Debbie Wasserman Schultz's former IT staff flees to Pakistan

[Starbuck1975]

Let's not pretend you're too dumb to understand mexican rapists, kenyan muslims, and "black riggers in those areas, you know what I'm talking about". Those midwest crowds sure got rile up by what he's talking about, unless you feel compelled for the sake of this argument to lower your iq beneath even them.

I am lowering my IQ on your behalf. If you are willing to have an open and honest conversation about why Trump was able to connect with rational people using irrational language, I am willing to have that discussion.

 

[agent00f]

I am lowering my IQ on your behalf. If you are willing to have an open and honest conversation about why Trump was able to connect with rational people using irrational language, I am willing to have that discussion.

No, pretty obvious you love to play dumb same as them when honesty isn't in your best interest.

 

[cytg111]

That's like saying you have to become a junkie to understand addiction...

Almost. I always liked this quote from Enders Game.

In the moment when I truly understand my enemy, understand him well enough to defeat him, then in that very moment I also love him. I think it’s impossible to really understand somebody, what they want, what they believe, and not love them the way they love themselves. And then, in that very moment when I love them.... I destroy them

 

[Starbuck1975]

Strongman Trump flipped a college football stadium worth of people in 3 states to win those states by razor thin margins, giving him an electoral college victory and the Presidency. On the other hand, Clinton won close to 3 million more votes than Strongman Trump, but because of arbitrary lines and electoral college votes, lost.

Blaming everyone but the 63 million people who went to the polls and intentionally pulled a lever to put Strongman Trump into the White House is a pathetic, flaccid narrative.

Screw blaming the people who, like, actually voted for Trump! It was everyone else's fault and stuff you guys!

Keep on keepin' on, clown.

There is no rational explanation for how a candidate like Trump was able to win. The popular vote argument is irrelevant no matter how many times you raise it.

Now, what you could be doing with your time is understand how Trump was able to flip those few football stadiums worth of people, because those people used to be reliable Democrat voters.

Or, you can continue to dismiss them as trailer trash degenerates, and then wonder why they reject the next candidate the DNC power brokers annoint.

Keep on keepin' on indeed.

 

[Starbuck1975]

No, pretty obvious you love to play dumb same as them when honesty isn't in your best interest.

So you are not willing to have an honest and open conversation. That's fine. I didn't have my hopes up that you would.

The irony is that I don't think you are wrong. There is undoubtedly a racial undertone to Trump's appeal, and conservatives will always have race realists as part of their coalition. I've never denied that point.

The problem is that you paint everything with the same flaccid narrative brush. I do admire the persistence and consistency of your flailing.

 

[ch33zw1z]

I wasn't going to really jump in here, but here goes. You make a disconcerting point on this rational/irrational discussion.

I am lowering my IQ on your behalf. If you are willing to have an open and honest conversation about why Trump was able to connect with rational people using irrational language, I am willing to have that discussion.

The language, to a large extent, fell on ears of possibly rational people, but not entirely likely. IMO, this falls directly on peoples willingness to just believe something as opposed to critical thinking.

Sure, some trump voters would seem rational to me, but just some.

Based on what I see, a good amount are single issue voters....and typically based in some religious fundie faux morality fixation.

There is no rational explanation for how a candidate like Trump was able to win.

Sure there is, feed on people's fear and mental malleability with a slanderous barrage of bullshit.

 

[Starbuck1975]

I wasn't going to really jump in here, but here goes. You make a disconcerting point on this rational/irrational discussion.



The language, to a large extent, fell on ears of possibly rational people, but not entirely likely. IMO, this falls directly on peoples willingness to just believe something as opposed to critical thinking.

Sure, some trump voters would seem rational to me, but just some.

Based on what I see, a good amount are single issue voters....and typically based in some religious fundie faux morality fixation.



Sure there is, feed on people's fear and mental malleability with a slanderous barrage of bullshit.

Now we're talking. I grew up in a blue state in a community where very few of the adults had college educations. The dads of all of my friends were carpenters, masons, electricians, plumbers, etc. All came from late 19th or early 20th century immigrant families. All made enough to own respectable homes, take their kids to Disneyworld every summer and live honest, comfortable middle class lives.

Many of their sons and daughters followed in the footsteps of their family businesses as college was prohibitively expensive. Not many of them benefitted during the stock market runs of the 90s, but they certainly felt the pain of the subsequent recessions. Not only that, they are now competing with undocumented labor working at a fraction of their rates.

