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Critique my non-gaming system

JDub02

JDub02

Diamond Member
final update

posting my final build and my thoughts now that it's built for anyone who is looking for the same information.

WD Caviar Black 750 GB $ 79 $ 15 MIR
OCZ Gold 4GB (2x2) DDR3 $ 97 $ 20 MIR
AMD Phenom II X3 720BE $115
Gigabyte GA-MA785GMT-UD2H $ 85
Antec Sonata III case $110
Sony Optiarc DVD-RW $ 34
MS Comfort Curve keyboard $ 14
Acer H213H 21.3" LCD $150
Memory Card reader $ 39
Gigabyte Wireless G PCI $ 17
Arctic Silver 5 $ 7

thoughts:

I wound up choosing the AMD X3 720BE along with an AM3 socket motherboard because of it's initial lower cost and best upgrade path. I figure, in 2 years AMD will be winding up production of AM3 cpu's and that will give me another opportunity to upgrade the PC relatively cheap since I already have fast DDR3 memory and an AM3 motherboard.

I am very pleased with the monitor, especially coming from a 15" laptop. Great picture and resolution for such a low price. The memory card reader was rather expensive, but it doesn't look cheap and had the best reviews. Alot of the cheaper ones people were getting DOA.

What I'd change:
The case is nice, but a bit bigger than I wanted. I'd probably go with the Antec P180 since I wound up with a mATX board. Or I would have refurb'd my Lian Li case with new quiet fans. Although, new fans and a PSU for my old case would have cost just as much or more than buying the new case w/ PSU.

What I will be adding:
Definitely adding a CPU cooler. The stock cooler is decent, but I'd like to run the internal fan a little slower and OC the CPU. I will also be adding another 120mm case fan to the front. This one will be relatively slow and very quiet. That will also let me run the rear fan slower (has a 3 speed switch) for less noise.

Overall impression:
I'm very, very happy with how everything turned out. The wife commented about how much she likes it, so I think it's a win all around.

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original post
My father-in-law called me today asking for computer recommendations. He was looking for an inexpensive laptop for work. I was kicking around the idea of building a desktop for a while now, so I sold him my laptop. It was at that point that I realized that I am now stuck without a computer. Seeing as this came up really quick, I have next to no knowledge about the new hardware. My last build was in 2002. I haven't really kept my finger on the hardware pulse for quite a while. I've been thrown for a loop with the new i5 and i7, along with AMD's Phenom II. I have next to no idea how things stack up.


need: stable, quiet system to run Lightroom, Photoshop, normal computer stuff .. no gaming. I'm looking for something that doesn't sound like a 747 taking off when all of the fans kick in.


1. Used for Lightroom, Photoshop (my wife likes photography), possible light video editing, office apps, internet, e-mail, etc.

2. Budget - $800, but I'm willing to go higher for significant value

3. Buying from the US of A.

4. No brand preference. Whatever best meets my requirements

5. My last build was an Athlon XP 2500+. I doubt anything is reusable. I have a nice Lian Li case, but the fans are little loud for me.

6. I've looked around, but most seem to cover gaming systems or are different than my budget.

7. No overclocking. Just need a nice, stable, quiet system.

9. I plan on purchasing everything in the next couple of days. I have to ship out my laptop by the end of the week.


I really appreciate the help. I'm scouring Newegg now to get a feel for current parts. Is that still the place to buy from?

Thanks.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Update - also posted below

Common Components:

Case: Antec Sonata III - $110
PSU: 500W included with case
Optical: Sony Optiarc - $32
Keyboard: MS Comfort Curve - $13
Hard Drive: WD Caviar Black 750gb - $80 - 15MIR = $65
Monitor: Acer H213H 21.3" full HD - $150
Memory Card Reader: Nippon Labs card reader/USB/eSATA - $20
NIC: Rosewill Wireless G PCI - $15
OS: Windows 7 Home Premium OEM - $100

Subtotal - $521 - 15MIR = $506 (although, I can probably get by without the wireless NIC)

