DeJoy being investigated by the FBI for campaign contributions

Feb 4, 2009
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This is the one where it is rumored employees were pressured to make donations to conservative causes and then rewarded with pay increases to cover those donations correct?
 

ivwshane

Lifer
May 15, 2000
30,573
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Can anyone show me a Republican who isn’t corrupt?

Like is it a requirement for republicans to either be bat shit crazy, corrupt, or both. Is the RNC leadership some Russian stooge who is purposely recruiting these people?




**holy shit type-os
 
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interchange

Diamond Member
Oct 10, 1999
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Does 'knowingly' matter? Should it? Shouldn't you know the laws?


Ignorance of the law is not a defense, however the defendant's state of mind is a critical element of most offenses. What specifically is he being investigated for? I don't have time to work around the paywall.
 

Lost_in_the_HTTP

Diamond Member
Nov 17, 2019
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What specifically is he being investigated for? I don't have time to work around the paywall.

"The investigation is tied to reports that surfaced in The Washington Post in September that he allegedly pressured employees to donate to Republican candidates and reimbursed them through bonuses while he was leading North Carolina-based New Breed Logistics from 2000-2014.

While companies may encourage employees to make such donations, the reimbursement violates North Carolina and federal election laws, since the practice, called the straw-donor scheme, allows donors to evade individual contribution limits and obscures the source of money, The Post noted."

 

woolfe9998

Lifer
Apr 8, 2013
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Ignorance of the law is not a defense, however the defendant's state of mind is a critical element of most offenses. What specifically is he being investigated for? I don't have time to work around the paywall.
Well, ignorance of the law is not a defense in most situations, not all. Sometimes where an area of law is considered highly complex/technical, then ignorance can be an excuse.

The most recent well known example is Mueller saying that Don Jr. violated election laws in accepting "dirt" on Hillary Clinton from the Russians, but that he shouldn't be prosecuted because he didn't understand the applicable election law.
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
75,630
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Well, ignorance of the law is not a defense in most situations, not all. Sometimes where an area of law is considered highly complex/technical, then ignorance can be an excuse.

The most recent well known example is Mueller saying that Don Jr. violated election laws in accepting "dirt" on Hillary Clinton from the Russians, but that he shouldn't be prosecuted because he didn't understand the applicable election law.
Someone once said the likelihood of ignorance being an excuse is strongly related to how likely it is the crime was committed by a rich white guy in a suit, which seems pretty accurate to me.
 

woolfe9998

Lifer
Apr 8, 2013
14,691
10,669
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Someone once said the likelihood of ignorance being an excuse is strongly related to how likely it is the crime was committed by a rich white guy in a suit, which seems pretty accurate to me.
Yes, white men in suits usually commit complex financial crimes, which is why the defense would seem to be applicable. The problem is that it should never be a defense. IMO, if you decide to engage in complex transactions you had better learn the laws applicable to those transactions. If you can't figure it out for yourself, hire a lawyer. If the lawyer misadvises you, then you have a defense.

The same goes for people running for office. Acquaint yourself with the relevant election laws or don't run.
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
75,630
29,743
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Yes, white men in suits usually commit complex financial crimes, which is why the defense would seem to be applicable. The problem is that it should never be a defense. IMO, if you decide to engage in complex transactions you had better learn the laws applicable to those transactions. If you can't figure it out for yourself, hire a lawyer. If the lawyer misadvises you, then you have a defense.

The same goes for people running for office. Acquaint yourself with the relevant election laws or don't run.
Also I found that take by Mueller to be laughable. Really…Don Jr. had no idea that secretly meeting with agents of the Russian government to secure its help with the election might be illegal? Like, really?
 

woolfe9998

Lifer
Apr 8, 2013
14,691
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Also I found that take by Mueller to be laughable. Really…Don Jr. had no idea that secretly meeting with agents of the Russian government to secure its help with the election might be illegal? Like, really?
Well, I guess you can argue that Don Jr. was just that much of a dumbfuck just like his deer old dad, but Mueller never actually interviewed Don Jr. to even know what he knew or his capacity to know it. Making his conclusion that much more absurd.
 

cytg111

Lifer
Mar 17, 2008
18,837
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This is the R in Russians. Well the oligarchy anyway. Corruption kompromat repeat.
 

Lost_in_the_HTTP

Diamond Member
Nov 17, 2019
6,371
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Also I found that take by Mueller to be laughable. Really…Don Jr. had no idea that secretly meeting with agents of the Russian government to secure its help with the election might be illegal? Like, really?
You know, that's one of the problems here. To them, it wasn't a problem. It was business as usual, just another deal. They ran, or tried to run it all as any other business with no regard for any special laws that applied to government or politics.
 

Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
68,687
4,602
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If there is a law that limits how much one person may donate to a candidate the only ignorance of that law would consist in giving more than that limit to the candidate. Trying to give more by giving to others to give would imply nothing but an attempt to give more in full consciousness that one is trying to avoid the the particulars of that limitation.
 

interchange

Diamond Member
Oct 10, 1999
7,784
2,463
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Well, ignorance of the law is not a defense in most situations, not all. Sometimes where an area of law is considered highly complex/technical, then ignorance can be an excuse.

The most recent well known example is Mueller saying that Don Jr. violated election laws in accepting "dirt" on Hillary Clinton from the Russians, but that he shouldn't be prosecuted because he didn't understand the applicable election law.
Is that because for some situations you really couldn't realistically establish the requisite my mens rea without someone showing significant knowledge of the law? In which case, I'd argue that's more of a technicality, but it wouldn't be wrong to argue in court you didn't know what you were doing is illegal therefore you aren't responsible.
 

