Costly fuel cools Americans' love for cars

[myjaja]

HOUSTON (Reuters) - High gasoline prices not only slowed fuel demand growth and cut sales of gas-guzzling vehicles in 2005, they also prompted Americans to drive less for the first time in 25 years, a consulting group said in a report Thursday.

The drop in driving was small -- the average American drove 13,657 miles per year in 2005, down from 13,711 miles in 2004 -- but it is more evidence that the market works and prices help control consumption, Boston-based Cambridge Energy Research Associates said.

"Price matters," CERA Chairman Daniel Yergin said.

The group's 2007 edition of "Gasoline and the American People" shows the U.S. romance with automobiles is changing, but not ending, due to tighter environmental rules, expanded fuel options, such as ethanol and biodiesel, and an aging of the population, CERA said in a news release.

The share of U.S. household budgets going to gasoline and oil has been relatively stable for decades, at 3.8 percent in 2006, compared with 3.4 to 3.6 percent in the 1960s, due to low fuel taxes and improved vehicle efficiency, the report said.

Miles driven per motorist was down partly because there are more elderly people driving, and they tend to drive less, the report said. Between 1980 and 2004, drivers under age 21 dropped from 18.8 million to 15.8 million and those over 65 almost doubled, from 15.4 million to nearly 29 million, CERA said.

Average annual miles per vehicle also declined last year, from 11,946 to 11,856. That number for cars is smaller than average miles per motorist because there are more cars than licensed drivers in the United States, 1,148 per thousand, CERA said.

Growth in U.S. demand for gasoline slowed from an average 1.6 percent per year between 1990 and 2004 to 0.3 percent in 2005 and 1 percent in 2006, the report said.

Sales of vehicles with lower gas mileage "have begun to slump, with monthly, seasonally adjusted sales reportedly declining nine of the 12 months ending September 2006," CERA said. "Weakness is most pronounced for the heavier class of SUVs."

The report said sales of minivans and sport utility vehicles peaked at 56 percent of all vehicles sold in 2004, but slipped to less than 55 percent in 2005 and 53 percent so far this year.

story

 

[funboy6942]

So no one will be happy till people use their cars to just go to the store for food and essentials, and back and forth to work. Any other uses for a auto is out of the question and people should just stay home and go no where for recreational, fun, or education and see the country and parks and what it has to offer and teach our children

Thats right you damn Americans shame on you for wanting to go out and take trips to lessen the daily grind and stress brought on from working your ass off and killing yourself in doing it, stay the fvck home and do noting but watch tv and buy ******, but dont go ANYWHERE! Dont take your boat out, thats bad and uses gas and is too much fun and relieves stress, thats bad you need to buy drugs for that instead. Dont take you kids to the parks, zoo, natonal preservations like Mt Rushmore or Grand Canyon, that uses gas and thats bad, go on the internet and show them a picture . No need to expand yours or your families horizon. Dont take a trip out of state to amusement parks or camps and help out the American Economy by doing so and having fun as a family, thats bad your wasting gas in doing so and NEED TO STAY AT HOME and BUY BUY BUY.

WTF, the reason the average miles didnt go down is because the fvcking families are ALREADY not really going anywhere and the auto is being used for getting back and forth to work and the essentials

Not everyone lives where there is public transportation, just because one lives in a big city that has it doesnt mean EVERYONE does and for some it is a huge ass haul to get back and forth to work. Where I live there is NO public transportation and I think one taxi company. Anything major is 40+ miles away for everyone. How does high gas prices help this area alreay cruched and limited on their driving by high gas prices?

People need to understand whats good for one group isnt good for all and works for all, and think about people on the whole instead of looking down a tunnel and themselves and what works for them. Because you have no need for a suv doesnt mean ALL have no need, yes some may not, but there are people who have a legit need/use for it. Because your city has public trans doesnt mean ALL cities/town do and is not feasible for all to have it and would go under if they tried because of the location.

I dont have a need for a lot of stuff but I dont force my beliefs on why I have no need for something or others, thats IMO is un-American. I dont need or want it, you may, its your right to have it and not mine to say you dont. But that thought is going by the way side and it seems if a small group feels its bad for them then they need to push a law or make it really expensive for you to own it. This really needs to change before we lose what this country was founded on.

 

[chambersc]

In other news, the sky is blue.

Tell me something I don't already know, OP.

 

[iamwiz82]

Originally posted by: chambersc
In other news, the sky is blue.

