Current tablet options?

[Dubb]

Going back to architecture school this fall for my professional degree. I have a reasonable desktop for serious modeling and crunching, but I will need a laptop as well for classes and studio.

Ideally, I'd like a tablet, or tablet netbook, but haven't really followed the last year or two of development. The smaller and lighter the better. What should I be looking at? the 12 inch eeepad looks great but won't come out til next year. Need to have it in my hands by mid August.

basic requirements:

-pen input
-able to drop in a decent SSD
-run photoshop, illustrator, and indesign at a basic level
-run MOI and rhino at a basic level (some sort of GFX chip would be nice)
-remote desktop to home computer
-USB ports for DSLR tethering / peripherals

 

[aceO07]

Thinkpad X201t (http://www.thinkwiki.org/wiki/Category:X201_Tablet) could be an option. Though I don't know the requirements for MOI. It has an Intel i7, so it's not slow. The resolution is a bit disappointing though, 1280x800.

The tablets from HP and Fujitsu seem to be thicker and heavier.

(I have an X61t, which I really like. It came before the X200t.)

 

[Griffinhart]

The Lenovo Tablet is nice. It's about 3/4 a pound lighter than the HP Touchsmart TM2. Size is similar.

The Lenovo Screen is a bit nicer than the Touchsmart as well. But there are a couple of advantages that the Touchsmart has that the Lenovo doesn't.

There are dedicated GPU options for the Touchsmart. You're stuck with just the intel graphics on the Lenovo. What I really like about the TM2's dedicated graphics is that you still have the intel graphics. It will automatically switch to the lower power intel graphics when on battery. So, you get the best of both worlds. A decent GPU when needed and the long battery life when not.

The biggest advantage is price. The Lenovo X201 starts at $2100 with 2GB of RAM. I just got my TM2 a few weeks ago. I paid $900 for it got the switchable graphics and 8GB of RAM. It runs Photoshop CS5 (64-bit) just fine.

If your requirements are

-pen input The TM2 uses a pressure sensitive Wacom Digitizer, as good or better than the Lenovo
-able to drop in a decent SSD - Works fine with SSD.
-run photoshop, illustrator, and indesign at a basic level - Works great with Photoshop
-run MOI and rhino at a basic level (some sort of GFX chip would be nice) - Dedicated GPU option available on Built to order machines
-remote desktop to home computer - Any Windows 7 Machine can do this
-USB ports for DSLR tethering / peripherals - 3 USB ports available. It also has an HDMI port.

The X201 is a great Tablet. I'd probably go for it if I could live without the dedicated GPU and money wasn't an option. But the HP Touchsmart TM2 is worth a look. Here's a review of the unit.
http://www.mobiletechreview.com/notebooks/HP-TouchSmart-TM2.htm

 

[Dubb]

Was looking at the X201T...seems great except for the price and the lack of a graphics chip. How much will EPP/shareholder pricing save you these days?

The TM2t is interesting, but HP's site only has configurable Core 2 duo machines, and I found reviews of i3 models. Don't know what's going on there. Also looks kind of kludgey, and I dislike glossy screens.

hmm. I'm almost tempted to get a normal laptop and an intuos.

 

[Griffinhart]

The HP Tablets are in the middle of a refresh. The TM2t's came out around Feb. Those are currently the versions available from HP when you build to order. You can get pre-configured models with i3 processors from Amazon and other e-tailers, but they don't have the dedicated graphics in them that I can see yet.

The build quality of the TM2 is quite good. Nothing Kludgey about it.

I was worried bout the glossy screen, but it honestly hasn't been an issue. Since I just got mine a few weeks ago, I was watching for the refresh since I really wanted to get the i3 or i5 with the improved dedicated GPU. But, the more I researched the more I found out that the new GPU isn't much better than the TM2t 1000's and the battery life on the i3/i5 will likely be less than the C2D ULV chips. The i3/i5 is still pretty good at power, but the C2D's are better. 18w vs 10w respectively. By comparison the Older TX2 used an AMD Turion X2 which used around 38w.

Still, what machine you get is all personal preference. I would love to have The X201t, but I just couldn't justify that kind of price. You just can't beat the TM2 for Value as far as tablets go. A similarily spec'd X201 would have cost me $1600 MORE than the tablet I got.

 

[corkyg]

Some say it is a huge super phone, but actually it is a tablet. Dell's "Streak" has been released in Europe and will be here soon. It really is a pocket PC based on the Android system. Could be a classroom note taking winner.

http://review.techworld.com/phones/3228230/dell-streak-review/?intcmp=rv-md-rv-rm

 

[sxr7171]

Was looking at the X201T...seems great except for the price and the lack of a graphics chip. How much will EPP/shareholder pricing save you these days?

