Question CPU upgrade or no?

Jun 12, 2018
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#1
Long and short of it is my current build has a 6700k @4.7GHz 24/7, 980Ti @1480MHz core.

I’m running a 1440p 144hz 27” MAG27CQ.

I tend to stream games like PUBG and have been wondering about upgrading from the 6700k to a new Ryzen 3xxx this summer.

My question is, would the CPU be a better upgrade or the GPU?

I know specs ect aren’t really known yet on the 3xxx chips but my thought process is to game on the Ryzen and use my 6700k for a streaming PC build, I have a hard time justifying buying a newer CPU just for a “part time” streaming PC and gaming on the older CPU.

Nothing happening until the summer but thoughts are appreciated.
 

Topweasel

Diamond Member
Oct 19, 2000
4,691
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#2
No or sell the intel and do both on one of the mid to upper end Ryzen's.

I am all for adding cores but if you are trying to hit 144hz at 1440p you need a really good video card and we will need to see if Ryzen 3k actually manages to catch or exceed the ST performance of SL. But a really good video card right now is what you need. The one caveat is like I said, sell the Intel setup and swap to a Ryzen 3k if it does as noted above and go a little higher like a 12c version and do both the streaming and gaming on one system at the same time.
 

Markfw

CPU Moderator, VC&G Moderator, Elite Member
Super Moderator
May 16, 2002
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#3
As said above, video card should be upgraded first. Then wait for the summer and see what Ryzen 3xxx brings.
 
Jun 12, 2018
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#4
No or sell the intel and do both on one of the mid to upper end Ryzen's.

I am all for adding cores but if you are trying to hit 144hz at 1440p you need a really good video card and we will need to see if Ryzen 3k actually manages to catch or exceed the ST performance of SL. But a really good video card right now is what you need. The one caveat is like I said, sell the Intel setup and swap to a Ryzen 3k if it does as noted above and go a little higher like a 12c version and do both the streaming and gaming on one system at the same time.
I agree I had thought about that, I can hold 128fps (i’ve capped it there for pubg) up to 145-150fps unlocked while not streaming with my current setup, if streaming I avg 100fps using NVENC encoding so I know a GPU upgrade would definitely help there.

At the same time though, having a, by comparison, much faster GPU would put even more load on the CPU so that’s back to CPU upgrade.

I’m not the type of person to sell hardware to purchase new, so that was the reasoning to use the Intel setup as the streaming PC...

Basically it came down to is the 6700k still viable enough or not.

From Skylake to current really isn’t much improvement however current Ryzen is very close to current Intel, so I feel it would be a sidegrade unless I went to something in the Ryzen 3xxx family...

If I went that route it would be at minimum 12 core R7/R9 likely 16 core if that holds true.

So tl:dr;
I know a GPU upgrade would be a huge benefit.
Would a Performance offload to a seperate system be a less expensive means to a similar goal considering the current setup runs perfectly fine off stream.

GPU prices in Canada are sorta ridiculous so Ideally I’m trying to get another year out of my 980Ti before dropping some cash on a graphics card.
 

Markfw

CPU Moderator, VC&G Moderator, Elite Member
Super Moderator
May 16, 2002
17,232
632
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#5
Go for a 1080TI, prices are good right now (used, about $500 in the US)

The prices for a 2080TI (the only thing better) are out of sight at $1300 and up.
 
Jun 12, 2018
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#6
Yeah I am well aware about which hardware ect, but even a 1080Ti new is $1000, used they still run $700-$800 here.

A 2080Ti runs $1600 for the cheapest model available....

A CPU upgrade will run me about $600-$700 pending prices on CPUs...
 
Apr 27, 2000
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#7
A CPU upgrade will run me about $600-$700 pending prices on CPUs...
Why? How much does a 2700x cost you today? Zen2 likely will have 8c parts priced the same as the 2700x does right now. PUBG is currently optimized for a hexcore processor. You can probably get by with one of the lower-end Zen2 chips if you just overclock the thing, or you can get an 8700k, 9700k, or 9600k from the Intel camp. Either or.

As far a the video card situation goes, it's not pretty, I know, but your card is old enough that you don't have to spring for a 2080Ti to hit 144MHz while streaming since you can already hit 100 with your 980Ti! I would think you could get by with a 2070 or 2080, no problem.
 
Jun 12, 2018
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#8
Why? How much does a 2700x cost you today? Zen2 likely will have 8c parts priced the same as the 2700x does right now. PUBG is currently optimized for a hexcore processor. You can probably get by with one of the lower-end Zen2 chips if you just overclock the thing, or you can get an 8700k, 9700k, or 9600k from the Intel camp. Either or.

