Could we have done anything about Russia/Crimea? Should we have?

[TheSiege]

Outside of something ridiculous, is there anything we could have done? And if so, should we have? Is it our place to? I read about people criticizing the US government for their lack of involvement but I am not sure what really could have been done. Thoughts? Ideas?

 

[disappoint]

Fix your own house before you go screwing around on someone else's property. World's police, police thyselves.

 

[Greenman]

Troops on the ground would have been the only way to stop it, and the US would have been vilified for war mongering.

 

[MongGrel]

Not Really.

 

[Murloc]

nah, the US would have had to occupy Ukraine BEFORE the russians came in, that means intervening directly in the hours after Yanukhovic fled.
That would have been a direct invasion without an official request from the government. Not acceptable.

Afterwards, it was too late, the russians were already in. Rolling the tanks in at that point would have escalated the conflict ---> ridiculous.

After all is said and done, most crimeans wanted this and most of them are russians, not russian speaking ukrainans, so it doesn't even make sense to make a big fuss about it. Nothing was done for georgia, why should you care now?

 

[JManInPhoenix]

Fix your own house before you go screwing around on someone else's property. World's police, police thyselves.

+1

 

[norseamd]

the coalition government would have had to fortified the crimea and eastern regions with troops right away after gaining power

they did not do that

 

[Brovane]

Outside of something ridiculous, is there anything we could have done? And if so, should we have? Is it our place to? I read about people criticizing the US government for their lack of involvement but I am not sure what really could have been done. Thoughts? Ideas?

Realistically I don't think we could have done anything more. However Obama has a habit it seems like of blustering verbally on foreign affairs when he realistically cannot back up his bluster.

I would have just let the Russians know that intervention in Crimea would have consequences through diploma channels with no chest thumping. After the Russians push into Crimea. I would have announced that all US troops currently stationed in Germany will be re-positioned to bases in Poland. I would also announced that the stationing in Europe of US land based Ballistic Missile Defense is back on the table. Both of these actions would drive Russia crazy. I would just tell Russia publicly that since they cannot be trusted to honor treaties we have to take action for European defense. All of this sends Russia a strong message that their are consequences beyond words for their actions.

 

[JEDIYoda]

actually we could have done quite a bit....
several things come to mind....
We could have immediately put 500,000 troops in the Ukraine and told Putin to shove it!!
We could have nuked the Ukraine........
We could have bombed Crimea into oblivion from the skies......

Those are just 3 of the things we could have done........

 

[AViking]

actually we could have done quite a bit....
several things come to mind....
We could have immediately put 500,000 troops in the Ukraine and told Putin to shove it!!
We could have nuked the Ukraine........
We could have bombed Crimea into oblivion from the skies......

Those are just 3 of the things we could have done........

I don't think this belongs in the Discussion Club. Surely you could have put 2 seconds of thought into this.

To answer the OP the only options we had were economic or military. Military would not have worked. The Ukraine is not part of NATO, they didn't ask for military help, and the Ukrainians would have turned on any foreign intervention.

I doubt the election results are accurate but regardless of that there is still a Russian majority in Crimea. The majority of the people welcome the Russians for the better economic prospects and would not have welcomed a foreign army at all.

Plus, why would we want to start a war over this? Could we be bigger hypocrites? The US burned every bridge possible by doing exactly what Russia is doing. We basically tell the world that it's our way or the highway and we'll do whatever we want. We have the Monroe Doctrine that covers the western hemisphere and in the rest of the world we now have Bush's policy of preemptive strikes. Presidents use military power without the permission of congress and it's pretty much a free for all. We send drones and our military into foreign nations without their permission and we, just like Russia, use our UN security council veto to protect our interests. Russia is making a point that the world does not revolve around the interests of the US.

Economic sanctions on the other hand are a more mature response. However policy makers need to take it seriously. Russian money is flowing into Europe and they are not too keen on cutting it off. A decision really must be made - is money more important than the sovereignty of a nation? Can a nation be broken up in this way? Can the southern US be absorbed by Mexico by a vote?