Option 1 - i5
CPU: Intel Core i5 750 - $200 - 15MIR = $185
Motherboard: Foxconn P55A-S LGA 1165 - $105 -- chose this because it was the cheapest
Memory: OCZ Gold 4GB (2x2) DDR3 1600 - $98 - 20MIR = $78
GPU: Gigabyte Radeon 4350 512MB - $35 - 10MIR = $25

Total - $438 - 45MIR = $393 + $506 = $899

Option 2 - C2Q
CPU: Intel C2Q Q8400 2.66 95W - $166
Motherboard: Gigabyte GA-EP45-UD3R - $116 - 15MIR = $101
Memory: Corsair 4GB (2x2) DDR2 1066 - $80 - 15MIR = $65
GPU: Gigabyte Radeon 4350 512MB - $35 - 10MIR = $25

Total - $397 - 40MIR = $357 + $506 = $863

Option 3 - AMD
CPU: AMD Phenom II X4 945 3.0GHz 95W - $160
Motherboard: Gigabyte GA-MA790GPT-UD3H - $115 - 15 MIR = $100
Memory: OCZ Gold 4GB (2x2) DDR3 1600 - $98 - 20MIR = $78
GPU: Radeon HD 3300 128MB HDMI onboard

Total - $373 - 35MIR = $338 + $506 = $844

From what I understand, the AMD should be a bit faster than the C2Q and a bit slower than the i5. Given that it's the cheapest, that's definitely what I'm leaning towards.

I appreciate all comments and critiques.

FYI, I'm upgrading from a Core Duo 1.7 GHz Sony Vaio laptop. My guess is that all 3 options are going to seem really fast. That's the reason I backed the video down from the 4670. I have onboard intel graphics now and I'm not stressing them with Vista.
 
checking the prices in i5/i7, I think those are out. from what I gather, it's pretty much a wash performance-wise between the C2Q and the Phenom II's.

anyone know of any drawbacks to a micro-ATX system? i think the smaller size will dramatically increase the WAF (wife acceptance factor, for those not married). not a necessity if it drives the cost up, though.
 
The only drawback I can think of for a micro ATX system wouldn't relate to you and that's keeping high performance video cards cool, or even fitting them inside of the case. However I'm finding it pretty darn hard to find a PSU that'll work for i7 on a Micro ATX scale, is mATX completely necessary?

 
no, the micro ATX isn't necessary.

i've been using the anandtech guide from the end of july as a starting point.

i'm leaning towards the following:

Case & PSU: Antec Sonata III w/ 500w PSU - $110 from the egg - chose this because of the low noise level stated in reviews.
Optical: Sony Optiarc burner from Anandtech guide - $32
HD's: WD Caviar Black 750gb (1tb were OOS) - $70x2 = $140
OS: Windows7 home premium OEM - $110
Monitor: Acer X233Hbid 23" LCD - from Anandtech guide - $180

I'm at $572 now. Still trying to price out mobo/cpu/memory/video and stay under $1000. the closer to $800, the better. i might cut the monitor back to the 21" to save some $$ and see if I qualify for the educational version of Windows7. Those 2 would knock off around $100 and give me more room for the rest.

 
Is she really heavily into photo editing or is it more of a hobbyist thing? If she's a hobbyist I'd go with 4GB if she's more into it as a professional thing then you might want to think about 8GB. So far the build looks pretty good though.
 
Why don't you just replace the fans in the Lian-Li? You'd save the $$ and put that towards a better PSU. You don't want poorly filtered power to feed your system because it can shorten the lifespan.

You need a nicer screen to look at. Yeah sure it's expensive, but that and the PSU would be my top priorities.

http://accessories.us.dell.com...dhs&cs=19&sku=320-8277

Newegg is the place to buy most things, but SVC, ZipZoomfly, and heatsink factory are just as good at certain things. You have to order your HDDs from ZZF - for shipping safety. SVC has better selection on heatsinks and fans and some great deals sometimes. Heatsink factory has IC Diamond 7 - cheap insurance (thermal paste).
 
Nice monitor. The thing is that's going to put the op massively over budget and make his PC cost run closer to $1100 than the $800 he's looking at spending now so unless he wants to go over budget by that much I kindof doubt its worth it to the op.
 