As far a the video card situation goes, it's not pretty, I know, but your card is old enough that you don't have to spring for a 2080Ti to hit 144MHz while streaming since you can already hit 100 with your 980Ti! I would think you could get by with a 2070 or 2080, no problem.
As far as graphics go I’m not restricting myself to nvidia, waiting to see what AMD bring to the table, Radeon VII looks to compete with the 2080 so that’s also a consideration...

For CPU’s I’m leaning towards Zen2 over something from Intel currently, if only for the reason that I have recommended Zen/Zen+ to so many people and haven’t actually had a chip in my own build yet.

A 2700x new runs $430 CAD currently, so add another $150 for a motherboard and I’m at $600....
 
Apr 27, 2000
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#9
Ahh you're paying in CAD. Okay, I get it.

I'm not sure that Radeon VII is going to give you what you want. It will be $700 USD at launch. It is definitely not going to be cheap. If you like streaming, you may find NVenc to be indispensable. Personally I do not favor NV's cards, but some of the features are useful. Supplies on Radeon VII may also be tight. We'll have to see how that shakes out.

I think you might be able to squeeze in under $430 CAD for a Zen2 if you get one of the lower-end chips. There probably won't be anything below 6c available at launch, and they may save those chips for later. $200 USD will probably get you at least an entry-level 8c/16t chip. For the price of a 2700x, you will likely get the high-end 8c/16t chip, if not a 12c CPU. For the motherboard though, yes, you should expect to pay at least $150 CAD.
 
Jun 12, 2018
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#10
Ahh you're paying in CAD. Okay, I get it.

I'm not sure that Radeon VII is going to give you what you want. It will be $700 USD at launch. It is definitely not going to be cheap. If you like streaming, you may find NVenc to be indispensable. Personally I do not favor NV's cards, but some of the features are useful. Supplies on Radeon VII may also be tight. We'll have to see how that shakes out.

I think you might be able to squeeze in under $430 CAD for a Zen2 if you get one of the lower-end chips. There probably won't be anything below 6c available at launch, and they may save those chips for later. $200 USD will probably get you at least an entry-level 8c/16t chip. For the price of a 2700x, you will likely get the high-end 8c/16t chip, if not a 12c CPU. For the motherboard though, yes, you should expect to pay at least $150 CAD.
Please don’t take this as offensive, I know the hardware market pretty well for NA, I’ve always been a hardware person, the software side is where I don’t have the experience/knowledge.

As said previously if I were to upgrade it would be a 12 or 16 core sku, for my uses mainstream desktop upper tier is all I buy, TR4 isn’t needed but it’s too much for R5 series, as such I expect to pay those prices.

All that said, the RVII will likely be ~$1000 CAD given past launches/conversions which is still more than a decent CPU upgrade when my graphics card can handle the gaming aspect perfectly fine.

By offloading the encoding to the 6700k in a separate PC my 980Ti should be able to hold the 150ish fps which will hopefully give me the extra year out of my 980Ti.

I would prefer to use x264 over nvenc but at 1440p it’s just too taxing on my 6700k to use x264 even downscaling the output to 1080p, hense using nvenc.
 
Jan 17, 2019
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#11
Please don’t take this as offensive, I know the hardware market pretty well for NA, I’ve always been a hardware person, the software side is where I don’t have the experience/knowledge.

As said previously if I were to upgrade it would be a 12 or 16 core sku, for my uses mainstream desktop upper tier is all I buy, TR4 isn’t needed but it’s too much for R5 series, as such I expect to pay those prices.

All that said, the RVII will likely be ~$1000 CAD given past launches/conversions which is still more than a decent CPU upgrade when my graphics card can handle the gaming aspect perfectly fine.

By offloading the encoding to the 6700k in a separate PC my 980Ti should be able to hold the 150ish fps which will hopefully give me the extra year out of my 980Ti.

I would prefer to use x264 over nvenc but at 1440p it’s just too taxing on my 6700k to use x264 even downscaling the output to 1080p, hense using nvenc.
Why do you need it to be 12 or 16 cores? Honestly the 8700K or 9700K would do what you want. It's the 980 ti that's going to struggle and to get that fps you're running on very low/med settings.
 
Jun 12, 2018
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#12
Why do you need it to be 12 or 16 cores? Honestly the 8700K or 9700K would do what you want. It's the 980 ti that's going to struggle and to get that fps you're running on very low/med settings.
I do more than just stream and game, at time I can have 2/3 VMs running so the core count will help there, some editing/rendering occasionally so the more the better to a point.

Also I’m of the mindset buy bigger than I need and grow into it rather than buy barely what I need and grow out of it quickly.