 

[PingviN]

Could've just turned off the Nordstream pipelines
Stopped all Russian visitors from entering Europe
Put all deals with Russia on ice

We've had a warm winter. Europes LNG reserves are loaded. You don't need military action to harm Russia, they're heavily dependent on their trade with Europe. Shut them out of the market and stop all Russians from visiting Europe (would probably sow a lot of discontent in Russia's upper middle class). Europe could take the hit a losing out of Russian gas and oil, especially if the Germans pulled head from ass and got their nuclear power plants back and running. Right now, Germany is holding back any real sanctions by being ridiculously dependent on Russia for their energy.

 

[JEDIYoda]

I don't think this belongs in the Discussion Club. Surely you could have put 2 seconds of thought into this.

Why?
There is a lot we could have done......the key being could have.....

Yet there was in actuality nothing except using extreme measure to stop Russia.....

The Op asked if there was anything we could have done......yes!! There was quite a bit.....
But there are consequences for everything you do......


The same 2 seconds the OP gave into asking the question..lolol

 

[sm625]

Outside of something ridiculous, is there anything we could have done? And if so, should we have? Is it our place to? I read about people criticizing the US government for their lack of involvement but I am not sure what really could have been done. Thoughts? Ideas?

The best thing we could have done was not fund a coup, and then wallow in ignorance of it. Billions of dollars of your tax money goes to committing unspeakable horrors all around the world. They do the same thing over and over and over. And, as if that isnt bad enough, the sheer ignorance of these money flows is in itself an unspeakable horror. The US was able to get away with this stuff in the past due to its rising status, expanding power influence, etc. But now, for the last 15 years, the US has been in decline, and its sphere of influence is shrinking. It is now, during the decline, that the US is extremely vulnerable to blowback. That is one of the reasons they staged 9/11, to preempt the blowback they knew was going to become a factor after the US passed its power peak. The US is close to reaching that tipping point where the entire world sees us as a nation of stupid sheep led by filth so rotten that they be seen as enemies of all humanity. When that happens, the dollar collapses rapidly and you can kiss all these happy little ignorance laced debates goodbye. In summary, stop staging coups in other countries, and start doing something about the coup that happened in your own.

 

[JManInPhoenix]

Could we have done anything about Russia/Crimea? No


Should we have? No

 

[disappoint]

The best thing we could have done was not fund a coup, and then wallow in ignorance of it. Billions of dollars of your tax money goes to committing unspeakable horrors all around the world. They do the same thing over and over and over. And, as if that isnt bad enough, the sheer ignorance of these money flows is in itself an unspeakable horror. The US was able to get away with this stuff in the past due to its rising status, expanding power influence, etc. But now, for the last 15 years, the US has been in decline, and its sphere of influence is shrinking. It is now, during the decline, that the US is extremely vulnerable to blowback. That is one of the reasons they staged 9/11, to preempt the blowback they knew was going to become a factor after the US passed its power peak. The US is close to reaching that tipping point where the entire world sees us as a nation of stupid sheep led by filth so rotten that they be seen as enemies of all humanity. When that happens, the dollar collapses rapidly and you can kiss all these happy little ignorance laced debates goodbye. In summary, stop staging coups in other countries, and start doing something about the coup that happened in your own.

Is the bolded where your credibility graph approaches -∞?

 

[JEDIYoda]

The best thing we could have done was not fund a coup, and then wallow in ignorance of it. Billions of dollars of your tax money goes to committing unspeakable horrors all around the world. They do the same thing over and over and over. And, as if that isnt bad enough, the sheer ignorance of these money flows is in itself an unspeakable horror. The US was able to get away with this stuff in the past due to its rising status, expanding power influence, etc. But now, for the last 15 years, the US has been in decline, and its sphere of influence is shrinking. It is now, during the decline, that the US is extremely vulnerable to blowback. That is one of the reasons they staged 9/11, to preempt the blowback they knew was going to become a factor after the US passed its power peak. The US is close to reaching that tipping point where the entire world sees us as a nation of stupid sheep led by filth so rotten that they be seen as enemies of all humanity. When that happens, the dollar collapses rapidly and you can kiss all these happy little ignorance laced debates goodbye. In summary, stop staging coups in other countries, and start doing something about the coup that happened in your own.

hahahahahaaa rofl@9/11 nutcase........lololollll

 

[irishScott]

Could we have? Sure. Should we have? Meh.

