Democracy is an antithesis of freedom, including that of speech

[ichy]

Freedom is overrated. That's my reply to you. Democracy is more desired than freedom. The idea that the US or any country is all about freedom is BS hollywood history revisionist nonsense.

Actually the idea that the US is a democracy is nonsense. We are a constitutional republic.

 

[jhu]

Turkey, a very democratic nation, has the least free press of any country in the world. Link:

http://articles.sfgate.com/2011-05-...ia-freedom-ergenekon-fully-secular-government

In the ultra democratic U.S. we don't have absolute self-ownership in any category, especially free speech or freedom of association (64% of the people opposed Muslims being allowed to build a mosque somewhat near ground zero). They don't have much freedom of speech in U.K., (e.g., state owned media) the most democratic country in the world. Yet there is at least one very secular monarchy in Europe that has more freedom of speech than U.S. does. Video games would be regulated by the Federal government if the industry hadn't chosen to do so voluntary because under a democracy, the majority doesn't like responsibility.

Freedom of speech is quite unpopular, actually. How many people do you think would be willing to get rid of the FCC? Certainly not a majority.

This is why democracy sucks, folks.

Really? Show me how Turkey has less free apeech than North Korea, Burma, or China.

 

[jhu]

Government infringes upon those rights for sure, but centralized democracy is probably the worst offender.

Why don't you go back to North Korea then?

 

[woolfe9999]

Freedom is overrated. That's my reply to you. Democracy is more desired than freedom. The idea that the US or any country is all about freedom is BS hollywood history revisionist nonsense. There's no absolute freedom possible unless you are the only person alive which is a ridiculous scenario to consider. As soon as there is more than one person living near each other, there is no freedom anymore. The lack of freedom in the world isn't a problem because people prefer socializing to freedom.

Posting in an Anarchist thread! Yeah!

Freedom exists, to degrees. There is no such thing as total and absolute freedom. Not even if you're the last person on earth. There is still you against nature.

Congrats for being one of the only people on this forum to understand that "freedom" is a concept far broader than "the absence of government restriction," that freedom can be taken away by many things that are not "government." Take away government, and there will be no vacuum of power. It will be filled by those with concentrated resources (i.e. wealth). Take away police, and crime will keep us in our houses. That isn't freedom. Take away government regulation of the environment, and toxic chemicals can lay waste the swaths of land, making them unusable by citizens. That isn't feedom.

- wolf

 

[a777pilot]

Sorry I don't have a direct line to the FCC, please tell us what they *might* be up to..according to Drudge.

I'm sorry to disappoint you but I do not read nor listen to Drudge. I do not listen, watch or read what Rush or Glenn have to say. I find all three of them some what tedious and stopped paying attention to them some years back. If I want to be preached at, I would go to church.

If you have no idea what is going on, well, then, good for you.

 

[Doboji]

AH yes let's abolish all government and run around like savages!!!! WOOOHOOO now THAT is freedom! I will never understand Anarchists... the only thing worse than Government is no government.

 

[darkewaffle]

Goddamnit, I'm trying to work here, stop making giggle so much guys.

 

[WelshBloke]

Turkey, a very democratic nation, has the least free press of any country in the world. Link:

http://articles.sfgate.com/2011-05-...ia-freedom-ergenekon-fully-secular-government

In the ultra democratic U.S. we don't have absolute self-ownership in any category, especially free speech or freedom of association (64% of the people opposed Muslims being allowed to build a mosque somewhat near ground zero). They don't have much freedom of speech in U.K., (e.g., state owned media) the most democratic country in the world. Yet there is at least one very secular monarchy in Europe that has more freedom of speech than U.S. does. Video games would be regulated by the Federal government if the industry hadn't chosen to do so voluntary because under a democracy, the majority doesn't like responsibility.

Freedom of speech is quite unpopular, actually. How many people do you think would be willing to get rid of the FCC? Certainly not a majority.

This is why democracy sucks, folks.

I'm going to let other people pick apart your other points but as for the UK.

We are not "the most democratic country in the world", I think that's a meaningless phrase.

We also have plenty of privately owned media, probably about the same amount as you guys.

I'm kind of curious (and slightly apprehensive) about what form of governance you think would bring people more freedoms than the various forms of democracies we have at the moment?