Tell me something I don't already know, OP.

You were born a girl, however your parents had you reassigned.

 

[Lonyo]

Originally posted by: funboy42
Random rant.

Um, what does this have to do with the article? Did I miss something?

 

[imported_goku]

wtf are you rambling about funboy?

 

[Pocatello]

Originally posted by: goku
wtf are you rambling about funboy?

I wonder if people even read the OP before they start their own epic.

 

[JulesMaximus]

Originally posted by: funboy42
So no one will be happy till people use their cars to just go to the store for food and essentials, and back and forth to work. Any other uses for a auto is out of the question and people should just stay home and go no where for recreational, fun, or education and see the country and parks and what it has to offer and teach our children

Thats right you damn Americans shame on you for wanting to go out and take trips to lessen the daily grind and stress brought on from working your ass off and killing yourself in doing it, stay the fvck home and do noting but watch tv and buy ******, but dont go ANYWHERE! Dont take your boat out, thats bad and uses gas and is too much fun and relieves stress, thats bad you need to buy drugs for that instead. Dont take you kids to the parks, zoo, natonal preservations like Mt Everest or Grand Canyon, that uses gas and thats bad, go on the internet and show them a picture . No need to expand yours or your families horizon. Dont take a trip out of state to amusement parks or camps and help out the American Economy by doing so and having fun as a family, thats bad your wasting gas in doing so and NEED TO STAY AT HOME and BUY BUY BUY.

WTF, the reason the average miles didnt go down is because the fvcking families are ALREADY not really going anywhere and the auto is being used for getting back and forth to work and the essentials

Not everyone lives where there is public transportation, just because one lives in a big city that has it doesnt mean EVERYONE does and for some it is a huge ass haul to get back and forth to work. Where I live there is NO public transportation and I think one taxi company. Anything major is 40+ miles away for everyone. How does high gas prices help this area alreay cruched and limited on their driving by high gas prices?

People need to understand whats good for one group isnt good for all and works for all, and think about people on the whole instead of looking down a tunnel and themselves and what works for them. Because you have no need for a suv doesnt mean ALL have no need, yes some may not, but there are people who have a legit need/use for it. Because your city has public trans doesnt mean ALL cities/town do and is not feasible for all to have it and would go under if they tried because of the location.

I dont have a need for a lot of stuff but I dont force my beliefs on why I have no need for something or others, thats IMO is un-American. I dont need or want it, you may, its your right to have it and not mine to say you dont. But that thought is going by the way side and it seems if a small group feels its bad for them then they need to push a law or make it really expensive for you to own it. This really needs to change before we lose what this country was founded on.

Um...the article was just stating current trends. Nice diatribe though...:thumbsup::laugh:

Edit-I don't see that reducing our consumption of fuel is a bad thing. I think it's necessary...anyone who doesn't is kidding themselves.

 

[IGBT]

Originally posted by: funboy42
So no one will be happy till people use their cars to just go to the store for food and essentials, and back and forth to work. Any other uses for a auto is out of the question and people should just stay home and go no where for recreational, fun, or education and see the country and parks and what it has to offer and teach our children

Thats right you damn Americans shame on you for wanting to go out and take trips to lessen the daily grind and stress brought on from working your ass off and killing yourself in doing it, stay the fvck home and do noting but watch tv and buy ******, but dont go ANYWHERE! Dont take your boat out, thats bad and uses gas and is too much fun and relieves stress, thats bad you need to buy drugs for that instead. Dont take you kids to the parks, zoo, natonal preservations like Mt Everest or Grand Canyon, that uses gas and thats bad, go on the internet and show them a picture . No need to expand yours or your families horizon. Dont take a trip out of state to amusement parks or camps and help out the American Economy by doing so and having fun as a family, thats bad your wasting gas in doing so and NEED TO STAY AT HOME and BUY BUY BUY.

WTF, the reason the average miles didnt go down is because the fvcking families are ALREADY not really going anywhere and the auto is being used for getting back and forth to work and the essentials

Not everyone lives where there is public transportation, just because one lives in a big city that has it doesnt mean EVERYONE does and for some it is a huge ass haul to get back and forth to work. Where I live there is NO public transportation and I think one taxi company. Anything major is 40+ miles away for everyone. How does high gas prices help this area alreay cruched and limited on their driving by high gas prices?