I run medium and very low, not because I want higher FPS, but because it is easier to play with those settings, at least for me. I don’t necessarily care how good the game looks, I’m not looking at grass/trees, I’m looking for players and movement.

That said, yes the 980Ti is the component where an upgrade would give me more fps at higher quality but that’s not what I’m after just yet.
 

Topweasel

Diamond Member
Oct 19, 2000
4,691
318
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#13
I do more than just stream and game, at time I can have 2/3 VMs running so the core count will help there, some editing/rendering occasionally so the more the better to a point.

Also I’m of the mindset buy bigger than I need and grow into it rather than buy barely what I need and grow out of it quickly.

I run medium and very low, not because I want higher FPS, but because it is easier to play with those settings, at least for me. I don’t necessarily care how good the game looks, I’m not looking at grass/trees, I’m looking for players and movement.

That said, yes the 980Ti is the component where an upgrade would give me more fps at higher quality but that’s not what I’m after just yet.
I'd say hold station till we See Zen 2.

One of two things is going to happen.
It's going to be nearly or as fast as the 9k series from Intel and you will want to hop into that with a 8-12c model depending on how much work you do on the PC.

Or B its going to be slower, how much slower matters but lets say its decently slower (like a 1700x or 2700x). You wouldn't see value in moving over. So the next best move would be to get a R5 1600x, 2600x, or 9400-9600 and make that the streamer box. Or use the money on a video card, maybe the 2070 would be faster than the 980?

In the end I like the idea of getting a way from a 4C CPU. But if you are splitting tasks between machines you don't need much more than 4c on either one.
 
Jun 12, 2018
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#14
I'd say hold station till we See Zen 2.

One of two things is going to happen.
It's going to be nearly or as fast as the 9k series from Intel and you will want to hop into that with a 8-12c model depending on how much work you do on the PC.

Or B its going to be slower, how much slower matters but lets say its decently slower (like a 1700x or 2700x). You wouldn't see value in moving over. So the next best move would be to get a R5 1600x, 2600x, or 9400-9600 and make that the streamer box. Or use the money on a video card, maybe the 2070 would be faster than the 980?

In the end I like the idea of getting a way from a 4C CPU. But if you are splitting tasks between machines you don't need much more than 4c on either one.
Yeah I obviously have to wait and see how it goes when it’s released before making a decision.

As said, I will be upgrading the CPU at some point this year, so buying another CPU specifically for a streaming PC isn’t an option, as when I upgrade the 6700k will fill that spot. Spending even $400 now just to spend $600 in the summer and have a 6700k sitting on the shelf doesn’t make sense to me. Rather just spend the $600 in the summer and have everything in use.
 
Apr 27, 2000
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#15
If you are able to do your encoding on a separate machine then no problem. Though it sounds to me that if you are going to spring for a 16c/32t CPU, that you may not even need a solution like that for long. Unless you load up on a ton of VMs, you will have 6-10 cores available for software encoding; additionally, whatever GPU you buy, there will be hardware encoding options as well.

If it really comes down to "should I upgrade the CPU or GPU first", I guess it depends on what graphics card you will run in your 6700k once you relegate it to encoding/streaming duty. Putting the 980Ti into the encoding machine means you'll need an entirely new dGPU for your 16c Zen2 box. Unless you have a spare card lying around for NVenc?
 
Jun 12, 2018
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#16
If you are able to do your encoding on a separate machine then no problem. Though it sounds to me that if you are going to spring for a 16c/32t CPU, that you may not even need a solution like that for long. Unless you load up on a ton of VMs, you will have 6-10 cores available for software encoding; additionally, whatever GPU you buy, there will be hardware encoding options as well.

If it really comes down to "should I upgrade the CPU or GPU first", I guess it depends on what graphics card you will run in your 6700k once you relegate it to encoding/streaming duty. Putting the 980Ti into the encoding machine means you'll need an entirely new dGPU for your 16c Zen2 box. Unless you have a spare card lying around for NVenc?
When the 6700k is repurposed it will be running the encoding, not going to use NVenc at that point, I have an old 280x or even a 7850 2GB I can use for the little graphics that PC would need.

Graphics card isn't likely going to be bought until Q4 or Q1 next year, hoping to stretch that out for another year as it's such a large investment with the prices the way they are.

It's not that I need a streaming rig right now, more that I plan to do upgrades this year (I have an upgrade plan of approximately 3-4 years) my main PC was last updated in Q3 2015) so it's time and I was trying to decide which which upgrade (GPU/CPU) would come first and while looking at my performance needs the CPU made the most sense to do first. I was asking for opinions on whether Zen2 could be a good replacement for the 6700k at this point. (obviously way too early to know for sure)
 
Apr 27, 2000
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#17
When the 6700k is repurposed it will be running the encoding, not going to use NVenc at that point, I have an old 280x or even a 7850 2GB I can use for the little graphics that PC would need.