They played by the rules. They had a good thing going. And now that world is crumbling around them.

They are angry and emotional. They feel the government no longer serves them. They want things to be the way they were. Most are now avid Trump supporters.

It is easy to exploit emotions and offer simple solutions to complex problems. Build a wall!!! Keep out the Muslims!!! Those solutions start to make a lot of sense when the alternative is no solution at all.

Dismissing these people as racists and degenerates only makes them more angry, and causes them to entrench further into their FoxNews world.

 

[ch33zw1z]

I agree with all that. It's sad that their personal experiences haven't taught them about people like trump. Their affinity towards snakeoil salesmen says a great deal about them.

Obama's admin did help them, whether or not Faux news told them, it did. A housing bubble 20+ years in the making popped, and Obama was handed a pile of garbage, but after 8 years it still managed to turn out better than other possible outcomes. *disclaimer, I did not vote for Obama either time, but I will admit he was a great leader

Trump will not help them, his track record in dealings with the blue collar workers is abhorrent.

As a skill laborer (computer service), I'm used to getting shit on at this point. I still wouldn't vote for Trump. He could be the only candidate and I'd write in "a shoe" or some nonsense.

In the end, IMO, it boils down to the propensity for belief. Which is how we got here in the first place. Believing that the job creators will take care of their own. Oh they do, they just didn't tell you that their "own" was the cheapest whatever they can find....not necessarily Americans.

 

[cytg111]

That's like saying you have to become a junkie to understand addiction...

In context of another thread is stumbled upon this
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C3fy0RYpU8Q&feature=youtu.be&t=72
till 3:30

 

[Jaskalas]

Obama's admin did help them,

The Affordable Care Act was seen as poison to the working class. Ask them, and they'll tell you "there's nothing affordable about it".
Obama lost them the minute he fought for the Heritage plan of throwing money at insurance companies while the people pay more.

 

[ch33zw1z]

The Affordable Care Act was seen as poison to the working class. Ask them, and they'll tell you "there's nothing affordable about it".
Obama lost them the minute he fought for the Heritage plan of throwing money at insurance companies while the people pay more.

I know I've said it before....My family of 4 was totally screwed by the ACA.

I have personal family that benefit from the ACA.

Tough call...

I don't like bailing insurance companies out of their own shitty mess....but I don't like the fact that American's can't access healthcare due to costs.

 

[Jhhnn]

The Affordable Care Act was seen as poison to the working class. Ask them, and they'll tell you "there's nothing affordable about it".
Obama lost them the minute he fought for the Heritage plan of throwing money at insurance companies while the people pay more.

Which doesn't explain the simple fact that 20M Americans gained coverage.

 

[Jaskalas]

Which doesn't explain the simple fact that 20M Americans gained coverage.

Who cares? Maybe those 20 million, do they vote? Do they appreciate that they have access to something unaffordable?

Best case scenario maybe a few million appreciate it, and might even vote based on that. The rest of the nation got screwed. How do you think that balance played out? Hmm... 2010, 2012, 2014, 2016.... yeah, I think I know how well that went over with the public.

You cannot claim to have "solved" Healthcare for 6% of the population and expect good results. Have to help everyone.

 

[IronWing]

The Affordable Care Act was seen as poison to the working class. Ask them, and they'll tell you "there's nothing affordable about it".
Obama lost them the minute he fought for the Heritage plan of throwing money at insurance companies while the people pay more.

True. Obama was entrusted to fix healthcare. He punted. His lack of leadership on the issue led directly to the 2010-2016 election losses.

Trump ran on promises of fixing healthcare just like Obama did so if the same folks believed Trump that believed Obama then the Reps have a problem in 2018.

 

[Jhhnn]

Now we're talking. I grew up in a blue state in a community where very few of the adults had college educations. The dads of all of my friends were carpenters, masons, electricians, plumbers, etc. All came from late 19th or early 20th century immigrant families. All made enough to own respectable homes, take their kids to Disneyworld every summer and live honest, comfortable middle class lives.

Many of their sons and daughters followed in the footsteps of their family businesses as college was prohibitively expensive. Not many of them benefitted during the stock market runs of the 90s, but they certainly felt the pain of the subsequent recessions. Not only that, they are now competing with undocumented labor working at a fraction of their rates.

They played by the rules. They had a good thing going. And now that world is crumbling around them.