People need to understand whats good for one group isnt good for all and works for all, and think about people on the whole instead of looking down a tunnel and themselves and what works for them. Because you have no need for a suv doesnt mean ALL have no need, yes some may not, but there are people who have a legit need/use for it. Because your city has public trans doesnt mean ALL cities/town do and is not feasible for all to have it and would go under if they tried because of the location.

I dont have a need for a lot of stuff but I dont force my beliefs on why I have no need for something or others, thats IMO is un-American. I dont need or want it, you may, its your right to have it and not mine to say you dont. But that thought is going by the way side and it seems if a small group feels its bad for them then they need to push a law or make it really expensive for you to own it. This really needs to change before we lose what this country was founded on.

..that's what the enviro nazi wacko's want. We're all supposed to live in "transit villages" where nobody ownes a vehicle and you'er assigned a concrete cubicle to sit and wait for earth day.

 

[radioouman]

I agree with Funboy.... (!!)

Think about it. If we are driving fewer miles, how are we doing it?
One year isn't long enough for us to move to houses that are closer to work. Sure, some people did it, but that wouldn't have brought down the average.
We can't just stop commuting to work. That's essential.
We can't just stop buying groceries.

We are driving less because we don't want to fork over the cash to go on vacations or recreational activities. Raising gas prices forces some of us to stay at home.
And in our obese country, that is the last thing that we should be doing.

 

[Lonyo]

Originally posted by: radioouman
I agree with Funboy.... (!!)

Think about it. If we are driving fewer miles, how are we doing it?
One year isn't long enough for us to move to houses that are closer to work. Sure, some people did it, but that wouldn't have brought down the average.
We can't just stop commuting to work. That's essential.
We can't just stop buying groceries.

We are driving less because we don't want to fork over the cash to go on vacations or recreational activities. Raising gas prices forces some of us to stay at home.
And in our obese country, that is the last thing that we should be doing.

Umm, driving somewhere doesn't stop you being obese.
If there are less miles driven, maybe it means more miles walked or cycled? Instead of going in the car to the shops, go on foot or by bike.
Instead of a weekend drive, a weekend cycle.
I hardly see how less miles = more fatness, or more staying at home. There's more than one way to get about. See also the thread about the guy who drives 3 blocks to work, when he could walk or cycle.

 

[JulesMaximus]

Originally posted by: radioouman
I agree with Funboy.... (!!)

Think about it. If we are driving fewer miles, how are we doing it?
One year isn't long enough for us to move to houses that are closer to work. Sure, some people did it, but that wouldn't have brought down the average.
We can't just stop commuting to work. That's essential.
We can't just stop buying groceries.

We are driving less because we don't want to fork over the cash to go on vacations or recreational activities. Raising gas prices forces some of us to stay at home.
And in our obese country, that is the last thing that we should be doing.

I've been commuting by bike a couple days a week for about a year now. I drive in the other 3 days. It has saved me a few bucks, I've lost 20lbs and I'm in the best shape I've been in years. I'm fortunate in that I work 10 miles from home though. It's funny, there are days that it takes me the same time to drive 10 miles as it would for me to bike it.

Our cities have poor to horrible options for public transportation and our infrastructure is based around people living far away from our jobs and driving. Not exactly the best planned is it?

And don't tell me that living in the suburbs gives you a better quality of living. I guess if you call sitting in your car for hours each day stuck in traffic a good quality of life then I want no part of it. I've done it...it sucks. The only thing it made me do was adjust my work schedule so I wouldn't have to deal with as much traffic. I was carpooling with a couple co-workers 3 days a week and taking the Coaster (commuter train that runs along the coast in San Diego) and riding my bike in from the train station on Fridays.

These things definitely need to be addressed though. If higher fuel prices are one way of getting people to address it then so be it.

BTW-I don't ride my bike in because I can't afford to drive. I do it because I enjoy it.

 

[JS80]

maybe due to intarweb shopping people drove less? people are moving closer to work due to high traffic? incomes are up so people are taking fly trips instead of car trips? there could be a ton of reasons why that number dropped.

 

[TXHokie]

Wish I can ride my bike to work but around here in Dallas, I'd be roadkill less than a mile from home on my bicycle.

 

[Scarpozzi]

Originally posted by: TXHokie
Wish I can ride my bike to work but around here in Dallas, I'd be roadkill less than a mile from home on my bicycle.

