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Copy-protected CDs quietly slip into stores

bonkers325

Lifer
Mar 9, 2000
13,076
1
0


<< For the last several months, consumers in ordinary record stores around the world have unwittingly been buying CDs that include technology designed to discourage them from making copies on their PCs.

According to Macrovision, the company that has provided the technology to several major music labels, the test has been going on for four to six months. Although it's not disclosing just which titles have been loaded with the technology, at least one has sold close to 100,000 copies, the company said.

The technology, which inserts audible clicks and pops into music files that are copied from a CD onto a PC, highlights what could become a critical part of the major music labels' efforts to stem digital piracy.

Although the labels can do little to stop consumers from &quot;ripping,&quot; or digitally copying, the hundreds of millions of old CDs already on the market, they are looking for ways to protect new releases, which constitute the bulk of their annual sales.

But the tests also take aim at the basic consumer practice of copying CDs to a computer for personal use without ever trading the songs with others. Although this is a familiar--and legally protected--task in the world of cassette tapes, the legality of creating music collections on a personal computer is more cloudy.

If the Macrovision tests prove successful and the technology is widely adopted, the ability to create personal music collections on PCs, or to create mixed CDs from purchased CDs, may significantly diminish. Analysts say this is particularly likely if the labels finally start selling protected downloads online.

&quot;I do see this as the future if labels have gone down the path of secure digital downloads,&quot; said P.J. McNealy, an analyst with GartnerG2. &quot;But I would be surprised that the labels would not communicate this to consumers.&quot;

Clicks and pops
Record companies have toyed with protecting CDs against copying for several years. But the technology is a difficult one, because anything added to a CD risks degrading the sound on an ordinary CD player to the point where audiophiles--or even ordinary consumers--start complaining.

Previous efforts have largely foundered. A BMG Music trial in Germany was scrapped after many consumers said the copy-protected discs would not play on their CD players. An album release by country artist Charley Pride earlier this year misfired when unprotected versions were released in some markets, allowing songs from the CD to seep onto file-swapping networks.

The most high-profile effort, the cross-industry Secure Digital Music Initiative ( SDMI), has all but scrapped its plans to add digital &quot;watermarks&quot; to recorded music, after disagreements between labels, consumer device manufacturers and technology companies derailed the effort.

The Macrovision tests are based on a technology acquired from Israeli company TTR Technologies. Rather than blocking copying altogether, the technology introduces some digital distortion into a file. Macrovision says this is all but inaudible when a CD is played through an ordinary CD player, but when a song is copied into digital format on a PC's hard drive, the distortion shows up as annoying &quot;clicks and pops&quot; in the music.

The company said it and the labels are in large part testing to see if the changes in the audio are audible to consumers. Reports so far have turned up no significantly higher number of CD returns or consumer complaints, a spokeswoman said.

The company would not say which CDs or labels have been involved, citing nondisclosure agreements with the music labels.

&quot;They don't want to influence the listener's potential experience,&quot; said Macrovision spokeswoman Miao Chang.

BMG Entertainment confirmed that it was interested in the technology but stopped short of confirming that any of its CDs in the market include the copy protection.

&quot;BMG is interested in copy-management technology, and we will be conducting tests on some available technology including Macrovision,&quot; a BMG spokesman said.

Other major labels would not immediately comment on the issue.

Can they do that?
The tests highlight the questionable legal status of what is now a widespread practice of making digital copies of CDs, if only for home MP3 collections or to transfer to MP3 players.

The Audio Home Recording Act, a law passed in 1992, says that copyright holders can't sue people who are making personal home copies of music. But lawyers note that the act does not require copyright holders to make this power available to consumers.

&quot;There's no affirmative obligation to make this available,&quot; said Leonard Rubin, a copyright attorney with Gordon &amp; Glickson. &quot;They just can't sue you if you do it.&quot;

Moreover, legal precedents have clouded the issue of whether a PC is actually protected by this law. In the course of a case that gave Diamond Multimedia the right to create and distribute MP3 players, judges ruled that a personal computer was not deemed a &quot;digital recording device.&quot; Although the ruling helped protect the legality of MP3 players, it called into question whether copying a CD to a hard drive is in fact protected by law, even solely for personal use, some lawyers said.

