackjack200

Originally posted by: Skoorb
I believe (much of that hope, though), that 401ks will be left intact for now, but it certainly seems an issue that requires some observation. The government has done stupider things than mess up something like that.

The government, as far as I know, has never had a mass seizure of trillions of dollars of private, tax sheltered assets. If they ever did that the American Financial system would collapse.

Actually, 401k is probably a lot safer than something like Roth, which is more under the radar and could potentially have something like a "minimal taxation" kicked in instead of currently tax-free withdrawals. I haven't heard anything about that--this is pure conjecture--but before the gov messes with 401ks I could see them fiddling with something like that.

Of course, the flip is that to mess with people's retirement forces more on the government teat and that would add further burden to an already difficult situation.

 

[SSSnail]

I can tell you with certainty that if I was to manage my 401K, I wouldn't have lost an unrealized percentage of 44%.

 

[spidey07]

Originally posted by: Blackjack200

Originally posted by: Skoorb
I believe (much of that hope, though), that 401ks will be left intact for now, but it certainly seems an issue that requires some observation. The government has done stupider things than mess up something like that.

The government, as far as I know, has never had a mass seizure of trillions of dollars of private, tax sheltered assets. If they ever did that the American Financial system would collapse.

But you guys wanted change. This is change. Can you spare some change?

Listen to Barney Frank. Listen to his ideas, see his past, this is the change you voted for.

 

[heyheybooboo]

^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^
How to make a Tin Foil Hat

 

[bozack]

Originally posted by: spidey07

But you guys wanted change. This is change. Can you spare some change?

Listen to Barney Frank. Listen to his ideas, see his past, this is the change you voted for.

Barney Frank is horrible, I honestly cannot believe the idiots in my state keep voting this guy into office..

I am typically not a big Bill O'Reilly fan however I loved it when he recently ripped into Frank over the whole mortgage thing...priceless.

Frank is a big big big govt socialist and I can easily seem him entertaining this type of an action. It would be hillarious if they actually did this even though I would think it impossible...even entertaining the notion is ludicrous but given what just happened and the dems position on that maybe they think the people will be more receptive?

 

[dmcowen674]

Originally posted by: XZeroII

Originally posted by: OneOfTheseDays
The most important thing going on in Congress right now is that we have lively discussion and debate as to what we need to do to fix our problem. Our entire nation needs to be having these kind of debates, instead of the same ol' ideological debates over abortion rights, gun control, etc. This is a good thing that we're talking about fresh new ideas even though clearly something like this would never get through Congress.

I tried having a rational conversation with you about something a couple days ago.

What did you do?

You insulted me, called me names and swore at me.

Welcome to the new Democrat ruled world.

All of the rest of you Democrats can thank OneOfTheseDays for speaking for all of you.

Good job One, hopefully Zero will feel so uncomfortable here he leaves :thumbsup:

 

[chess9]

Originally posted by: marincounty
I like the Republicans idea even better, let's let people invest their soc security funds in the stock market so they can make much better returns.......

LOL! Maybe we should just give all our money to the banks. It would save time with all the shuffling being done.

-Robert