HomerJS

Lifer
Feb 6, 2002
30,090
17,141
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How soon before DeJoy employs the Ron Johnson defense? We are comfortable with White Republicans breaking the law.
 

tweaker2

Lifer
Aug 5, 2000
13,020
4,668
136
How soon before DeJoy employs the Ron Johnson defense? We are comfortable with White Republicans breaking the law.

It would seem that breaking the law in order to sustain and enhance the viability of the Repub party is for quite some time now something that party simply can't survive without. The more that demographic changes work against their efforts at keeping the reins of power in hand, the more they will have to resort to underhanded methods to, as they have disingenuously misnomered it "level the playing field in their favor".

Ultimately, if things keep progressively working against them numbers-wise, that party will have to seize power through fighting another civil war to get their way or heaven forbid, abandon their efforts at using regressive totalitarian tactics to hold back the nation politically while the nation moves on demographically.
 

zinfamous

No Lifer
Jul 12, 2006
107,580
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Yes, white men in suits usually commit complex financial crimes, which is why the defense would seem to be applicable. The problem is that it should never be a defense. IMO, if you decide to engage in complex transactions you had better learn the laws applicable to those transactions. If you can't figure it out for yourself, hire a lawyer. If the lawyer misadvises you, then you have a defense.

The same goes for people running for office. Acquaint yourself with the relevant election laws or don't run.
"Honestly judge...just look at me! I'm a cave man, this modern world FRIGHTENS me! Who am I to say that these financial rules aren't too complicated to understand, that I shouldn't hire a professional to figure it out for me? I mean, look at me! 1 week ago, I was falling into a pit after being chased by a mastodon, slowly frozen over by drizzling ice, and now I'm here in this court of law, 8 thousand years later, defending my client! How am I supposed to understand how these complex financial regulations and laws and ethics work--I hire the expert! And wouldn't my client, also? I mean, it might as well be the workings of the restless spirit of a slain saber toothed tiger that makes these financial systems run in my mind, am I right? Isn't that why the professionals do this work for us?"
 

sportage

Lifer
Feb 1, 2008
10,492
2,196
136
OK, damn it...
I think it's about time all of these left over Trumpies faced the music and we get on with the trials and the jail time.
They have Trump's taxes, supposedly the smoking gun of fraud, so why is Donald Trump not in jail or at least in front of a jury?
And the same goes for Rudy Giuliani. I heard they have the good on him too.
And how about Matt Gaetz? Exactly how long does it take to bring a child molester to justice?
And now we add to that long never ending list of Trump bedfellows the name of Louis Dejoy. Old Louis has been screwing the system for a long long time now, so surely this should be an open and shut case, taking what..... a few days at the most to fully litigate?

All of this Trump left-over shit is still going on and on and on and yet the shit is still evading the fan. These crooks are getting away with it because if they are not yet in court or behind bars then they are getting away with it. Period! And the rush is on, damn it.... because in a few short years Donald Trump could be president once again, or at the soonest August of 2021 if you go by the QAnon Cyber Ninjas. And once Trump is back on his throne then none of them especially Donald Trump will ever face the music. If Trump returns, he will be once again immune to any legal action and Trump can and will then grant pardons to all of the crooks including every insurrectionist currently under arrest. I don't want to hear about threats, accusations, or investigations for another three years, I want to see faces behind bars. And by the way, Trump behind bars would be the most effective way to keep Trump out of the Whitehouse. SO get the lead out fellas. If this were president Obama they'd already have him strung up in front of the Whitehouse.
 

hal2kilo

Lifer
Feb 24, 2009
19,811
6,518
136
OK, damn it...
I think it's about time all of these left over Trumpies faced the music and we get on with the trials and the jail time.
They have Trump's taxes, supposedly the smoking gun of fraud, so why is Donald Trump not in jail or at least in front of a jury?
And the same goes for Rudy Giuliani. I heard they have the good on him too.
And how about Matt Gaetz? Exactly how long does it take to bring a child molester to justice?
And now we add to that long never ending list of Trump bedfellows the name of Louis Dejoy. Old Louis has been screwing the system for a long long time now, so surely this should be an open and shut case, taking what..... a few days at the most to fully litigate?

All of this Trump left-over shit is still going on and on and on and yet the shit is still evading the fan. These crooks are getting away with it because if they are not yet in court or behind bars then they are getting away with it. Period! And the rush is on, damn it.... because in a few short years Donald Trump could be president once again, or at the soonest August of 2021 if you go by the QAnon Cyber Ninjas. And once Trump is back on his throne then none of them especially Donald Trump will ever face the music. If Trump returns, he will be once again immune to any legal action and Trump can and will then grant pardons to all of the crooks including every insurrectionist currently under arrest. I don't want to hear about threats, accusations, or investigations for another three years, I want to see faces behind bars. And by the way, Trump behind bars would be the most effective way to keep Trump out of the Whitehouse. SO get the lead out fellas. If this were president Obama they'd already have him strung up in front of the Whitehouse.
Just now realizing it's extremely difficult to put wealthy white men away in prison.
 
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Lost_in_the_HTTP

Diamond Member
Nov 17, 2019
6,371
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They need to get their stuff in order. There are about a dozen various investigations going and not a single new indictment of any key people. The lackey in FL doesn't really count.

I want the GA phone call/tampering one to drop. That oughta' get some attention.
 

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