The upshot of this is that consumers may not have much recourse if the ability to rip new CDs begins to go away.

&quot;There might be consumer expectations here,&quot; McNealy said. &quot;But there is no legal right.&quot;
>>


 

rseraji

Member
Jul 4, 2001
178
0
0
This sounds kinda weird... what is the differnce between listening to a cd and ripping it? its all the same to the cd.. isnt it?
 

tommigsr

Platinum Member
May 8, 2001
2,219
0
71
anyone can still record it still...if they knew how...if you rip it, i think it willl be okay...but if you copy it directly then it'll be messed up...no?
 

AccruedExpenditure

Diamond Member
May 12, 2001
6,960
7
81
If anyone tried to burn a copy of Kurupt's The Street iZ a Mutha namely &quot;Can't Make a Hoe a Housewife&quot; you will kno what they mean by cd-protection
 

narzy

Elite Member
Feb 26, 2000
7,006
1
81
id say it wont be to long b4 someone figures out how they did it, and &quot;fixes&quot; it.
 

JohnBlack007

Banned
Jul 12, 2001
110
0
0


<< id say it wont be to long b4 someone figures out how they did it, and &quot;fixes&quot; it. >>



i bet clonecd could make perfect copies of these discs with an update.
 

amb#cog

Platinum Member
Jan 14, 2000
2,290
1
0
If it's just Macrovision, then my Apex DVD can break it, and so can other software. I'm sure Clone would copy this without a problem, as it does an &quot;exact image&quot; copy.

Now what I really think this is for is creating Mp3's from the CD's. They'll have a program written to get around this soon enough, like they always do. They'll keep trying, and people will keep breaking their &quot;protection&quot; it's that simple.

What this will do is weed out the non computer savvy people, and reduce it, but once the Mp3's hit file sharing services. The damage is already done. I don't see em stopping it completely anytime soon, if ever without turning off comsumers with stuff like MS has used in Windows XP.

I say to the recording industry. Good luck stopping copying, cause you're gonna need it. ;)
 

JohnBlack007

Banned
Jul 12, 2001
110
0
0


<< If it's just Macrovision, then my Apex DVD can break it, and so can other software. I'm sure Clone would copy this without a problem, as it does an &quot;exact image&quot; copy.

Now what I really think this is for is creating Mp3's from the CD's. They'll have a program written to get around this soon enough, like they always do. They'll keep trying, and people will keep breaking their &quot;protection&quot; it's that simple.

What this will do is weed out the non computer savvy people, and reduce it, but once the Mp3's hit file sharing services. The damage is already done. I don't see em stopping it completely anytime soon, if ever without turning off comsumers with stuff like MS has used in Windows XP.

I say to the recording industry. Good luck stopping copying, cause you're gonna need it. ;)
>>



exactly

it will keep joe public from making copies of the protected cd's with the adaptec junk that came bundled with their burner. but others will crack the protection and once they send out unprotected mp3's it's all over.
 

ApacheXMD

Platinum Member
Oct 9, 1999
2,765
0
0


<< If it's just Macrovision, then my Apex DVD can break it >>



Macrovision is a company. Your Apex DVD player can bypass one form of Macrovision's anti-recording technology. The tech for CDs now being introduced is obviously not the same tech used in protecting tapes and DVDs.

-patchy
 

amb#cog

Platinum Member
Jan 14, 2000
2,290
1
0
I understand this. :)

That's why I said &quot;if&quot;. ;)

Read my reply, and you'll get my point. If the movie studios can't stop people from copying more expensive movies (a good movie sells more, then a good CD no?). Then the CD companies won't stop it either.

All I'm saying is this, like all the rest, will be cracked, and the songs will get made into Mp3's, and they will make it onto the internet. Then they've just wasted more money trying to stop copying.

This will of course raise the already ridiculous prices of CD's anyway (ever see what a band actually gets froma CD??? Not much ;)), and make people want to copy em even more.