The TM2t is interesting, but HP's site only has configurable Core 2 duo machines, and I found reviews of i3 models. Don't know what's going on there. Also looks kind of kludgey, and I dislike glossy screens.

hmm. I'm almost tempted to get a normal laptop and an intuos.

IMHO, the X201t is the only tablet I would be interested in but it weighs 4lbs as opposed to the regular x201s which can be as low as 2.4lbs. I can't figure out why I would make that sacrifice especially for an OS like Win 7 which is still pretty poor IMHO as far as innovative touch interfaces go. I think a laptop + Wacom is a much better solution, you will have so much more control with choice of laptop and digitizer and software. I doubt MS will have a compelling touch interface for windows for a couple of years. HP will beat them with a nice WebOS tablet and even Apple will hopefully make a half-way decent iPad next year. Android too will have nice tablets. Windows will lag in that regard for a while.

 

[Emulex]

2740p with a pair of 160gb intel ssd in raid-0 - with anti-glare led screen. pretty snappy.

 

[mazzarin]

I would do a fair amount of research to see whether the "Intel GMA HD" will be sufficient for your apps, otherwise your only option is the TM2T.

If the Intel HD is ok, then it just depends on your price range. TM2T vs. Fujitsu TH700 on an entry level, X201T vs. 2740p on the upper end. Those are all dual pen/touch capable machines using Wacom digitizers.

 

[Griffinhart]

Some say it is a huge super phone, but actually it is a tablet. Dell's "Streak" has been released in Europe and will be here soon. It really is a pocket PC based on the Android system. Could be a classroom note taking winner.

http://review.techworld.com/phones/3228230/dell-streak-review/?intcmp=rv-md-rv-rm

Are there any good android based note taking apps? Onenote is pretty damn good for the task. Honestly, if it weren't for Onenote, I probably wouldn't be bothering with my tablet and just use a laptop. The ability to build subject based notebooks with tabs and pages, handwriting to text conversion and the ability to run text searches on notebooks even on handwritten notes is pretty awesome.

 

[corkyg]

Looks like there are quite a lot of them.

http://note-taking.net/top-android-notes/

 

[aceO07]

Looks like there are quite a lot of them.

http://note-taking.net/top-android-notes/

I've tried a few of them, AK Notepad, Astrid, Sticky Memo.. I have to give it to OneNote.

Maybe the Android note taking experience would be better on a bigger screen, but OneNote has a lot of unique features that the Android apps don't have. Having access to a keyboard/mouse/stylus probably helps out a lot.

http://il.youtube.com/watch?v=j5bHf_pV-ZM&feature=related Here's a video of some of its features.

 

[Griffinhart]

I took a look at the top 5 of those not taking android apps. Honesly, they don't come close. No inking capability and it lacks a ton of the things I use in Onenote on a daily basis. They are all pretty basic. Then again, I just took a look at the Dell Streak. I honestly don't have a use for a tablet without pen support. An Active Digitizer is what makes the device useful as a note taking device for me.

My tablet's pressure sensitive Wacom digitizer is what makes the tablet. Touch is nice, but I honestly don't use touch unless I am watching videos or browsing photos. Virtual on screen keyboards don't do it for me. I want either a real keyboard or a pen when writing and photo editing with touch is like trying to type with oven mitts on.

It's beyond me why tablet makers are so anti-pen right now. Pens are just the right tool for the job when taking notes and editing photos.

 

[Griffinhart]

I've tried a few of them, AK Notepad, Astrid, Sticky Memo.. I have to give it to OneNote.

Maybe the Android note taking experience would be better on a bigger screen, but OneNote has a lot of unique features that the Android apps don't have. Having access to a keyboard/mouse/stylus probably helps out a lot.

http://il.youtube.com/watch?v=j5bHf_pV-ZM&feature=related Here's a video of some of its features.

That was for Onenote 2007, it has improved in 2010. One of my favorite features is the search ability. about half the time I convert my handwriting to text, but I want to be able to search everything. When I am looking through my notes on Subnetting, all I do is enter subnet into the search field, and it shows me every mention of the word, including handwritten notes I haven't converted. That is just awesome.

 

[corkyg]

Agree about the pen or stylus. A fingertip is too big on a small screen for precise selection and annotation. That was one thing I liked about the old Palm.

 

[Dubb]

I would do a fair amount of research to see whether the "Intel GMA HD" will be sufficient for your apps, otherwise your only option is the TM2T.

If the Intel HD is ok, then it just depends on your price range. TM2T vs. Fujitsu TH700 on an entry level, X201T vs. 2740p on the upper end. Those are all dual pen/touch capable machines using Wacom digitizers.

This is what I'm wrestling with. I know that integrated graphics will work, but will be pretty limited in the size/complexity of models they can easily work with. I think that's OK for most of what I'll be doing... I think.