I was riding my bike to work for a few months, but then had a close friend get killed in a bike lane....within a week, another person I know lost their father that way. I realize this probably increases MY chances of not getting hit just knowing of these two incidents, but I'm still not chancing it. Too many idiots out there don't know how to drive.

 

[rh71]

This too, I blame the Internets.

... and the rise in telecommuting allowances by more and more companies.

 

[puffff]

Originally posted by: funboy42
Dont take you kids to the parks, zoo, natonal preservations like Mt Everest or Grand Canyon, that uses gas and thats bad, go on the internet and show them a picture .

i could've sworn mt everest wasnt a destination you could just drive to....

 

[timxpx]

Originally posted by: Pioneer Premier

The drop in driving was small -- the average American drove 13,657 miles per year in 2005, down from 13,711 miles in 2004 -- but it is more evidence that the market works and prices help control consumption, Boston-based Cambridge Energy Research Associates said.

story

yesss i drive about 16,000 more miles a year than the average american!

 

[JulesMaximus]

Originally posted by: puffff

Originally posted by: funboy42
Dont take you kids to the parks, zoo, natonal preservations like Mt Everest or Grand Canyon, that uses gas and thats bad, go on the internet and show them a picture .

i could've sworn mt everest wasnt a destination you could just drive to....

I could have sworn that Mt Everest wasn't even on this continent...:laugh:

 

[funboy6942]

I have no problem with people taking a bike if they can, I couldnt if I wanted to or could for it would be a 40+ mile bike ride just to go to work and a 15+ mile bike ride (each way mind you) to just to go to the grocery store. What I am saying is the American people have a love affair for their cars because it takes them to places. When I was growing up as a kid we were poor but we could afford to go out of state and go camping, St Louis to see the arch and other attrations that were cheap to go see because gas was cheap and nothing like that was offered to us in the area we lived at. Lets see one place I remember living at was a trailer in Camdenton MO, the local drunks, redneck, raciest hilbilies thought it would be great to get drunk, sit on our front lawn in their lawn chairs, and burn a cross on our front lawn with the local cop, AND WE'RE WHITE! Yeah wanna stick around there as often as you could and we didnt have the funds to get up and move right away. Some stuff like that hapens to you in your life wouldnt it be nice to pack up and leave even if its for a day or two?

Not every one, and we were, and now that I have a family, not born middle class, or with a silver spoon, but poor/upper poor. Being able to hop in our cars a drive the hell out of dodge to get away from it all and teach us something as a kid was great. I cant afford to do this with my family really if I wanted to if we cut out alot of other things here at the house were used to. Thats why there is a love here in the US because unlike other places in the world there is so much offered to us that we can drive to but the "nazi's" who are cool with staying home and bike riding to their local parks, or can afford what ever gas goes to are used to that.

They never jumped into their cars and just took a drive to see what our great country has to offer us and our children. There is just so much to see that a not well to do family just cannot go hop on a plane and do, has to be driven, and it used to be gas was cheap enough for one to go do this. And it really sucks that the children of today have no fvcking clue that any of this is out to or ever been to it, or know you can just hop into your car and go see something that isnt anywhere near your home you would never of seen before because for most kids parents are working their asses off and havent got the time to go do this, or just never done it.

So of course there is a love affair for the Americans with cars and driving becuase it lets them escape their surroundings to go get away and show and see something different and educate their child. And untill I have gotten older and gas prices have risen my going out to get away has come to a hault. I would love to take my kids to some of the place I was taken to as a child and some places to now as an adult would love to see and know my family would love to see but now what would of cost $20 to get there and back is going to cost me $300 in gas when I need to use that for food, clothes, and bills.

Because of parents working so much and not making ends meet as they would like they cannot as well and our children are or have grown up not knowing this country and all it has to offer. Because so they dont understand as I do what is being missed, not only for me but for my children. They will grow up not as I did hoping in the car and go drive 1500 miles to go camp at Yogi Bear National Park, AKA Yellow Stone for a weekend or week just to get away from it all. And these places used to count on Americans to love their cars and families and jump on in and its the poor and middle class I hate to say it that usually make this happen, and found the time to go do this. Now with gas so high they cannot, I sure as hell cannot, and Im sure Im not the only one. Not at the price of gas, food while there, and the rise in cost to stay there because less people go now. But that is just one example of what we as Americans are forgetting and losing and because of so many are feeling that a car is not needed and need to curb that for everyone.

