Democratic debate? 1/17

[ivwshane]

No thread or anything on this? Did anyone watch this?

I'm watching it now but I don't know what point in the debate I am at. They are talking about guns and crime.

 

[bozack]

Sanders got steamrolled over by Clinton, he looked like a clown.

 

[Zorkorist]

TiVo'ing it. Expecting a big socialist explosion.

-John

 

[shady28]

I didn't get that out of it.

O'Malley was the most 'presidential' but it's obvious no one cares at this point.

 

[bozack]

I didn't get that out of it.

O'Malley was the most 'presidential' but it's obvious no one cares at this point.

I saw that poll as well, surprised as in watching the debate he seemed constantly on the defensive, continually talked about his positions which he admitted would cost taxpayers considerably across the board (though he loved to try and drive home the social justice penalty on the tippity top) but came off as someone who keeps changing position

My super liberal facebook folks love Sanders but it just seemed like Clinton came off as the much stronger candidate.

 

[Hugo Drax]

I watched it, Sanders did a great job and came across sincere and actually really caring about making things better for the upcoming new generation that will inherit the US.

 

[shady28]

Thus far that Time magazine poll was the worst online I've found. The next lowest was heavy.com at 90%.

Then there's this :

 

[bozack]

Thus far that Time magazine poll was the worst online I've found. The next lowest was heavy.com at 90%.

Then there's this :

That is just most searched though, figured that was because Sanders changed one of his positions again.

Sanders dropped a point in the time poll but still leads by a wide margin.

 

[shady28]

That is just most searched though, figured that was because Sanders changed one of his positions again.

Sanders dropped a point in the time poll but still leads by a wide margin.

I can sum up the entire debate in 2 quips.

Hillary = Obama part 2

Bernie = Nothing changes until we get big money out of politics

 

[Zorkorist]

More Socialism,

Less Freedom.

-John

 

[ivwshane]

So far, honestly, I wouldn't mind any of these three candidates. Their differences are minor and their attack claims on each other are minor as well. No one is without sin and their sins are minor.

 

[bozack]

I can sum up the entire debate in 2 quips.

Hillary = Obama part 2

Bernie = Nothing changes until we get big money out of politics

Bernie came off as super socialist continually going on about his replacement for Obamacare and how it will bitch slap the wealthy into paying their "fair share"....

He also seemed to flip flop a bit around the gun issue

It will be interesting to see how things go down, I would love to see a Sanders v. Trump throwdown just for the entertainment value of it all.

 

[Subyman]

I thought Bernie did well. Bernie had passion while Hillary seemed arrogant.

 

[bozack]

I thought Bernie did well. Bernie had passion while Hillary seemed arrogant.

But you're a Bernie fan no? if so then is it a surprise you'd see him as having done better?

 

[shady28]

Bernie came off as super socialist continually going on about his replacement for Obamacare and how it will bitch slap the wealthy into paying their "fair share"....

He also seemed to flip flop a bit around the gun issue

It will be interesting to see how things go down, I would love to see a Sanders v. Trump throwdown just for the entertainment value of it all.

I didn't get that. On replacing Obamacare he pointed out that yes, your taxes will go up, but you won't have to pay insurance premiums. It also solves the problem of what to do if you become unemployed.

I saw him explain his stance on the gun issue in a different video.

He's for banning assault weapons. But making it legal for a manufacturer or worse, a small business licensed dealer, to be sued over how someone uses something they made or sold does not make sense, unless the manufacturer knows they're likely selling to a criminal element. We don't sue car makers and dealerships when someone buys an SUV and runs over people.

 

[bozack]

I didn't get that. On replacing Obamacare he pointed out that yes, your taxes will go up, but you won't have to pay insurance premiums. It also solves the problem of what to do if you become unemployed.

I saw him explain his stance on the gun issue in a different video.

He's for banning assault weapons. But making it legal for a manufacturer or worse, a small business licensed dealer, to be sued over how someone uses something they made or sold does not make sense, unless the manufacturer knows they're likely selling to a criminal element. We don't sue car makers and dealerships when someone buys an SUV and runs over people.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...lan-is-his-biggest-attack-on-the-rich-so-far/

Solves what problem of what to do if unemployed? isn't that just go on government health? never knew this was a problem.

Taxes will go up for all, well those who pay income tax, but position is increase will be offset by the average 6K/year "savings"....250K+ will get creamed though and it goes up from there.

As for the gun issue I thought he was weak on that, seemed like he was backing off and backpedaling a bit....wouldn't be surprised if he changes his tune to say manufacturers can be sued (like tobacco) but shop owners cannot.

 

[Subyman]

But you're a Bernie fan no? if so then is it a surprise you'd see him as having done better?