 

[BeauJangles]

I'm going to let other people pick apart your other points but as for the UK.

We are not "the most democratic country in the world", I think that's a meaningless phrase.

We also have plenty of privately owned media, probably about the same amount as you guys.

I'm kind of curious (and slightly apprehensive) about what form of governance you think would bring people more freedoms than the various forms of democracies we have at the moment?

The state of nature, that #$%^ rocks!

 

[ElFenix]

Who cares? At least we still have the freedom to post what we want....for how long, is debatable.

speaking of not posting, you never did post a story where a kid was restricted from reading a bible to himself in study hall

 

[Whiskey16]

The problem of "democracy"in Turkey, is that is a muslim country. There is no freedom in muslim countries. "Democracy" is but a facade hiding the filth of islam.

Filthy bigotry is strong here.

Freedom of speech -- so be it -- as in all such ugly forms above and in most of this poster's writings. Yet that does not deny others to express condemnation against these disgusting trolls who continually spew out pure and absolute hatred upon a group and would please their broken minds to achieve all out genocide upon their target (Muslims here...liberals, blacks, Jews, etc...).

Societies that turn a blind eye and ignore such puss fill putred only destroy themselves. Internet forums, included.

a777pilot, go return to wallowing in the sewers, but before you do I certainly hope all others here dog-pile upon you to express their freedom of speech to loudly denounce your writings for what they explicitly are.

 

[Whiskey16]

Actually the idea that the US is a democracy is nonsense. We are a constitutional republic.

A prime and glaring failing an educational system!!!

That pathetically incorrect dogma is all too commonly repeated upon forums where US posters are present. :'(

Dude, you warrant a lecture to help put an end to such lunacy.

You are a democracy without a monarch as head-of-state. The term of a republic goes back for millenia. Democracy is exactly what you just stated your "constitutional republic" to be. A form of representative government where those representatives are elected by a selected portion of the population. I know of no state where democracy is open to all present within. Restrictions upon who those representaives may be or who may even vote for them differs among states. Be it only those who are deemed to be adequate citizens, property owners, a specifc sex, race, of certain age, etc. All or a portion of such restrictions upon who may vote for repesentation have or continue to exist in the USA and all other states in this world. The elected representatives form the government.

The term democracy itself also includes constitutional parliamentary monarchies through to the extreme of a Communist Politburo. A quantifiable metric for a level of democracy is commonly down to how purvasive into the society it is for people who are permitted to vote for representation. Upon such lines, the USA was rather tardy in providing higher democratic freedoms in comparison to some other western nations who more quickly provided full voting rights to wider segments of their population.

....ahh, but then, I'll edit with and add-on that corruption within a democratic system becomes another matter that will also include the level of judicial independance from political inference, the professionalism of law enforement agencies, to the maturity of thesociety as a whole to be informed and assess critical decisions.

 

[a777pilot]

speaking of not posting, you never did post a story where a kid was restricted from reading a bible to himself in study hall

That's right I did not. Sorry. I'll get right on that.

 

[a777pilot]

Filthy bigotry is strong here.

Freedom of speech -- so be it -- as in all such ugly forms above and in most of this poster's writings. Yet that does not deny others to express condemnation against these disgusting trolls who continually spew out pure and absolute hatred upon a group and would please their broken minds to achieve all out genocide upon their target (Muslims here...liberals, blacks, Jews, etc...).

Societies that turn a blind eye and ignore such puss fill putred only destroy themselves. Internet forums, included.

a777pilot, go return to wallowing in the sewers, but before you do I certainly hope all others here dog-pile upon you to express their freedom of speech to loudly denounce your writings for what they explicitly are.

The sewers are just fine for me. I love those places where even a muslim will not tread. I am NOT bigoted when it comes to the so called muslim faith. Their religion, if it is one, is based on hate fear and death. It is the only "major" religion which calls for the death of those that do not convert to their way of thinking. Look it up.

It is my its own words a religion of hate. Any thinking person ought be ashamed to be a muslim.

You are either a muslim or are ignorant of what this so called religion is all about.

 

[WelshBloke]

The sewers are just fine for me. I love those places where even a muslim will not tread. I am NOT bigoted when it comes to the so called muslim faith. Their religion, if it is one, is based on hate fear and death. It is the only "major" religion which calls for the death of those that do not convert to their way of thinking. Look it up.