Your not curbing sh!t for well off people who still do this but hurting thoes who are less fortunate who used to do this as an out for their children and family to get away. The governemt and people are losing money I feel in the long run by not letting thoes who used to go do these thing because they could afford to drive there, not go and spend what ever money they saved in allowing them to do so. And this hurts thoes who are counting on the poor and middle class to drive and go places like these and counted on their money to survive. It is a shame people are so narrow minded these days not to see the big picture. Its cool for thoes who can sit back and go "let it go to $5 I can still afford it and do what ever" but think about thoes who cannot and are keeping your business open by affording to show up to your shop, your town Whats going to happen to you when they cant afford to leave home any more just to get away any way they can? A lot of other people are going to be forced into the same positions.

Yes I may be rambling but it hurts me when I read that op and they make it out to be a good thing, yeah great for thoes who can afford to move to a different home, buy a different NEW car, what of thoes who cannot? Who dont have public transportation, cant up and move, used to take trips and can not. Their children are left to suffer and not see anything more then whats a few blocks they can ride to on their bikes. Yes it may be great and works for YOU, but not for all. That may be how you live and ie and are used to living, but not for some. They crave, need, and want more.

America and our cars is all we got and was one of the things that made us better then most countries because the poor, middle, ANY class could get up and afford to go somewhere, see the USA and all it has to offer us and there is a lot out there to offer if you just go take a drive. This MPG sh!t is BS. They could make a GEO metro get 50MPG but cant make a hybrid push 35. Hell my V8 Firebird which was built in 1988 gets 30 MPG Highway which is better then most of the cars out there today with 4 cyl and computertized and sensor everything. I got a O2 sensor and throttle injection and I get 30MPG out of a almost 20 year old car with a 305 V8.

Instead of everyone "going curb the use of gas" start pushing the government to force more economical autos. It can be done with gas and electric and everytime it is done it gets trashed. People willbuy and drive them, its proven. We have the technology, Staurn had an electric car and flushed it, they bought a battery company during the time that was making batteries for their cars that would extend the distance of the cars. They bought them out, never stuck one battery in their cars, and with the help of California ECO flushed the whole project down the tubes. I believe the movie was who killed the electric car. If you havent see that movie you should.

Our auto makers could make much better cars, the metro wasnt that technological but pushed 50mpg and no batteries or electric motors. Hell were still getting the same damn mileage today as the cars of the 50's and 60' and our stuff is loaded to the gills with sensors and computers that are to make the run cleaner and be efficiant? How is this possible that were getting 20mpg in a 2006 4cyl when we were getting 20mpg out of a carb'd V8 back in the 50's and 60's? Im using this as an example please dont quote me on the actual MPG, but were not all that far off. Where is the savings in a lexus SUV Hybrid with a V8, A FVCKIN V8 That gets what 19 mpg?!?!?!?! Where the people going "Oh nononono" Whats the fvcking point in even making that a hybrid?

So before we all jump on the its so good to curb gas and every one shoudl stay home or ride a bike band wagon look at the bigger picture here. Why is is so good to curb our driving when its only really hurting thoes whos not well off, the auto makers are not pushing anything out the door that gets great MPG that could save a lot more gas them we could curb it, and yet they are pushing out sh!t like a 19MPH Hybrid for someone who could afford such a car and gas if it was $20 gallon so why bother making it a hybrid? OH because if it wasnt would get 5 MPG and thats wasting too much but its ok because the rich can afford that car and the fuel Whats good for one class should be the same all across the board if we all to start jumping on the gotta cub this and that band wagon.

Rant over. I hope I had opened some eyes with my rant

 

[funboy6942]

Originally posted by: puffff

Originally posted by: funboy42
Dont take you kids to the parks, zoo, natonal preservations like Mt Everest or Grand Canyon, that uses gas and thats bad, go on the internet and show them a picture .

i could've sworn mt everest wasnt a destination you could just drive to....

Sorry my mind was going a mile a minute and was trying to think of Mount Rushmore

But I feel my point was still valid I was trying to make.

Listing of other great places to vissit you cant get to on a bike unless you very close to it.

 

[brandonbull]

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus

Originally posted by: puffff

Originally posted by: funboy42
Dont take you kids to the parks, zoo, natonal preservations like Mt Everest or Grand Canyon, that uses gas and thats bad, go on the internet and show them a picture .

i could've sworn mt everest wasnt a destination you could just drive to....

I could have sworn that Mt Everest wasn't even on this continent...:laugh:

Maybe that's why Americans no longer drive to it.