I'm really kind of disappointed that lenovo stopped making thin workstations. I configured a w501 just to see how expensive it would be, but stopped when I realized it was 7 lbs and 1.5" thick. If I went that route I'd want and updated version of my old, broken T41p, which was barely over 5 lbs.

Added complexity is I think I can get a pretty good deal on an x201t through the university ($1650 pretty loaded)...but a similar deal isn't available on the w501.

hmmm.

 

[Hacp]

You know what the worst thing that can happen to you is? Losing your pen. UGH. Just lost the pen to my 2710p. Now I'm mad. Its 35 bucks to get a new one.

 

[Dubb]

So I'm having some trouble finding openGL / DX benchmarks for the i7 640LM in the x201t.

I noticed that the graphics accelerator in the LM processors is a bit slower than normal than in the normal i7s: 266-566MHz vs 500-733MHz, but I can't find out what that translates to performance wise.

http://www.notebookcheck.net/Intel-Core-i7-640LM-Notebook-Processor.25082.0.html

Bah. I loaded up some portable installs of MOI and sketchup on a USB key along with some test files. I'm going to drop by tiger direct and office depot to see if they have any computers running that processor that I can test out.

 

[cbn]

You know what the worst thing that can happen to you is? Losing your pen. UGH. Just lost the pen to my 2710p. Now I'm mad. Its 35 bucks to get a new one.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K0M5WC8IaTg&feature=player_embedded

It looks ASUS did a good job on making a storage place for the Stylus (see 1:41 into the video) on its upcoming EP121 Eeepad.

 

[cbn]

I can't figure out why I would make that sacrifice especially for an OS like Win 7 which is still pretty poor IMHO as far as innovative touch interfaces go.

I think a laptop + Wacom is a much better solution, you will have so much more control with choice of laptop and digitizer and software. I doubt MS will have a compelling touch interface for windows for a couple of years.

What tasks do the Wacom Tablets excel at compared to a Windows 7 Tablet with stylus?

Based on the information I have gathered from this thread it appears folks are happy with Windows 7 touch for notes provided a stylus is present.

 

[aceO07]

That was for Onenote 2007, it has improved in 2010.

What's improved in Onenote 2010?

 

[mazzarin]

You know what the worst thing that can happen to you is? Losing your pen. UGH. Just lost the pen to my 2710p. Now I'm mad. Its 35 bucks to get a new one.

30 and 40 introduced a double clutch pen silo which... helps reduce such occurrences

What's improved in Onenote 2010?

In rough order of importance imo:
1) Much better multi-user collaboration - both in terms of actual sync, and other features like versioning, indications of author, etc.
2) More logical print breaks (03 and 07 were kind of a crap shoot)
3) Improved searching

It also has some things I haven't really been able to test out yet like 'sidenote' mode but I gladly upgraded for the above three reasons.

 

[Dubb]

So I'm having some trouble finding openGL / DX benchmarks for the i7 640LM in the x201t.

Bah. I loaded up some portable installs of MOI and sketchup on a USB key along with some test files. I'm going to drop by tiger direct and office depot to see if they have any computers running that processor that I can test out.

well, I stopped by today. Nobody had a computer runing an i7LM processor. maybe best buy would? I did try out an i3 350m and things ran OK. Couldn't handle the huge files and didn't have any AA setting available but it was better than I expected.

But unfortunately it looks like the LM processors have an even slower graphics core:

http://www.notebookcheck.net/Intel-Graphics-Media-Accelerator-HD.23065.0.html

so I'm kinda thinking I need a real GPU.

 

[aceO07]

So I'm having some trouble finding openGL / DX benchmarks for the i7 640LM in the x201t.

You might be able to get a response to that question at this forum, http://forum.thinkpads.com/viewforum.php?f=43&start=0 Not sure if you looked there yet.

 

[Dubb]

You might be able to get a response to that question at this forum, http://forum.thinkpads.com/viewforum.php?f=43&start=0 Not sure if you looked there yet.

Yeah, I've looked through there. a little useful info but not much.

From what I've been able to piece together, the LM processors have a graphics core that's around 25% lower performance than the standard M variants.

From what I can tell, that would put an LM processor in the useable, but barely category.

As much as I really, really, want a usable tablet, I don't think one exists yet that is good enough for what I want to do with it.

And I don't like that midrange business class laptops all seem to have moved to quadro NVS solutions, which don't do all that much better than the current integrated graphics options.

Meaning if I don't get a tablet, pretty much my only practical option is a 6lb+ mobile workstation or a bootcamped MBP.

This sucks. What the hell happened to the laptop industry? At this point I just want a 5lb quality laptop with some decent geforce.