They are angry and emotional. They feel the government no longer serves them. They want things to be the way they were. Most are now avid Trump supporters.

It is easy to exploit emotions and offer simple solutions to complex problems. Build a wall!!! Keep out the Muslims!!! Those solutions start to make a lot of sense when the alternative is no solution at all.

Dismissing these people as racists and degenerates only makes them more angry, and causes them to entrench further into their FoxNews world.

You paint an entirely inaccurate picture of the past & of what's happened to America. Your third sentence is complete bullshit- "All made enough to own respectable homes, take their kids to Disneyworld every summer".

Disney World never has been big enough for that to be true.

What's happened to us is that the economic fruits of progress have been allocated to the investor class rather than the general population. It's all tied up in our concepts of who owns what & why.

 

[Jhhnn]

Who cares? Maybe those 20 million, do they vote? Do they appreciate that they have access to something unaffordable?

Best case scenario maybe a few million appreciate it, and might even vote based on that. The rest of the nation got screwed. How do you think that balance played out? Hmm... 2010, 2012, 2014, 2016.... yeah, I think I know how well that went over with the public.

You cannot claim to have "solved" Healthcare for 6% of the population and expect good results. Have to help everyone.

They wouldn't have coverage if they couldn't afford it, would they? Obviously not. That renders what you offer into a pointless rant based upon demonstrable falsehood.

 

[brandonbull]

You paint an entirely inaccurate picture of the past & of what's happened to America. Your third sentence is complete bullshit- "All made enough to own respectable homes, take their kids to Disneyworld every summer".

Disney World never has been big enough for that to be true.

Not sure if your are being obtuse or just the typical anti-Trumper. Do you think Starbuck was referring to the families of his father or was using that as a metaphor to mean every middle class family in the US and every one of those families vacationed at Disneyworld during the summer? You also think that the importation of cheap, low-skilled workers have not impacted the wages for the industries that they have labor oversupplied? You also think that the middle class is not getting squeezed out?

 

[NesuD]

Other than demonstrating that DWS and company are horribly bad at finding and hiring competent trustworthy IT staff I don't get why some keep trying to make this into some kind of conspiracy. They are criminals without a doubt but nothing to indicate anything other than that. Anything beyond that is just speculating. Already to much of that going on. Just another family of middle eastern immigrants living or stealing depending on your point of view the American dream. Can't really see how this is political with what is currently known.

 

[Jhhnn]

Not sure if your are being obtuse or just the typical anti-Trumper. Do you think Starbuck was referring to the families of his father or was using that as a metaphor to mean every middle class family in the US and every one of those families vacationed at Disneyworld during the summer? You also think that the importation of cheap, low-skilled workers have not impacted the wages for the industries that they have labor oversupplied? You also think that the middle class is not getting squeezed out?

I just know what he typed is bullshit. What I'm also sure of is that the people he mentions voted to unleash the power of Capitalism via trickle down- right up their own asses.

 

[Jhhnn]

Other than demonstrating that DWS and company are horribly bad at finding and hiring competent trustworthy IT staff I don't get why some keep trying to make this into some kind of conspiracy. They are criminals without a doubt but nothing to indicate anything other than that. Anything beyond that is just speculating. Already to much of that going on. Just another family of middle eastern immigrants living or stealing depending on your point of view the American dream. Can't really see how this is political with what is currently known.

Conspiracy theory is what the fringe whacks live for. They've always been that way. Remember Gen Ripper & his precious bodily fluids from the 1964 movie Dr Strangelove?

That kind of whackiness is contagious, particularly in the hands of propagandists from a plethora of well financed right wing organizations dedicated to manipulating the media & the people.

What they're doing atm is attempting to throw shade on the investigation into Trump & the Russians. They desperately want to believe in the Donald so they'll swallow any line of bullshit that leads away from honest investigation. Musta been Seth Rich, this Pakistani guy or even Bigfoot who hacked the DNC & Podesta. If it wasn't the Russians, then Trump must be innocent. That would be a false conclusion even if it weren't the Russians but it's where their belief system leads them.

 

[brandonbull]

I just know what he typed is bullshit. What I'm also sure of is that the people he mentions voted to unleash the power of Capitalism via trickle down- right up their own asses.

And you wish to release the power of trickle down via government overlords. I guess a good olde dose of Feudalism is what we bloody need.

 

[agent00f]

So you are not willing to have an honest and open conversation. That's fine. I didn't have my hopes up that you would.

