Damned audio engineers

[Chaotic42]

I like the song "Long December" so I bought the "Best of" Counting Crows CD a couple of days ago. The rest of the songs on the CD aren't that great, but for some reason the audio engineers (or more likely their bosses) decided that it would be cool to take the audio and run it through a +35dB filter before they made the master. This CD is so freaking loud and it just sounds bad. Even on my abyssmal 12 year old Mazda's speakers.

Anyone else ever get CDs like this? I realize that people like loud music, but if my CD player is at 2/50 when playing the CD and the radio station is comfortable at 10/50, what's the point?

Edit: deciBELLS!

 

[Ronstang]

People are getting dumber by the day. In this instance people think louder is better so they remaster old recordings to make them louder. Too bad if completely fubars the music. Like I said, people are getting dumber.....and I thought that was impossible.

 

[Special K]

Why does boosting the volume of the music ruin it? I understand the inconvenience factor of having to adjust the volume every time, but isn't there more to it than that?

<- audio n00b

 

[IAteYourMother]

Originally posted by: Special K
Why does boosting the volume of the music ruin it? I understand the inconvenience factor of having to adjust the volume every time, but isn't there more to it than that?

<- audio n00b

it sounds horrible?

 

[Special K]

Originally posted by: IAteYourMother

Originally posted by: Special K
Why does boosting the volume of the music ruin it? I understand the inconvenience factor of having to adjust the volume every time, but isn't there more to it than that?

<- audio n00b

it sounds horrible?

Right but the other posters were implying that even if you turned the volume down, it would still sound bad. I was asking why that is the case.

 

[Chaotic42]

Originally posted by: Special K
Why does boosting the volume of the music ruin it? I understand the inconvenience factor of having to adjust the volume every time, but isn't there more to it than that?

<- audio n00b

I worked on the radio for a couple of years, and I'm not an audio engineer by any means, but raising the volume can cause clipping, where the top of the wave is clipped off.

Also, I assume that the Counting Crows or whoever was incharge of making their original songs made them that way because they felt that the result was a good balance of soft, quiet parts and the parts that needed to be loud (the crack of a snare drum comes to mind). When the volume is pushed up and clipped, that normal difference between a whisper and the snare drum moves from say 120dB to 80dB.

Why mess with it? It was fine the way it was.

 

[LordMorpheus]

Originally posted by: Chaotic42

Originally posted by: Special K
Why does boosting the volume of the music ruin it? I understand the inconvenience factor of having to adjust the volume every time, but isn't there more to it than that?

<- audio n00b

I worked on the radio for a couple of years, and I'm not an audio engineer by any means, but raising the volume can cause clipping, where the top of the wave is clipped off.

Also, I assume that the Counting Crows or whoever was incharge of making their original songs made them that way because they felt that the result was a good balance of soft, quiet parts and the parts that needed to be loud (the crack of a snare drum comes to mind). When the volume is pushed up and clipped, that normal difference between a whisper and the snare drum moves from say 120dB to 80dB.

Why mess with it? It was fine the way it was.

What happens is that when you've got your stereo turned low to make it a reasonable volume, it isn't capable of putting as much power to the speakers as it can at full blast, but if the recording is very loud it might be demanding that much power, so the extremes are clipped off by the limitations of the amplifier. If instead the recording was at a normal volume, you could up the volume on your amp and play at the same loudness level without clipping.

Confusing, but for example when you've got an MP3 player running into a line-in on your head unit, and you get clipping, you can turn down the volume on the MP3 player and turn the volume on the head unit up, you can get the same loudness without the clipping.

 

[clickynext]

Originally posted by: Chaotic42

Originally posted by: Special K
Why does boosting the volume of the music ruin it? I understand the inconvenience factor of having to adjust the volume every time, but isn't there more to it than that?

<- audio n00b

I worked on the radio for a couple of years, and I'm not an audio engineer by any means, but raising the volume can cause clipping, where the top of the wave is clipped off.

Also, I assume that the Counting Crows or whoever was incharge of making their original songs made them that way because they felt that the result was a good balance of soft, quiet parts and the parts that needed to be loud (the crack of a snare drum comes to mind). When the volume is pushed up and clipped, that normal difference between a whisper and the snare drum moves from say 120dB to 80dB.

Why mess with it? It was fine the way it was.

If they actually amplified the music to the point that it actually clips, that would be the worst decision ever.

 

[NanoStuff]

It's not clipping that's the problem. Why would a presumably talented recording studio not identify clipping in an audio track?

The problem is not high peak amplitude, the problem is high average amplitude. Dynamic range compression makes the track louder, but it doesn't introduce clipping. The maximum gain on the track would still be the same, often normalized to 0dB.

It's largely a stunt to make your track more noticeable than that of the competition. People are stupid like that.

 

[indamixx99]

Yeah... Dynamic Compression FTL
Ever ripped an older CD to your comp and compared its waveform to a newer, more current cd? Less peaks and valleys on the current cd's.

 

[StrangerGuy]

Originally posted by: Special K
Why does boosting the volume of the music ruin it? I understand the inconvenience factor of having to adjust the volume every time, but isn't there more to it than that?

<- audio n00b

Boosting the overall volume of a CD sacrifices dynamic range, which means the volume difference between soft and loud parts gets smaller and the music sounds harsher or unnatural.

Correct me if I'm wrong.

 

[dwell]

Originally posted by: Special K
Why does boosting the volume of the music ruin it? I understand the inconvenience factor of having to adjust the volume every time, but isn't there more to it than that?

<- audio n00b

You're not just boosting the volume, you're flattening the dynamics then slamming everything up to ten.

 

[Jeff7]

There was a huge thread about this some months ago, which provided some good examples of what was wrong when dynamic compression was overused. Sometimes it's done to the point where the instrumentation overrides the vocals, which kind of sucks when the star of the CD is a singer, not a musician. In that case, the main point of the album is his or her voice, while the instrumentation is done by backup players.

 

[gsellis]

Originally posted by: Chaotic42
I like the song "Long December" so I bought the "Best of" Counting Crows CD a couple of days ago. The rest of the songs on the CD aren't that great, but for some reason the audio engineers (or more likely their bosses) decided that it would be cool to take the audio and run it through a +35dB filter before they made the master. This CD is so freaking loud and it just sounds bad. Even on my abyssmal 12 year old Mazda's speakers.

Anyone else ever get CDs like this? I realize that people like loud music, but if my CD player is at 2/50 when playing the CD and the radio station is comfortable at 10/50, what's the point?

Edit: deciBELLS!

It is nice to see that after all these years, the guy who mastered Neil Young's Rock and Roll Will Never Die has work again.

It is probably the same guy who works to make it sound like Jessica Simpson can actually sing too.

Sorry that Counting Crows have been ruined for you.

 

[brxndxn]

I think the best example of audio engineers totally and completely fvcking up an entire hit song is...

Red Hot Chili Peppers - Scar Tissue..

even in the 'remastered' albums, it still sounds like total sh1t..

 

[rstrohkirch]

If a modern track has more then 9db of range during it's dynamic passages I'd be surprised
Most of my 80s and early 90s cds have around 12-15db of dynamic range...those days aren't obviously coming back

 

[dwell]

http://www.pics.bbzzdd.com/beta/users/dwell/dynamics.png

Beatles: I Got A Feeling 1970 recording (blue) composited with 2003 remaster (red)