Originally posted by: nsafreak
Nice monitor. The thing is that's going to put the op massively over budget and make his PC cost run closer to $1100 than the $800 he's looking at spending now so unless he wants to go over budget by that much I kindof doubt its worth it to the op.
Click to expand...

Ya I know, but if he can make it happen it's the one thing we stare at for hours straight besides our eyelids (while we're sleeping). That is for sure a significant value. 🙂
 
Normally, a TN panel is probably "good enough," but since the wife is working with photoshop, it's certainly worth considering a nicer screen.

The Antec Earthwatts 500W PSU in the Sonata case is not really what I would consider to be a cheap PSU. It's not quite top quality either, but should be good enough.

If you can find it in store (if there are any left), this E8400+Gigabyte mobo combo at Fry's seems like a really good deal.
 
Thanks for the input. She's just a hobbyist with photography.

My reasoning for not refurb'ing the Lian Li case is that it wasn't that quiet to begin with. It has 2 intake fans on the bottom front panel shooting air across the hard drives, an exhaust fan in back below the PSU, and an exhaust fan on top in front of the PSU. It's really not that loud, but unless fan technology has really progressed in the last 7 years, it's not what I want.

My case is very similar to this Lian Li PC-60, except mine has a window on the side. It's also bigger than I'd like. I certainly could use it for now, though. Too bad the Sonata doesn't come without a PSU.
 
Oh, and no Fry's on the east coast. 🙁

As for the monitor. I stare at lousy monitors at work all day. The one at home will see less use.
 
Is the Phenom II X3 720 still the best bang for the buck from AMD or has that title moved over to a true quad core?
 
Originally posted by: JDub02
no, the micro ATX isn't necessary.

i've been using the anandtech guide from the end of july as a starting point.

i'm leaning towards the following:

Case & PSU: Antec Sonata III w/ 500w PSU - $110 from the egg - chose this because of the low noise level stated in reviews.
Optical: Sony Optiarc burner from Anandtech guide - $32
HD's: WD Caviar Black 750gb (1tb were OOS) - $70x2 = $140
OS: Windows7 home premium OEM - $110
Monitor: Acer X233Hbid 23" LCD - from Anandtech guide - $180

I'm at $572 now. Still trying to price out mobo/cpu/memory/video and stay under $1000. the closer to $800, the better. i might cut the monitor back to the 21" to save some $$ and see if I qualify for the educational version of Windows7. Those 2 would knock off around $100 and give me more room for the rest.
Click to expand...

The above plus:

Core2Quad 8200 - $150
Gigabyte GA-EP45-UD3P - from Anandtech guide - $135 - $20MIR = $115
mushkin XP 4GB ASCENT (2x2gb) PC2 8500 - picked randomly - $98 - $10MIR = $88
Gigabyte Radeon HD 4670 1gb - $70 - $10MIR = $60

These run me $413. That puts me right around $1000 total.

I can cut the monitor by a few bucks by going to the 21.3" Acer for $160. I can shave $80 off of Windows and get the educational version for $30 (I'm pretty sure it's the full version, not an upgrade).

Anywhere I can cut/change and get almost equal value or spend just a little more and get a lot more value?
 
I asked the MS Student line, and they assured me it was no different a version than anyone at retail was getting, but you can choose Full or Upgrade when you order.

About the case, The Lian Li might be a loud case (I'm not sure), but Noctua fans are very high-tech (almost $20 each, too). They have fins that are designed to spread the air oscillation noise across the frequency spectrum for less percieved noise. If you couple them with some soft mounts, that would get rid of the possible sympathetic vibrations from the aluminum.

Good choices on the RAM and 4670. Nothing else looks bad either.
 
Any recommendations on a PSU? Maybe I'll refurb the Lian Li for now and can always jump over to the Sonata later if I want. I can just carry the PSU over to the new case as well.

Also, for the $265 for CPU/mbo, would AMD offer better performance than the C2Q 8200?
 
If JDub02 isn't gaming on this rig, isn't the HD 4670 overkill? Actually, it would be better to say we can go with something less powerful, but cheaper, and still be ok.