 

[JulesMaximus]

Originally posted by: funboy42

Originally posted by: puffff

Originally posted by: funboy42
Dont take you kids to the parks, zoo, natonal preservations like Mt Everest or Grand Canyon, that uses gas and thats bad, go on the internet and show them a picture .

i could've sworn mt everest wasnt a destination you could just drive to....

Sorry my mind was going a mile a minute and was trying to think of Mount Rushmore

But I feel my point was still valid I was trying to make.

Listing of other great places to vissit you cant get to on a bike unless you very close to it.

Hey, I own a car and we take vacations. I'd love to take my son to the Grand Canyon or to the mountains and I probably will in the next few years. I just think that more people should take a look at what they're driving and maybe evaluate their needs a little better before buying a car.

For example, I work with a woman who drives about 70+ miles to and from work each day in a Ford Expedition sucking down gas at a rate of 1 gallon every 15 miles. She's married and has no kids...So, she's driving around in 2 tons of metal, plastic and leather in a vehicle designed to carry 7 passengers in comfort by herself 99% of the time. It's entirely within her right to drive that behemoth but it's also in our right, as part of society, to criticize her choice.

I realize that not everyone can afford newer more efficient cars and that some people actually need the space/hauling capability of fullsize trucks and SUVs. I have no problem with those people. But for the rest of us, I think we need to look for alternatives to curb this massive thirst we have as a nation for oil. Buying the latest giant gass guzzling shiny metal box just so you can look over the rest of the shiny metal boxes on the freeway on your way to work isn't going to get us there.

It's like the guy who goes out and buys an RV because he likes to take his family "camping" for one week during the summer each year. Yeah, there's a good use of resources. You know, you can rent those things right buddy? :laugh:

 

[myjaja]

Originally posted by: funboy42
I have no problem with people taking...

:Q I can't believe you typed all that.

 

[Eos]

Originally posted by: IGBT

Originally posted by: funboy42
So no one will be happy till people use their cars to just go to the store for food and essentials, and back and forth to work. Any other uses for a auto is out of the question and people should just stay home and go no where for recreational, fun, or education and see the country and parks and what it has to offer and teach our children

Thats right you damn Americans shame on you for wanting to go out and take trips to lessen the daily grind and stress brought on from working your ass off and killing yourself in doing it, stay the fvck home and do noting but watch tv and buy ******, but dont go ANYWHERE! Dont take your boat out, thats bad and uses gas and is too much fun and relieves stress, thats bad you need to buy drugs for that instead. Dont take you kids to the parks, zoo, natonal preservations like Mt Everest or Grand Canyon, that uses gas and thats bad, go on the internet and show them a picture . No need to expand yours or your families horizon. Dont take a trip out of state to amusement parks or camps and help out the American Economy by doing so and having fun as a family, thats bad your wasting gas in doing so and NEED TO STAY AT HOME and BUY BUY BUY.

WTF, the reason the average miles didnt go down is because the fvcking families are ALREADY not really going anywhere and the auto is being used for getting back and forth to work and the essentials

Not everyone lives where there is public transportation, just because one lives in a big city that has it doesnt mean EVERYONE does and for some it is a huge ass haul to get back and forth to work. Where I live there is NO public transportation and I think one taxi company. Anything major is 40+ miles away for everyone. How does high gas prices help this area alreay cruched and limited on their driving by high gas prices?

People need to understand whats good for one group isnt good for all and works for all, and think about people on the whole instead of looking down a tunnel and themselves and what works for them. Because you have no need for a suv doesnt mean ALL have no need, yes some may not, but there are people who have a legit need/use for it. Because your city has public trans doesnt mean ALL cities/town do and is not feasible for all to have it and would go under if they tried because of the location.

I dont have a need for a lot of stuff but I dont force my beliefs on why I have no need for something or others, thats IMO is un-American. I dont need or want it, you may, its your right to have it and not mine to say you dont. But that thought is going by the way side and it seems if a small group feels its bad for them then they need to push a law or make it really expensive for you to own it. This really needs to change before we lose what this country was founded on.

..that's what the enviro nazi wacko's want. We're all supposed to live in "transit villages" where nobody ownes a vehicle and you'er assigned a concrete cubicle to sit and wait for earth day.

I realize you're being silly (I hope so, anyway), but exactly how would a person would wants that kind of lifestyle be classified a Nazi? If you are being silly, why say such a stupid word?