Delided, laped 3770K, temp drop 30+, thanks Idont and Ido CARE

[gipsy]

hi all

Delidded 3770K, laped HSM inside outside to high gloss shine, laped my Noctua14 as well.
TIM in and out is Noctua, used far less then half rice grain between die and HSM as surfaces are very flat.
Used half grain on heatsink.

Overclocked to 4.7 at 1.296V using offset and very high LLC.
Prime 95 8 core stressing after 1 hour, 65-68-69-65 room temp 21.

Have to manualy push fans(user seting in AI suite) to spinn at max under load as my P8Z68 deluxe is lazy on fans.

Case is old Antec 180, all fans silent, Noctua up to 1200 revs.

Was thinking to get water cooling but now wondering if this is enough.

What you guys think how mouch lower can bring WC with 360 radiator to this setup??

Did take no images as I was like in trans doing delidding and laping.
All did as per Idont and Ido amazing instruction and walktrough

Here is pic

 

[BonzaiDuck]

hi all

Delidded 3770K, laped HSM inside outside to high gloss shine, laped my Noctua14 as well.
TIM in and out is Noctua, used far less then half rice grain between die and HSM as surfaces are very flat.
Used half grain on heatsink.

Overclocked to 4.7 at 1.296V using offset and very high LLC.
Prime 95 8 core stressing after 1 hour, 65-68-69-65 room temp 21.

Have to manualy push fans(user seting in AI suite) to spinn at max under load as my P8Z68 deluxe is lazy on fans.

Case is old Antec 180, all fans silent, Noctua up to 1200 revs.

Was thinking to get water cooling but now wondering if this is enough.

What you guys think how mouch lower can bring WC with 360 radiator to this setup??

Did take no images as I was like in trans doing delidding and laping.
All did as per Idont and Ido amazing instruction and walktrough

The experience I had with my P8Z68-V Pro fan-headers was similar. The two Noctua D14 fans are appropriately plugged to the CPU1 and 2 headers, and I have a 120x38mm Panaflo or NMB-MAT 3-pin exhaust-fan connected to the System fan header. CPU temperatures seem to manage the speed of this latter fan perfectly without any motherboard BIOS adjustments, and it runs between 1,500+rpm and its maximum depending on the temperature.

At some point adding more low-amp case fans to the motherboard headers, there is no thermal control or one of the fans won't even spin up to its maximum speed when BIOS is enabled for the particular fan to do it. But since I use a case-pressurization strategy and large case fans of 200+mm size, varying these is of little consequence for either airflow or noise . . . So I just connect them to the PSU.

Your temperatures seem great, and the 4.7 OC seems about right for the voltage.

 

[Redoitall]

hi all

Delidded 3770K, laped HSM inside outside to high gloss shine, laped my Noctua14 as well.
TIM in and out is Noctua, used far less then half rice grain between die and HSM as surfaces are very flat.
Used half grain on heatsink.

Overclocked to 4.7 at 1.296V using offset and very high LLC.
Prime 95 8 core stressing after 1 hour, 65-68-69-65 room temp 21.

Have to manualy push fans(user seting in AI suite) to spinn at max under load as my P8Z68 deluxe is lazy on fans.

Case is old Antec 180, all fans silent, Noctua up to 1200 revs.

Was thinking to get water cooling but now wondering if this is enough.

What you guys think how mouch lower can bring WC with 360 radiator to this setup??

Did take no images as I was like in trans doing delidding and laping.
All did as per Idont and Ido amazing instruction and walktrough

Hello you seem to have a pretty good chip. You are getting very good temps, However I would recomend to go LMP on DIE TO IHS AND NOCTUA ON IHS TO HSF. As far as stability make sure you check your event manager for WHEA errors as this is the one of the best indicators whether you need to raise volts or not. I did well over 24 hours on prime on small, large and blend thought I was stable with lower voltages, But after It was pointed out to me and a few questions I got it stable IDONTCARE helped me. Goog luck

 

[Redoitall]

So when you run Prime95 and declare to yourself "I'm Prime stable! W00t!" all that really means is that your computer is stable for maybe 50 or 60 instructions out of the thousand or so instructions the CPU could be asked to process by any number of software programs (like the OS).

Getting a WHEA means there are instructions for which your CPU is not stable, it needs more voltage, or lower temperature, or lower clockspeed or possibly all of the above.

As end-users we do not have access to any programs that will stress test each and every instruction that our CPU's ISA supports.

Stress tester programs give us a rough indication as to how unstable our processors are but they can never give us any indication as to how stable the processor is.

Get an error in prime95 and you can safely conclude your CPU is unstable. Get no errors in prime95 and you cannot conclude your processor is stable, merely that it appears to be stable with whatever handful of instructions prime95 uses. It may well be unstable with another application that uses different instructions (like the OS or a web browser or a game, etc).
" this is what IDONTCARE posted that helped me"
ANd what I meant on the prior post is that with lower volts I was getting lots of errors, once raised the volts is smooth at 4.9 GHZ Flight simulator x max settings 72 to 73 celsius, before delidding and LMP to IHS I was hitting the TJ max 95 to 105.

