Crusades in the 21st century

[raildogg]

To many muslims, every invasion of their homeland by outsiders is seen as a crusade. It is seen as a direct assault to the thing they hold most dear, their religion. Jihad is a huge part of Islam and always has been, so it is no surprise that they are rising up against the West just like they rose up a thousand years ago.

Is Osama the modern-day Saladin?

Many muslims view 9/11 as a payback. Since we struck back, they will try to strike back at us once again. There will be a cycle.

These riots in France show that many muslims simply want to change the way many countries do things, even if it takes violence, like in this case. I understand the feelings these people must go through, being ridiculed and mistreated by the arrogant French. But that gives them no right to set cars and people on fire.

In comparison, do how non-muslims great treated in muslim countries? I think the answer is pretty obvious.

We know that in the end the invading Christian armies did not win. And outside of a country called Israel, that region is dominated by tyrannies and they surround Jerusalem.

I think there is going to be huge wars pretty soon and religion is going to be the central issue. It just won't be Christian vs. Muslim, it will involve Jews, hindus, buddhists and everyone else on this earth.

 

[irwincur]

Is Osama the modern-day Saladin?

Giving him a bit too much credit...

Saladin was a brave warrior and leader. Bin Ladin is a scared, hiding pile of crap.

 

[raildogg]

Originally posted by: irwincur

Is Osama the modern-day Saladin?

Giving him a bit too much credit...

Saladin was a brave warrior and leader. Bin Ladin is a scared, hiding pile of crap.

That is true. But some muslims do view Osama as a Saladin-type figure. They view him as a leader who is fighting back against the Infidel armies of the world. Saladin took back Jerusalem, they want Osama to do the same. Its not a direct comparison since Saladin was superior in every single way. Maybe Zarqawi will be their next if he drives the invading US forces out of Iraq.

 

[sandorski]

:roll:

Then as now the similarity has to do with Westerners meddling in their affairs.

 

[EatSpam]

Would you mind leaving me out of your fights over who's imaginary friend is better?

 

[CanOWorms]

Islam already had many equivalent of Crusades all over the world. It's time for another religion to have a "Crusade." I'd like to see Buddhists go on it

 

[jpeyton]

Originally posted by: raildogg
I think there is going to be huge wars pretty soon and religion is going to be the central issue.

Cool, when?

 

[raildogg]

Originally posted by: sandorski
:roll:

Then as now the similarity has to do with Westerners meddling in their affairs.

Im sure India, Israel, Russia, Phillipines, Thailand and many others are part of the West!

:roll:

 

[ntdz]

I don't see Islam as the problem at all. 99.999% of Muslims aren't out there blowing themselves up or trying to hurt westerners. It's the Islamic fundies that are the problem, the ones that expliot the Islamic religion. For that reason, I don't see there being a "holy war" or anything.

 

[Specop 007]

Originally posted by: ntdz
I don't see Islam as the problem at all. 99.999% of Muslims aren't out there blowing themselves up or trying to hurt westerners. It's the Islamic fundies that are the problem, the ones that expliot the Islamic religion. For that reason, I don't see there being a "holy war" or anything.

And what about the 99.999% that sits back and lets it all happen.
Its really simple, if you blow up a busstop your a terrorist. But if you sit back and do nothing to stop that guy from blowing up the busstop....

Members of Islam have been very forgiving of their own in what they do.

 

[raildogg]

Originally posted by: ntdz
I don't see Islam as the problem at all. 99.999% of Muslims aren't out there blowing themselves up or trying to hurt westerners. It's the Islamic fundies that are the problem, the ones that expliot the Islamic religion. For that reason, I don't see there being a "holy war" or anything.

Yes. They see all our actions against them as being the same as those done by Christians a thousand years ago. We are the crusaders to them. I don't know where you got those statistics from, but looking at recent events in France and elsewhere Im not even sure anymore.

 

[jpeyton]

Originally posted by: Specop 007

Originally posted by: ntdz
I don't see Islam as the problem at all. 99.999% of Muslims aren't out there blowing themselves up or trying to hurt westerners. It's the Islamic fundies that are the problem, the ones that expliot the Islamic religion. For that reason, I don't see there being a "holy war" or anything.

