[dead] e5200/7850BE now vs. future

[Vicaar]

My motherboard is quite old, and is on its last legs (random bluescreens, and occasional issues with freezing up even during POST). Good old nForce4 s939 board with an A64 3000+. So while an upgrade was in the cards soon, the timing isn't perfect so I need to go with a bit of a bargain - either the Intel e5200 or the AMD 7850BE.

Currently, these two combos appear perfect in terms of price and features (note that the 'extras' on the AMD board like integrated video, RAID, and crossfire aren't huge selling points for me so while AMD is technically the better deal feature-wise, I won't use the extras):
http://www.newegg.com/Product/...?ItemList=Combo.190819
http://www.newegg.com/Product/...?ItemList=Combo.190737

This is a modest gaming machine, and some low-end 3D work - obviously I've been doing fine with an A64 3000+ all this time, so Crysis at super-hyper-enthusiast settings isn't expected, but I don't want to unnecessarily cripple myself either.

I realize the e5200 will overclock to ~3.4-3.6GHz while the 7850BE will only hit ~3.1GHz (I won't push past the 'standard' overclocks - will do what I can initially with the stock cooler and eventually upgrade that if I can't even reach the above values).

So here's the real question: It appears that the Biostar AM2+/AM3 board has a potentially 'longer' life than the end-of-life 775 Gigabyte chipset (ie., Q9650 or similar is the best chip that I'll ever have for it, whereas I don't believe we've seen where AM3 will top out yet?). Would I be hurting myself significantly performance-wise _now_ with the 7850BE over the e5200 in hopes of having higher overhead later to put a bigger quad down in the future (the future being when the higher-end quads hit a ~$100 pricepoint...)? Or should I assume that the top AM3 chip likely to come out before AMD changes the chipset again will end up on-par with the Q9650 and if I wait too long to upgrade I'll have to move to a new chipset again anyway - defeating the point of trying to be 'future-proof' now?

I'd love to hold out a bit longer and just get a 720 x3 BE, but my current machine isn't acting like it'll hold out that long, and the wife will object to going any higher in price. So whichever of the two I go for, it'll need to last at least a decent time (the potential to upgrade just the CPU later (~2 years) stands a better chance than another round of cpu+mb+ram). Yay for going barebones budget eh?

 

[LoneNinja]

The E5200 is a much more capable processor if you overclock than the 7850 will be, it'll also save on the power bill. As far as future upgrades are concerned, I wouldn't worry about that too much in this decision as AM2+ boards will most likely loose support sooner than AM3 will, and AMD hasn't been too clear if anything will come between Deneb and Bulldozer for the desktop. We know the core count will be ramped up on the server side, but there has been no mention of desktop counterparts yet.

 

[heyheybooboo]

For gaming: Kuma 7850BE
For Apps: e5200

Lookee here:
http://www.anandtech.com/cpuch...owdoc.aspx?i=3554&p=10

There are some really cheap G31 mobos (with 'zero' upgrade path). The ASRock 760v is qualified up to the Phenom 955 AM3 but only has 2 DIMM slots.

 

[Vicaar]

Heyhey... the biggest problem with that review is that it doesn't take overclocking into account at all. I believe bit-tech had a review that seemed to show that the e5200 was "better" even in games when oc'd (though they used a somewhat unrealistic 4.0Ghz overclock on the e5200 - but even at a smaller overclock it appears the e5200 would be 'equivalent'?).

LoneNinja - this is sorta what I was thinking, however it appears that the Biostar board is in fact AM3 capable as well? Or will future AM3 chips be limited to AM3 "only" boards because of DDR3?

 

[LoneNinja]

http://www.firingsquad.com/har...u_roadmap_update_2008/

I can't say that the roadmap in that link is 100% accurate, but it seems Deneb and Propus (Phenom II and Athlon II) are expected to hold over the desktop space until the end of 2010 while supporting both DDR2/DDR3, however the next new architecture has support for only DDR3 and might even require a new socket. If this holds true the best processor that will ever be available for AM2+ is the Phenom II which performance wise is very similar to C2Q for the socket 775. However it is always possible that the 6 core Opteron may see a desktop part, so it really is a gamble.

As long as AMD continues to put DDR2 memory controllers in their cpu's and any needed BIOS updates are released for your motherboard any AM3 cpu should work in AM2+, however if that roadmap is correct DDR2 support is dropped end of next year.

 

[Fox5]

I've got an e5200 and could only get it to 3.3Ghz.

 

[tokie]

I have an E5300 running at 3.2GHz stock volts/cooler. I would go for the e5200 since 95w vs 65w is a pretty big difference, and for ~$80 it's kind of throwaway after 2 years anyways.

 

[Flipped Gazelle]

Originally posted by: tokie
I have an E5300 running at 3.2GHz stock volts/cooler. I would go for the e5200 since 95w vs 65w is a pretty big difference, and for ~$80 it's kind of throwaway after 2 years anyways.

And that's the reason the OP should go for the 7850 BE. In 2 years, there is the possibility that the OP will be able to slip in a better/cheaper CPU than he could with a LGA775 motherboard.

OP, if you do go for the 7850, don't overclock only by adjusting the multiplier. New-ish AMD CPU's benefit greatly from HTT/IMC overclocking.

All that said, there is never going to be a huge overall performance difference between the 2 platforms.

 

[Vicaar]

Thank you all for the input. I'm leaning very strongly towards the 7850 at this point, especially since the motherboard seems to be quite decent with the combo discount.

I have found a similar 720 x3 BE combo (same Biostar motherboard), that ends up adding $70 to the price. Newegg currently has a deal on OCZ Reaper DDR2-800 ram ($48 w/ $20 MIR) + WD 640GB harddrive ($60) (which I need as well... still running a 120gb IDE today).

So, $255 out the door for the 7850+mb/ram/hd, or $325 out the door for 720 x3+mb/ram/hd. I currently only have a 9600GT video card, but I also only run at 1680x1050. Trying to decide whether I should push the wife for the extra $70 to cover the difference now, or save the $70 to put towards a better vid card later. This is driving me nuts! Will have to pull the trigger tomorrow on my final decision, as most of these discounts and rebates end then.

 

[Vicaar]

As the nature of my question has changed drastically thanks to the help here, 'closing' this thread to re-ask in a better titled thread.