 

glen

Lifer
Apr 28, 2000
15,995
1
81


<< If anyone tried to burn a copy of Kurupt's The Street iZ a Mutha namely &quot;Can't Make a Hoe a Housewife&quot; you will kno what they mean by cd-protection >>


I just DLed 2 different copies off of Audio Galaxy, and they sound fine to me.
 

Avalanche007

Senior member
Jul 12, 2001
342
0
0
This is the dumbest idea I have ever seen. If you want to copy it all you have to do is hook it up to your line-in on the back of your sound card and copy the stuff that comes out. With SoundBlasters software this is a easy task. Yeah... those guys at the recording company are so smart.
 

ThisIsMatt

Banned
Aug 4, 2000
11,820
1
0
You guys don't get it...

No matter how small, it is distortion added to the cds.
So what if CloneCD can copy it, that's not the point and that doesn't help if you want to actually listen to the music on your computer or on a non-standard audio cd player. The problem is when you try to copy the music over DIGITALLY to use it as a wav, mp3, wma, etc etc. The error introduced by the &quot;protection&quot; is &quot;normally&quot; filtered out by an audio cd player, like error correction, but when you're ripping a cd you're taking it bit for bit and encoding it, even taking in those misc. &quot;copy protection&quot; bits and trying to encode them, causing unwanted distortion, pops, clicks, etc.

Even if someone does develop a way around it, there are still those miniature errors that arrise from the &quot;protection&quot;. Just knowing that makes me not want to buy a cd. I don't want to buy a product that is intentionally crippled, defective, etc.

Record through your line in/out? Geez man, go wash your mouth out with soap. That's lame, you'll end up with analog recordings of once digital music, loss of clarity, extra background noise, etc etc.
 

konichiwa

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
15,077
2
0
<< If anyone tried to burn a copy of Kurupt's The Street iZ a Mutha namely &quot;Can't Make a Hoe a Housewife&quot; you will kno what they mean by cd-protection >>

Bwahwahwhwa, am I the only one who found this incredibly funny? :D
 

erikistired

Diamond Member
Sep 27, 2000
9,739
0
0
i keep waiting for the ppl charging us lots of money to buy their portable mp3 players to step up and speak out against it. basically those are the big business companies the record labels will be screwing over (no one in the industry cares about the consumer, we are all just music pirates to them). if this ever does happen i'll be sure to send macrovision a bill to reimburse me for the money i spent on my rio 500 to listen to legit rips of my music while i'm biking.

~erik
 

beer

Lifer
Jun 27, 2000
11,169
1
0


<< This is the dumbest idea I have ever seen. If you want to copy it all you have to do is hook it up to your line-in on the back of your sound card and copy the stuff that comes out. With SoundBlasters software this is a easy task. Yeah... those guys at the recording company are so smart. >>



And I'm sure that quality is just great.

Optical...maybe. Like minidisk, but it is in real-time as opposed to CD ripping which is much faster
 

Bozz

Senior member
Jun 27, 2001
918
0
0
Does anybody have any tech info as to how it's done, we know macrovision for video inserts large bursts of signal on the sandcastle timing pulse after each line is scanned on your telly so the AGC circuits in your VCR get confused...

What exactly is done to the audio CDs?
 

dman

Diamond Member
Nov 2, 1999
9,110
0
76
The copy protection is done by NOT following the standards for CD Recording. Most AudioCD players can ignore the mis-direction and errors added, but, PC CDROMS have problems reading them. So, not only are they protected but you can't listen to them on a PC CDROM. They should *not* have the &quot;CD Digital Audio&quot; stamp on them because they do not follow the standard.

You can also rip, as said above, by piping audio through line-in. Not going to get *that* much distortion, certainly better than a cassette tape would be. I doubt 99% of people would ever know the difference.

This thread @ SlashDot has more info.
 

Hamburgerpimp

Diamond Member
Aug 15, 2000
7,464
1
76
Bwahwahwhwa, am I the only one who found this incredibly funny?

Nope, I'm still ROLFF from his reply!!