The irony is that I don't think you are wrong. There is undoubtedly a racial undertone to Trump's appeal, and conservatives will always have race realists as part of their coalition. I've never denied that point.

The problem is that you paint everything with the same flaccid narrative brush. I do admire the persistence and consistency of your flailing.

No, it's just empirical reality that racial resentment is basically the best predictor of party affiliation, it's a well researched scientific phenomenon. Degenerates & friends are so called because they lack the basic honesty to address empirical realities, while pretending to openness and honest out the side of their mouth. And this is no coincidence given rejecting science & such is what conservatism is all about.

 

[agent00f]

The Affordable Care Act was seen as poison to the working class. Ask them, and they'll tell you "there's nothing affordable about it".
Obama lost them the minute he fought for the Heritage plan of throwing money at insurance companies while the people pay more.

LOL @ conservative blaming obama for compromising onto their own health care plan, the same one their degen friends were busy torpedoing right after; these pieces of shit will try to argue anything.\

Casting conservatives making 72k/yr as the real victims here really is something. But I can't blame them because many democrats are goddamn stupid enough to believe it. Christ they get played so easy.

 

[Triloby]

Now we're talking. I grew up in a blue state in a community where very few of the adults had college educations. The dads of all of my friends were carpenters, masons, electricians, plumbers, etc. All came from late 19th or early 20th century immigrant families. All made enough to own respectable homes, take their kids to Disneyworld every summer and live honest, comfortable middle class lives.

Many of their sons and daughters followed in the footsteps of their family businesses as college was prohibitively expensive. Not many of them benefitted during the stock market runs of the 90s, but they certainly felt the pain of the subsequent recessions. Not only that, they are now competing with undocumented labor working at a fraction of their rates.

They played by the rules. They had a good thing going. And now that world is crumbling around them.

They are angry and emotional. They feel the government no longer serves them. They want things to be the way they were. Most are now avid Trump supporters.

It is easy to exploit emotions and offer simple solutions to complex problems. Build a wall!!! Keep out the Muslims!!! Those solutions start to make a lot of sense when the alternative is no solution at all.

Dismissing these people as racists and degenerates only makes them more angry, and causes them to entrench further into their FoxNews world.

Maybe I shouldn't be saying this, but these people need to stop living in the past and just learn to move on in a changing world. No amount of empty promises or con-artists in federal office can replace the simple fact that the "good ol' days" are never coming back, no matter how much they desperately want them to come back.

I used to know someone who was a successful travel agent with his own small agency back in the 90's, and he was pulling in some good money. And then, the World Wide Web became a thing with online travel booking websites making independent travel agents completely obsolete, and his business went to complete shit. This was, at least, a couple of years before the 2008 global recession happened. Now he's struggling to make any ounce of commission on the smallest amount of tickets he can sell. He could just close down his agency and change his career completely, but he's in his 60's and completely refuses to shut down his only business. He has to work from home now, because he can barely earn enough to pay for his old office rent.

He's now a Trump supporter, and blames Mexicans, Muslims, Democrats, etc. for his problems. He's more than willing to ignore the fact that some of his customers buying his tickets also consists of Muslims and Mexicans.

Regardless of how cold this will sound, there's only one constant rule in this world: Adapt or die.

 

[agent00f]

Maybe I shouldn't be saying this, but these people need to stop living in the past and just learn to move on in a changing world. No amount of empty promises or con-artists in federal office can replace the simple fact that the "good ol' days" are never coming back, no matter how much they desperately want them to come back.

I used to know someone who was a successful travel agent with his own small agency back in the 90's, and he was pulling in some good money. And then, the World Wide Web became a thing with online travel booking websites making independent travel agents completely obsolete, and his business went to complete shit. This was, at least, a couple of years before the 2008 global recession happened. Now he's struggling to make any ounce of commission on the smallest amount of tickets he can sell. He could just close down his agency and change his career completely, but he's in his 60's and completely refuses to shut down his only business. He has to work from home now, because he can barely earn enough to pay for his old office rent.

He's now a Trump supporter, and blames Mexicans, Muslims, Democrats, etc. for his problems. He's more than willing to ignore the fact that some of his customers buying his tickets also consists of Muslims and Mexicans.

Regardless of how cold this will sound, there's only one constant rule in this world: Adapt or die.

Capitalism obviously the fault of mexican rapists and muslim terrorists--welcome to the party of personal responsibility.