Now, if we do go cheaper with the gfx card, or don't get one at all, we can do:
AMD Phenom II X4 945 3.0GHz - $170
(95W, but there's a 125W version for the same price. 125W version uses more power? Better overclocker?)

For mobo, I just looked up something with integrated video:
GIGABYTE GA-MA785GMT-UD2H - $90

RAM, I went with whatever is fast and cheap:
OCZ Obsidian 2x2GB DDR3-1600 - $94 ($64 AR)

So for the about the same price as the Q8200 and Gigabyte P45 mobo, the Phenom II X4 at 3.0GHz should be noticeably faster.

As for PSUs, I didn't really see anything wrong with the Sonata's Earthwatts PSU, but Corsair PSUs seem popular. I don't expect you to really need more than 400W.
 
Originally posted by: JDub02
Any recommendations on a PSU? Maybe I'll refurb the Lian Li for now and can always jump over to the Sonata later if I want. I can just carry the PSU over to the new case as well.

Also, for the $265 for CPU/mbo, would AMD offer better performance than the C2Q 8200?
Click to expand...

No. AMD's CPU branch needs to be shot and put out of it's misery.

Get this PSU: http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16817703018

Originally posted by: fffblackmage
If JDub02 isn't gaming on this rig, isn't the HD 4670 overkill? Actually, it would be better to say we can go with something less powerful, but cheaper, and still be ok.
Click to expand...

Who the hell would want integrated graphics? Every person I've ever known with that kind of crap has wanted to upgrade and I'm not talking about gamers. For $75, who cares? That's not overkill. Win7 is gonna need it.

Also, AMD is just a very poor choice for CPUs. It's not worth the savings. Terrible advice.
 
Originally posted by: ChaiBabbaChai
You have to order your HDDs from ZZF - for shipping safety.
Click to expand...
Just a note - I agree wholeheartedly. Newegg can be a bit iffy about shipping OEM HDs, and so is frys.com. ZZF is great, they shipped my HD in a nice foam HD caddy, inside a box filled with foam peanuts. I am personally going to order my HDs from ZZF in the future because of that.

(I recently ordered four 1TB WD Green HDs from frys, and they shipped all four together in a padded envelope (with a very thin layer of bubble-wrap on the outside, but with the HDs banging against each other on the inside, inside of a cardboard box filled with air packets, of which half of them were deflated by the time I recieved the box.)

 
Originally posted by: JDub02
Core2Quad 8200 - $150
Gigabyte GA-EP45-UD3P - from Anandtech guide - $135 - $20MIR = $115
mushkin XP 4GB ASCENT (2x2gb) PC2 8500 - picked randomly - $98 - $10MIR = $88
Gigabyte Radeon HD 4670 1gb - $70 - $10MIR = $60
Click to expand...
Those are nice picks. You can overclock the Q8200 to 3.15 Ghz really easy, by upping the FSB to 450, and increasing your VDIMM to 2.0. Actually, since that's PC2-8500, you can just set whatever mfg vdimm spec is. I dare say, at 3.15Ghz, the Intel is faster than the Phenom II at 3.0Ghz, by a bit. So if you have a mind to overclock, get the Intel. Then again, you can probably overclock the AMD too, although I've never done it with a Phenom II yet, so I don't know the usual overclocks. I just know that Intel is still slightly more efficient, clock for clock.


 
i5 750 - $150 @ MC

gigabyte p55-ud2 (micro atx) - $90 - @ ewiz

combo deal - $99 @ newegg
wd 640 caviar + cm690 case

samsung dvdrw - $30 @ MC

g.skill 2x2gb ddr3 1333 - $90 @ newegg

xfx 5850 - $280 @ newegg

ocz 600w psu - $45AR @ zzf

total - $785 + taxes (everything has free shipping except MC))
 