We could have acted fast, parked the 6th fleet off the Crimea and loaded landing craft, flown in supporting garrisons to Ukrainian bases and government structures in the region so that any forceful ejection would require firing on Americans, secured Crimean infrastructure the way the Russians did, secured the Crimean/Russian border, basically use Russia's pseudo-covert tactics only on behalf of Ukraine.

But we waited too late for that to work, and honestly this is Ukraine's problem at the end of the day. They aren't NATO, they aren't EU, they are of only mild-moderate value as an ally. We want them on our side, but no one's going to dive on a grenade for them.

 

[norseamd]

Could we have? Sure. Should we have? Meh.

We could have acted fast, parked the 6th fleet off the Crimea and loaded landing craft, flown in supporting garrisons to Ukrainian bases and government structures in the region so that any forceful ejection would require firing on Americans, secured Crimean infrastructure the way the Russians did, secured the Crimean/Russian border, basically use Russia's pseudo-covert tactics only on behalf of Ukraine.

But we waited too late for that to work, and honestly this is Ukraine's problem at the end of the day. They aren't NATO, they aren't EU, they are of only mild-moderate value as an ally. We want them on our side, but no one's going to dive on a grenade for them.

what i said

we would have had to fortify the whole peninsula right away before the russians could have done anything

 

[rudder]

The U.S. played right into Putin's hands. The obama administration was working with the ones trying to oust the elected president. As the released phone calls showed... they were developing a strategy on who should be running Ukraine after Yanukovych got ousted.

When this was done, all Putin had to do was claim that he is protecting Russian interests and the ethnic Russians in Crimea.

The Russian intelligence agencies knew exactly what the U.S. was up to.

 

[Gunslinger08]

The whole situation seems like a (mostly) bloodless civil war following a change in leadership. The folks who wanted to be Russian (Crimea) got to be Russian. The folks who didn't want to be Russian got to not be Russian.

Have there been any reports that a majority of Crimea DIDN'T want to be part of Russia? If so, I could see a case for us stepping in. If not, who are we to interject?

 

[Agent11]

We could have told Russia to remove troops and allow UN peacekeepers to oversee any transition pending the vote to secede the Ukraine and join Russia. This would have guaranteed the safety of Ukrainian military personal and perhaps would have made the vote more credible. Of course every available naval asset should have been sent simultaneously to show we meant business.

 

[Albatross]

The Russian doing what they do best:manifesting their inferior complex in brutal fashion and fvcking themselves over in the process.:biggrin:USA should never have treated Russia like some kind of equal partner.Even the Zhongnanhai is more rational than all of Putin thieves put together.

 

[alkemyst]

we could have offered ukrainian's free air transport to crimea to fight that battle.

 

[Number1]

Fix your own house before you go screwing around on someone else's property. World's police, police thyselves.

Thats what we did when we allowed the Taliban to rule Afghanistan. 911 followed.

Thats what we did when Hitler started annexing neighbouring countries under the pretext that the local German population was at risk. WW2 followed.

These days, Russia has annexed Crimea under the pretext that the local Russian population was under threat and has massed 40 thousand troops on the Ukrainian border. It's a done deal.


This won't be undone unless we and the European nations commit to a military intervention. It's not going to happen.

But now what's going to prevent Russia from getting what it wants next?

What if Russia decides to annex one of the NATO country?

It's not looking good.

 

[norseamd]

What if Russia decides to annex one of the NATO country?

not likely in the near future. nato countries have war plans for defending any country that is a nato country. also there are strong treaty terms which mandate the defense of such countries