 

[gipsy]

Hello you seem to have a pretty good chip. You are getting very good temps, However I would recomend to go LMP on DIE TO IHS AND NOCTUA ON IHS TO HSF. As far as stability make sure you check your event manager for WHEA errors as this is the one of the best indicators whether you need to raise volts or not. I did well over 24 hours on prime on small, large and blend thought I was stable with lower voltages, But after It was pointed out to me and a few questions I got it stable IDONTCARE helped me. Goog luck

LMU is on it's way...but I do not hope for much lower temps if any.
Talking about stability, for me, as long as I do not get BSOD during everyday work on PC, I am OK.
Best test for me is Media Encoder which is crushing on me even with Prime95 being stable for hours if voltages are not high enough and temps low..
What I did find out is that as long my temps are less than 65-70 on load, comp is stable for given clock and voltage.
For that reason, I am thinking on water cooling, as it may bring 4.9 or 5.0 to be stable in that temperature range.

 

[Redoitall]

LMU is on it's way...but I do not hope for much lower temps if any.
Talking about stability, for me, as long as I do not get BSOD during everyday work on PC, I am OK.
Best test for me is Media Encoder which is crushing on me even with Prime95 being stable for hours if voltages are not high enough and temps low..
What I did find out is that as long my temps are less than 65-70 on load, comp is stable for given clock and voltage.
For that reason, I am thinking on water cooling, as it may bring 4.9 or 5.0 to be stable in that temperature range.

The reason why I had mentioned the LMP was because initially I had higher temps with artic silver but once I Lapped and applied LMP temps went much lower and I had room put more volts on my system and I tell you my benchmarks went higher also the gaming is very smooth. I am at 1.344 @ 4.7 I have a suspicion your silicone might be one of the good ones that only needs very low voltage

 

[Ferzerp]

LMU is on it's way...but I do not hope for much lower temps if any.

The issue with NT-H1 under the IHS is that it stops working after some period of time (or heat cycles or something). There are lots of reports of it. I know personally, that it would last maybe 3-4 months for me before my temps were 15-20C higher than they were on a fresh application. Unless you like tinkering with it, having to take the whole thing apart, clean it, and reapply the TIM for two interfaces 3-4 times a year is just a pain.

Initially, it is just fine. It just degrades really fast in that situation for some reason.

 

[gipsy]

The reason why I had mentioned the LMP was because initially I had higher temps with artic silver but once I Lapped and applied LMP temps went much lower and I had room put more volts on my system and I tell you my benchmarks went higher also the gaming is very smooth. I am at 1.344 @ 4.7 I have a suspicion your silicone might be one of the good ones that only needs very low voltage

For 4.8, it needs 1.376(offset mode), tested short run, 1 hour Prime blend, LinX 20 runs, but temps go to high 70 where I do not feel safe for long term run..

 

[Redoitall]

For 4.8, it needs 1.376(offset mode), tested short run, 1 hour Prime blend, LinX 20 runs, but temps go to high 70 where I do not feel safe for long term run..

Just wait until you apply LMP to you IHS is like soldering your temps will be at low 70 high 60 @ 4.8

 

[Idontcare]

Welcome to the forums gipsy :thumbsup:

(and thanks for the kind words :$)

Glad to read of your results, excellent!

With 22nm IB I personally stay below 1.3V for 24/7 OC's. 4.7GHz is going to be indistinguishable from 5GHz at the point you are at.

 

[gipsy]

Welcome to the forums gipsy :thumbsup:

(and thanks for the kind words :$)

Glad to read of your results, excellent!

With 22nm IB I personally stay below 1.3V for 24/7 OC's. 4.7GHz is going to be indistinguishable from 5GHz at the point you are at.

Hi Idontcare, just tested overnight, and 4.6@1.232 seems stable and cold.
I got there with negative offset 0,010 and LLC extreme.
Temps are 60-64-64-62 max with fans on app.70% as set in FAN expert for that temp range.
Looks like proper adjustment for long run.
Your idea, to have high overclocked profile saved in AI suite and start it as needed seems best for me.
For long encoding jobs in AME I can start 4,9 profile but I will first test with PPBM5 and some longer jobs to see what that 0.3 GHz brings.

 

[gipsy]

Just wait until you apply LMP to you IHS is like soldering your temps will be at low 70 high 60 @ 4.8

Hi Redoitall

My CL ultra should be here any day. Will keep posted results..

 

[john3850]

gipsy What you guys think how mouch lower can bring WC with 360 radiator to this setup?

With a cheap 360 rad in push pull pumped by d-5 while running ibt 4800MHz = 129-121.Glops. with 4069mb.
With a room temp of 67f my temps stay 81-87c at 4800 with 1.296-1.3+ which is too high for me.
For my use 46k seems the best of cooling also pc is always infront of a ac if needed for summer use.

 

[gipsy]

Just put Liquid ultra on die. Another avg.5 Celsius down.
4.7 GHz, 1.296V Max temps Prime95 blend 1 hour: 58-62-65-59

Now few pics with Noctua TIM applied in less than half rice grain on die and half grain on HSM after removing...maybe it was too litle on HSM??
What you think Idontcare??