Graphics card isn't likely going to be bought until Q4 or Q1 next year, hoping to stretch that out for another year as it's such a large investment with the prices the way they are.

It's not that I need a streaming rig right now, more that I plan to do upgrades this year (I have an upgrade plan of approximately 3-4 years) my main PC was last updated in Q3 2015) so it's time and I was trying to decide which which upgrade (GPU/CPU) would come first and while looking at my performance needs the CPU made the most sense to do first. I was asking for opinions on whether Zen2 could be a good replacement for the 6700k at this point. (obviously way too early to know for sure)
If you get a 16c Zen2, it will be able to run PUBG and handle software encoding better than the 6700k. Just a thought.
 

Topweasel

Diamond Member
Oct 19, 2000
4,691
318
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#18
If you get a 16c Zen2, it will be able to run PUBG and handle software encoding better than the 6700k. Just a thought.
That was kind of my point. Anything else will likely be a side grade in most gaming performance (and 8c+ would give a good buffer for future games) but the only value in getting a new CPU be extra compute. 16, 12, or even 8 Core Ryzen 3 (or 9900k) would also eliminate the need for a dedicated streaming CPU.
 
Jan 17, 2019
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#19
That was kind of my point. Anything else will likely be a side grade in most gaming performance (and 8c+ would give a good buffer for future games) but the only value in getting a new CPU be extra compute. 16, 12, or even 8 Core Ryzen 3 (or 9900k) would also eliminate the need for a dedicated streaming CPU.
Pretty much. OP seems like this purchase isn't really gaming-related in any respect. Even 8c/16t right now is overkill for the vast majority of games.
 
Jun 12, 2018
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#20
If you get a 16c Zen2, it will be able to run PUBG and handle software encoding better than the 6700k. Just a thought.
That was kind of my point. Anything else will likely be a side grade in most gaming performance (and 8c+ would give a good buffer for future games) but the only value in getting a new CPU be extra compute. 16, 12, or even 8 Core Ryzen 3 (or 9900k) would also eliminate the need for a dedicated streaming CPU.
Pretty much. OP seems like this purchase isn't really gaming-related in any respect. Even 8c/16t right now is overkill for the vast majority of games.
Yeah I know with the upgrade the streaming PC would not be needed, but its a job for the 6700k afterwards, Like I say, I'm not one to sell components after/for an upgrade, either I gift it to a family member who could use an upgrade or put it to use.
Currently no family members would benefit from it (just did all their updates last year) so this one is getting put to use.

That's partially why I am looking at 12/16 core skus, gaming/streaming is probably 50% of my use for this machine so having the headroom is preferred.

Thanks for the advice everyone, just going to have wait and see how Zen 2 launches and performs at this point before deciding much more.
 
Jun 12, 2018
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#22
yeah I mean either way it's going to be an upgrade from my current chip but I also don't want to get one just for the sake of it, I'm a firm believer of best option for the price and I don't consider myself a fanboy of any company.
 

ZGR

Golden Member
Oct 26, 2012
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#23
While I do like NVENC, Nvidia does only allow 2 programs to make use of it at once.

I did not know about this limitation until recently, and thought my Shadowplay was borked.

Does AMD's encoder have the same limitation? I have streamed using AMD GPU's and Nvidia GPU's and the quality is indistinguishable.

I am always amazed at how expensive GPU's are in Canada, but I think that makes warranty far more important.

My Canadian friend spent $600 on a 1070 over 2 years ago. It just died. Thankfully he is getting a replacement from warranty.
 
Jun 12, 2018
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#24
While I do like NVENC, Nvidia does only allow 2 programs to make use of it at once.

I did not know about this limitation until recently, and thought my Shadowplay was borked.

Does AMD's encoder have the same limitation? I have streamed using AMD GPU's and Nvidia GPU's and the quality is indistinguishable.

I am always amazed at how expensive GPU's are in Canada, but I think that makes warranty far more important.

My Canadian friend spent $600 on a 1070 over 2 years ago. It just died. Thankfully he is getting a replacement from warranty.
Yeah I paid $999 for my 980Ti reference card (was going under water anyways so cooler didn't matter) 3 weeks after launch, in 2015 so would really love to get it down to a $250/year card..... rather than a $333/year card...

Honestly I don't know if it does or not. don't want this to get off topic though in the CPU forum...
 
Dec 23, 2018
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#25
you should upgrade your graphic card first, as your CPU is quite powerful for both gaming and streaming. i will suggest you to get RTX2060 or RTX 2070
 


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