I'm not quite a fan for anyone yet, I may vote under duress if the only other choice is Trump...

 

[shady28]

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...lan-is-his-biggest-attack-on-the-rich-so-far/

Solves what problem of what to do if unemployed? isn't that just go on government health? never knew this was a problem.

Taxes will go up for all, well those who pay income tax, but position is increase will be offset by the average 6K/year "savings"....250K+ will get creamed though and it goes up from there.

As for the gun issue I thought he was weak on that, seemed like he was backing off and backpedaling a bit....wouldn't be surprised if he changes his tune to say manufacturers can be sued (like tobacco) but shop owners cannot.

I don't know that an unemployed person qualifies for anything as far as healthcare. You have to be poor for a long time to qualify for benefits. Obamacare is just forced payment for healthcare, with some redistribution effects.

The reality on guns is that most Democrats are "weak" from the perspective of an anti-gun left wing person. The NRA isn't some SuperPAC or big business lobby, it's mostly made up of individual people - that's where it gets its money - and many of them vote this one issue, and there are a hell of a lot of them and they are not all Republicans, nor does the NRA promote only Republicans. And Bernie does have a D-.

I don't think guns are as big an issue as its made out to be. Virtually no one supports an all out gun ban, while most support banning assault rifles. Bernie supports an assault rifle ban. He's right in line with the popular views, so no gun debacle found.

 

[bozack]

I don't know that an unemployed person qualifies for anything as far as healthcare. You have to be poor for a long time to qualify for benefits. Obamacare is just forced payment for healthcare, with some redistribution effects.

The reality on guns is that most Democrats are "weak" from the perspective of an anti-gun left wing person. The NRA isn't some SuperPAC or big business lobby, it's mostly made up of individual people - that's where it gets its money - and many of them vote this one issue, and there are a hell of a lot of them and they are not all Republicans, nor does the NRA promote only Republicans. And Bernie does have a D-.

I don't think guns are as big an issue as its made out to be. Virtually no one supports an all out gun ban, while most support banning assault rifles. Bernie supports an assault rifle ban. He's right in line with the popular views, so no gun debacle found.

I always find the AWB issue a bit laughable as the criteria for designating "assault weapons" is silly....folding stock, detachable magazine, pistol grip, and a bayonet lug....it would be refreshing for them to just be on the level and let folks know that they are not talking about fully automatic machine guns.

Can't see why they just don't try to limit magazine capacity as it seems a bit simpler.

 

[Fenixgoon]

I always find the AWB issue a bit laughable as the criteria for designating "assault weapons" is silly....folding stock, detachable magazine, pistol grip, and a bayonet lug....it would be refreshing for them to just be on the level and let folks know that they are not talking about fully automatic machine guns.

Can't see why they just don't try to limit magazine capacity as it seems a bit simpler.

because that's equally as (in)effective as an AWB.

the biggest things that would address gun violence in the US IMO are making mental healthcare more accessible and less socially stigmatizing, and ending the war on drugs.

first part is to get people who are depressed/suicidal the help they need. the second is to reduce gang/drug violence (which accounts for a solid portion of homicides)

 

[bozack]

[/B]

because that's equally as (in)effective as an AWB.

the biggest things that would address gun violence in the US IMO are making mental healthcare more accessible and less socially stigmatizing, and ending the war on drugs.

first part is to get people who are depressed/suicidal the help they need. the second is to reduce gang/drug violence (which accounts for a solid portion of homicides)

I agree completely, mental healthcare is a disgrace in this country

my state limits mag capacity but we also have a version of the AWB still in effect...all of these measures do nothing beyond serving as political fodder for the base.

 

[compuwiz1]

Limiting magazine capacity won't slow much down. I can switch out in just a couple seconds. So what If I can't have a 30 round mag. I can carry 30 charged regulars. No biggie. Laws aren't going to make criminals change their minds and it IS the mind that is the problem, not the weapon. This whole gun control blabber is just political pandering, seeking votes.

 

[ivwshane]

Limiting magazine capacity won't slow much down. I can switch out in just a couple seconds. So what If I can't have a 30 round mag. I can carry 30 charged regulars. No biggie. Laws aren't going to make criminals change their minds and it IS the mind that is the problem, not the weapon. This whole gun control blabber is just political pandering, seeking votes.

I doubt you would be willing to address the mental health issue and do what is necessary. Gun nutters like yourself always, always seem to have a reason why it can't be done (just like your retarded anecdote about you swapping out clips quickly).

 

[compuwiz1]

I doubt you would be willing to address the mental health issue and do what is necessary. Gun nutters like yourself always, always seem to have a reason why it can't be done (just like your retarded anecdote about you swapping out clips quickly).

*Magazines

 

[ivwshane]

*Magazines

*I don't give a shit