And what about the 99.999% that sits back and lets it all happen.
Its really simple, if you blow up a busstop your a terrorist. But if you sit back and do nothing to stop that guy from blowing up the busstop....

Members of Islam have been very forgiving of their own in what they do.

There is NO LAW in the United States (or any other country, for that matter) which requires a Muslim to play police officer and stop terrorists just because they claim the same religious beliefs.

What exactly HAVE YOU done to stop guys from blowing up bus stops?

And please submit results of your survey for our review. You know, the survey which you asked Muslims if they forgave terrorists for their acts. I want to make sure your survey is scientifically sound.

 

[jpeyton]

Originally posted by: raildogg

Originally posted by: ntdz
I don't see Islam as the problem at all. 99.999% of Muslims aren't out there blowing themselves up or trying to hurt westerners. It's the Islamic fundies that are the problem, the ones that expliot the Islamic religion. For that reason, I don't see there being a "holy war" or anything.

Yes. They see all our actions against them as being the same as those done by Christians a thousand years ago. We are the crusaders to them. I don't know where you got those statistics from, but looking at recent events in France and elsewhere Im not even sure anymore.

We are Crusaders to US as well. Look at any recent poll; support for the President is under 40%, almost 60% of the public feels he was dishonest, and a clear majority think the war in Iraq was a mistake.

If our own people think we're on a Crusade in the Middle East, why wouldn't the rest of the world?

 

[magomago]

Bin Laden isn't Saladin. He is a fool, an idiot. Before him people viewed Islam with a nicer view. Most Americans had a favorable view of Islam in a few polls a little before 9/11

That arsehole changed everything and turned the tide on people's opinion. Someone any MUSLIM became the enemy! If you guys only knew the trash tossed on my mom for wearing a Hijab.

Bin Laden can be smothered in a barrle of ****** for all I care. I will say I agree with alot of his greivances, but he didn't have to fvck everything up the way he did


edit:

But when you have the president using "crusade vocabulary" and have high level military officials saying stuff like "my god is better than your god" and mocking Muslims...it doesn't help anything

 

[raildogg]

Originally posted by: jpeyton

Originally posted by: raildogg

Originally posted by: ntdz
I don't see Islam as the problem at all. 99.999% of Muslims aren't out there blowing themselves up or trying to hurt westerners. It's the Islamic fundies that are the problem, the ones that expliot the Islamic religion. For that reason, I don't see there being a "holy war" or anything.

Yes. They see all our actions against them as being the same as those done by Christians a thousand years ago. We are the crusaders to them. I don't know where you got those statistics from, but looking at recent events in France and elsewhere Im not even sure anymore.

We are Crusaders to US as well. Look at any recent poll; support for the President is under 40%, almost 60% of the public feels he was dishonest, and a clear majority think the war in Iraq was a mistake.

If our own people think we're on a Crusade in the Middle East, why wouldn't the rest of the world?

Nah, we're not in the Middle East to make these people Christian. Why do you bring up Bush? I don't care about him or what the public thinks about him. Polls don't stay still. But you guys have gotten some type of routine going.

I don't know if Americans think we're on a Crusade in Iraq. Maybe you and people like you think so, not sure about mainstream America. If we leave Iraq now, people will Zarqawi will be paraded through the streets of every Arab country. Don't turn him into something he is not. Leaving Iraq now is saying the deaths of our soldiers didn't matter.

Anyway, back on topic. The Crusades in the 21st century will take place all over the world. It should be interesting.

 

[raildogg]

Originally posted by: magomago
Bin Laden isn't Saladin. He is a fool, an idiot. Before him people viewed Islam with a nicer view. Most Americans had a favorable view of Islam in a few polls a little before 9/11

That arsehole changed everything and turned the tide on people's opinion. Someone any MUSLIM became the enemy! If you guys only knew the trash tossed on my mom for wearing a Hijab.

Bin Laden can be smothered in a barrle of ****** for all I care. I will say I agree with alot of his greivances, but he didn't have to fvck everything up the way he did


edit:

But when you have the president using "crusade vocabulary" and have high level military officials saying stuff like "my god is better than your god" and mocking Muslims...it doesn't help anything

Bush is trying to please muslims in America so he will use anything to get their attention.