It is my its own words a religion of hate. Any thinking person ought be ashamed to be a muslim.

You are either a muslim or are ignorant of what this so called religion is all about.

So no worries for you then?

 

[fskimospy]

His propensity to by pass Congress and rule by Executive Order.

How is the military action in Libya and the threats against Syria legal?

How are the new restriction on fire arms sales legal?

What about the new commission to top government officals set up to monitor the actions of this nations farmers and ranchers?

Let's not forget government by Czars.

That was completely unclear, simply vague bullshit. What executive order do you think he is going to issue that will prevent you from posting? What action by what commission will happen that will stop it? What Czar will do what to stop you from posting? BE SPECIFIC.

You won't be of course, because you can't. You're just feeding some paranoid fantasy.

 

[BurnItDwn]

A true democracy would have no political parties.

 

[zephyrprime]

Actually the idea that the US is a democracy is nonsense. We are a constitutional republic.

Oh don't trot out that dictionary nonsense about the words democracy and republic. Look, you are right on a literal level but no one cares except marriam webster. When people revolt in libya or conspire in chatrooms in china, the word they use is "democracy" not "republic".

 

[Doboji]

The sewers are just fine for me. I love those places where even a muslim will not tread. I am NOT bigoted when it comes to the so called muslim faith. Their religion, if it is one, is based on hate fear and death. It is the only "major" religion which calls for the death of those that do not convert to their way of thinking. Look it up.

It is my its own words a religion of hate. Any thinking person ought be ashamed to be a muslim.

You are either a muslim or are ignorant of what this so called religion is all about.

How are you so fucking stupid? You apply the letter of the Quran to Muslims, but Christians get a pass? Go read the bible... That book is full of death and destruction. Christians are still responsible for killing more innocent people in the name of God than all other religions combined.

Why don't you go back to worshiping a dead Jew you worthless sack of human waste. Christianity remains the most violent in the history of mankind. Comparitively Islam IS the religion of peace.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

Government infringes upon those rights for sure, but centralized democracy is probably the worst offender.

You want to point to any western democracy which is worse than China today?

Obama sucks.

Guess what? I'm not going to jail. Don't bet the farm that what you've posted so far wouldn't have made you disappear there.

 

[Taejin]

when anarchist posts it reminds me that some people are just destined to fail from a very young age

lol

 

[Doppel]

Turkey, a very democratic nation, has the least free press of any country in the world. Link:

http://articles.sfgate.com/2011-05-...ia-freedom-ergenekon-fully-secular-government

In the ultra democratic U.S. we don't have absolute self-ownership in any category, especially free speech or freedom of association (64% of the people opposed Muslims being allowed to build a mosque somewhat near ground zero). They don't have much freedom of speech in U.K., (e.g., state owned media) the most democratic country in the world. Yet there is at least one very secular monarchy in Europe that has more freedom of speech than U.S. does. Video games would be regulated by the Federal government if the industry hadn't chosen to do so voluntary because under a democracy, the majority doesn't like responsibility.

Freedom of speech is quite unpopular, actually. How many people do you think would be willing to get rid of the FCC? Certainly not a majority.

This is why democracy sucks, folks.

A compelling argument to be sure. I long for the day when the democracy here can be replaced with governance like that in North Korea.

 

[WhipperSnapper]

My question for the OP--what system of government do you recommend we have in place of a constitutionally-limited republic whose officials are democractically elected? Do you have a better idea in mind?

 

[DominionSeraph]

Freedom exists, to degrees. There is no such thing as total and absolute freedom. Not even if you're the last person on earth. There is still you against nature.

Logic, too.
An unqualified "freedom" is self-contradictory, for its definition binds you to not being unfree.

 

[ichy]

Oh don't trot out that dictionary nonsense about the words democracy and republic. Look, you are right on a literal level but no one cares except marriam webster. When people revolt in libya or conspire in chatrooms in china, the word they use is "democracy" not "republic".

The difference is that in a pure democracy the will of the voters goes, no matter what. In the US on the other hand we have a constitution which prohibits, just for example, the majority from voting away the free speech rights of a minority.