Originally posted by: VirtualLarry
Originally posted by: JDub02
Core2Quad 8200 - $150
Gigabyte GA-EP45-UD3P - from Anandtech guide - $135 - $20MIR = $115
mushkin XP 4GB ASCENT (2x2gb) PC2 8500 - picked randomly - $98 - $10MIR = $88
Gigabyte Radeon HD 4670 1gb - $70 - $10MIR = $60
Click to expand...
Those are nice picks. You can overclock the Q8200 to 3.15 Ghz really easy, by upping the FSB to 450, and increasing your VDIMM to 2.0. Actually, since that's PC2-8500, you can just set whatever mfg vdimm spec is. I dare say, at 3.15Ghz, the Intel is faster than the Phenom II at 3.0Ghz, by a bit. So if you have a mind to overclock, get the Intel. Then again, you can probably overclock the AMD too, although I've never done it with a Phenom II yet, so I don't know the usual overclocks. I just know that Intel is still slightly more efficient, clock for clock.
Click to expand...

does he need ud3p if he's not going to use crossfire?
i'd look for the ud3r for cheaper.
 
Just priced out an HP ... this is going to be hard to beat.

Genuine Windows 7 Home Premium 64-bit
Intel(R) Core(TM) 2 Quad processor Q8300 [2.5GHz, 4MB L2, 1333MHz FSB]
6GB DDR3-1066MHz SDRAM [3 DIMMs]
640GB 7200 rpm SATA 3Gb/s hard drive
Integrated graphics - Intel(R) Graphics Media Accelerator X4500
LightScribe 16X max. DVD+/-R/RW SuperMulti drive
Premium Wireless-N LAN card
HP 2159m 21.5-inch 16:9 Full HD Widescreen Monitor

For under $665 in a small form factor.

For another $70, I can go add a dedicated video card if I need to and I'm still under budget. It's not everything I ever dreamed of but it doesn't sound like a bad machine when I start pricing out all of the components. I guess most of the components I'd buy are of a much higher quality.
 
I built up a system back in March for a little over $300 (already had case, PSU, hard drives, keyboard, display, etc). I picked up an Intel Core-2-Duo 2.8GHz processor, ASUS mobo, 2GB memory, and a mid level ATI video card with 512MB video memory. The stock Intel cooler is very quiet, you can barely hear my system running and I like it that way.

I was upgrading from an old AMD socket 754 that was pretty loud. My new rig is much faster and quieter.

Check out newegg.com.

Edit-I just picked up a 1.5TB Seagate hard drive from Fry's yesterday and loaded Windows XP Pro on it on this system.
 
Originally posted by: ChaiBabbaChai
Originally posted by: fffblackmage
If JDub02 isn't gaming on this rig, isn't the HD 4670 overkill? Actually, it would be better to say we can go with something less powerful, but cheaper, and still be ok.
Click to expand...

Who the hell would want integrated graphics? Every person I've ever known with that kind of crap has wanted to upgrade and I'm not talking about gamers. For $75, who cares? That's not overkill. Win7 is gonna need it.

Also, AMD is just a very poor choice for CPUs. It's not worth the savings. Terrible advice.
Click to expand...

The money for the 4670 could be better spent elsewhere first before considering a better GPU. You could always use integrated first, and if that doesn't work out, you can add a dedicated gpu later on.

Anandtech CPU review article (13 Aug 09)

The 3.0GHz Phenom II X4 beats the Q8200 in majority of benchmarks. How was my advice bad?

Originally posted by: JDub02
For under $665 in a small form factor.

For another $70, I can go add a dedicated video card if I need to and I'm still under budget.
Click to expand...
If you feel so compelled to spend at least $800, you could always get an SSD?
 
Originally posted by: JDub02
Just priced out an HP ... this is going to be hard to beat.

I guess most of the components I'd buy are of a much higher quality.
Click to expand...

I like to throw in the McDonalds analogy in times like these...

You guess? You're damn straight! You can build a much quieter system yourself if you buy nice fans and heatsinks, and a quiet PSU.

Just not having an annoying OEM BIOS is worth the time to build your own. Then theres the parts of unknown origin. You don't know what kind of hard drive or PSU they are going to put in there... or motherboard. Probably cheap RAM, too. Like high CAS Crucial or something. It's bad enough they use 1066MHz DDR3. Try pricing out a turd and it'll probably compete with that HP.
 
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