 

[gipsy]

Hi Redoitall

My CL ultra should be here any day. Will keep posted results..

Hi Redoital, Liquid here and temps down..!!

 

[Redoitall]

hi redoital, liquid here and temps down..!!

yaaaaaaaaaaaay viva la liquid metal

 

[Idontcare]

Just put Liquid ultra on die. Another avg.5 Celsius down.
4.7 GHz, 1.296V Max temps Prime95 blend 1 hour: 58-62-65-59

Sweet! :thumbsup:

Now few pics with Noctua TIM applied in less than half rice grain on die and half grain on HSM after removing...maybe it was too litle on HSM??
What you think Idontcare??

Yep, too little. I too was a believer in the "less is always better" mantra when it came to spreading as thin of a layer of TIM as possible on the IHS...that is until I really dug into it and started doing dozens and dozens of tests and discovered it really is a goldilocks type situation - you can have too little or too much, the trick is to get just the right amount on there.

In your case I would say you should double the amount of TIM you are putting on the IHS pre-mount. Your temps will go down.

(FWIW the amount of liquid ultra you put on your bare silicon die looks perfect to me, nicely done)

 

[gipsy]

gipsy What you guys think how mouch lower can bring WC with 360 radiator to this setup?

With a cheap 360 rad in push pull pumped by d-5 while running ibt 4800MHz = 129-121.Glops. with 4069mb.
With a room temp of 67f my temps stay 81-87c at 4800 with 1.296-1.3+ which is too high for me.
For my use 46k seems the best of cooling also pc is always infront of a ac if needed for summer use.

Hi John

That is what I would like to know as well. What water cooling can do on my setup?? If it can bring another 10 down, or keep same temps but being dead silent , I would invest...

 

[MustangSVT]

Great job!

I wonder if it is worth it to de-lid without ultra pro?
because of the heat rising again in few weeks with other thermals, maybe I shouldn't even open mine.

 

[Idontcare]

Great job!

I wonder if it is worth it to de-lid without ultra pro?
because of the heat rising again in few weeks with other thermals, maybe I shouldn't even open mine.

Checkout the following thread

Bare-die testing: A delidded 3770k, an H100, and 9 different TIMs

 

[gipsy]

Great job!

I wonder if it is worth it to de-lid without ultra pro?
because of the heat rising again in few weeks with other thermals, maybe I shouldn't even open mine.

It is big risk!!
What I did when I was opening mine, I use blade which was used before, so micro dents where there on blade. As I cut first 2 corners I spoted 2 places where green layer is gone and bare metal was exposed.

As you can see 2 nice dents there. I was thinking to use drop of epoxy to protect it and, (what you think IDC), to use some epoxy to join HSM back to chip. I was thinking, now all is done, liquid pro applied, to align HSM and sick it together.

 

[Idontcare]

It is big risk!!
What I did when I was opening mine, I use blade which was used before, so micro dents where there on blade. As I cut first 2 corners I spoted 2 places where green layer is gone and bare metal was exposed.

As you can see 2 nice dents there. I was thinking to use drop of epoxy to protect it and, (what you think IDC), to use some epoxy to join HSM back to chip. I was thinking, now all is done, liquid pro applied, to align HSM and sick it together.

If you are worried about the exposed copper traces from where you nicked the green PCB you can definitely use a simple epoxy like super-glu or crazy-glu. One tiny drop per nick is all you'd need.

If you are positive that you are not going to need or want to replace the liquid pro under the IHS then you are better off gluing the IHS down to the PCB in my opinion because the liquid pro is going to eventually adhere like glue to the cpu silicon and you don't want the socket retention clip transferring all that shear force to the die when you latch it back down at some later date.

You want that shear force transferred from the IHS to the PCB, not from the IHS to the cpu die. When the CPU TIM is pliable like a regular gel TIM, which liquid pro is at first, then it is ok to not glue the IHS down because it can slide around and basically no shear stress is transferred from the IHS to the CPU silicon.

 

[sm625]

All did as per Idont and Ido amazing instruction and walktrough

There is an Ido?

 

[amenx]

Yep, too little. I too was a believer in the "less is always better" mantra when it came to spreading as thin of a layer of TIM as possible on the IHS...that is until I really dug into it and started doing dozens and dozens of tests and discovered it really is a goldilocks type situation - you can have too little or too much, the trick is to get just the right amount on there.

I believed in the less is better, drop in middle approach myself (still do depending on situation), but found it was a b!tch to do right with some unwieldy coolers, ie Zalman CNPS 9900. That cooler was tough to position properly when mounting, so my little drop in the middle would get smeared to one side or another. What worked very well for me and will try again in future builds is the Intel 3 line approach as seen on their coolers (of course with 3 thin smaller lines).

 

[john3850]

Hi John

That is what I would like to know as well. What water cooling can do on my setup?? If it can bring another 10 down, or keep same temps but being dead silent , I would invest...

When I saw my golden sample 500 gtx hit 88+c I switched to water and stayed there till now.
These days you dont need water its waste to spend $300 on water when you can get the best hsf for a $100.
Very nice deliding dude.