Bin Laden is viewed as a hero among some muslims. He is not a fool. He knows what he is doing. I understand it must be difficult for your mom after 9/11. Many people were harrassed after that date. Luckily, this is America and she has a right to wear a hijab.

What grievances of his do you agree with?

 

[ntdz]

Originally posted by: Specop 007

Originally posted by: ntdz
I don't see Islam as the problem at all. 99.999% of Muslims aren't out there blowing themselves up or trying to hurt westerners. It's the Islamic fundies that are the problem, the ones that expliot the Islamic religion. For that reason, I don't see there being a "holy war" or anything.

And what about the 99.999% that sits back and lets it all happen.
Its really simple, if you blow up a busstop your a terrorist. But if you sit back and do nothing to stop that guy from blowing up the busstop....

Members of Islam have been very forgiving of their own in what they do.

That's no argument at all. Are you somehow responsible for murders and car thefts because you didn't stop them from doing it? Just because they are the same religious faith doesn't mean they are responsible for everyone in their faith's actions. Come on man...

Edit: Now, I will say this. Those Muslims who agree with Bin Laden's actions and the terrorist attacks on the "infedels" are despicable scum, but not guilty of anything besides being an ignorant piece of trash.

 

[jpeyton]

Originally posted by: raildogg

Originally posted by: jpeyton

Originally posted by: raildogg

Originally posted by: ntdz
I don't see Islam as the problem at all. 99.999% of Muslims aren't out there blowing themselves up or trying to hurt westerners. It's the Islamic fundies that are the problem, the ones that expliot the Islamic religion. For that reason, I don't see there being a "holy war" or anything.

Yes. They see all our actions against them as being the same as those done by Christians a thousand years ago. We are the crusaders to them. I don't know where you got those statistics from, but looking at recent events in France and elsewhere Im not even sure anymore.

We are Crusaders to US as well. Look at any recent poll; support for the President is under 40%, almost 60% of the public feels he was dishonest, and a clear majority think the war in Iraq was a mistake.

If our own people think we're on a Crusade in the Middle East, why wouldn't the rest of the world?

Nah, we're not in the Middle East to make these people Christian. Why do you bring up Bush? I don't care about him or what the public thinks about him. Polls don't stay still. But you guys have gotten some type of routine going.

I don't know if Americans think we're on a Crusade in Iraq. Maybe you and people like you think so, not sure about mainstream America. If we leave Iraq now, people will Zarqawi will be paraded through the streets of every Arab country. Don't turn him into something he is not. Leaving Iraq now is saying the deaths of our soldiers didn't matter.

Anyway, back on topic. The Crusades in the 21st century will take place all over the world. It should be interesting.

:laugh: You can't even make sh1t like this up, it's too good.

You think Zarqawi is some sort of hero in Iraq that will be paraded through the streets? He's a murderer who is responsible for hundreds of dead Iraqi civilians (maybe not tens of thousands like the US though).

Take your own advice and don't pretend Zarqawi is some sort of hero, or that Iraq's general population would choose a cloaked executioner over an elected official.

 

[Aimster]

France is a result of poverty. All the Muslims in France are not rioting. It has nothing to do with religion. Even the President of Germany has said France has problems that it needs to deal with. 40% unemployment in some parts = disaster.

Muslims around the world are not out to kill non-Muslims. If that was the case then the countries that depend on tourism would collapse: Egypt and Turkey for example. No oil revenue at all, but lots of tourist revenue. Both 90%+ Muslim nations.

It is not the job of another Muslim to try to stop people blowing themselves up. Muslim govts. are arresting people non-stop on a daily basis. Go read the news. Almost every Muslim nation has terror arrests. To say it is one's job to stop someone from blowing themselves up is crazy because less than .00005% of the population does such a thing.

There are a handful of Muslim nations with 80% Muslim, 20% christian, etc. If there was a crusade the problems would start there first with the majority out-numbering the minority by big numbers. There are no massive problems.

The actions of the minority are not on our minds of the majority when those actions do not interfere with their every day lives.