Cop shots cyclist in back

[werepossum]

I happen to live with my back fence along street that gets frequent cycling races and marathons (3 cycling events and 2 marathons already since spring) there are times trying to get in/out I start thinking about ... well you know.

Understood and agreed. Luckily I'm far enough out that on the rare occasions that a bike race extends that far out, they are so stretched out that it's not difficult to get in or out. Maybe a little crunchy sometimes, but not difficult.

 

[Greenman]

Sometimes you just have to hold your nose and vote for the least evil. That's why I vote Democrat. In this case, shooting someone in the back and then lying about it is just a little less evil than being a cyclist.

That's the first sensible thing I've ever seen you post.

 

[GarfieldtheCat]

Poor Garfieldthecat, can't find anyone to argue with him. 90% of his posts in the forum in past few months are him trying to pick a fight rather than being anything of value to whatever is being discussed.

Poor londo, 90% of his posts are trolls.

 

[Londo_Jowo]

Poor londo, 90% of his posts are trolls.

LMAO!!! All anyone has to do is search posts by both of us, they will find my claim to be factual/true and yours to be far from factual/true.

 

[GarfieldtheCat]

LMAO!!! All anyone has to do is search posts by both of us, they will find my claim to be factual/true and yours to be far from factual/true.

LOL...hows that theory about making prison horrible for inmates in the belief that it will reduce crime working out? That was another fat-free LondoJowo idea you posted right?

I'd imagine it's like the rest of your posts, totally untrue. But feel free to point out my posts where I deliberately lied. I almost always post links to facts or articles in my posts, unlike you. But go ahead and tell me how I lied, and the cop in this thread didn't shoot a man in the back twice.

Come on, you claim I lie, go ahead and prove me wrong. Show me evidence that the cop didn't lie. Of course that means you will have to refute two forensic experts that both said there was no way that the cop did what he said.

 

[Genx87]

Shoot a suspect in the back and get away with it. Murrica 2015.

 

[Londo_Jowo]

LOL...hows that theory about making prison horrible for inmates in the belief that it will reduce crime working out? That was another fat-free LondoJowo idea you posted right?

I'd imagine it's like the rest of your posts, totally untrue. But feel free to point out my posts where I deliberately lied. I almost always post links to facts or articles in my posts, unlike you. But go ahead and tell me how I lied, and the cop in this thread didn't shoot a man in the back twice.

Come on, you claim I lie, go ahead and prove me wrong. Show me evidence that the cop didn't lie. Of course that means you will have to refute two forensic experts that both said there was no way that the cop did what he said.

There you go stating an untruth again. Please show the the thread and statement where I said US prisons should treat prisoners the same as those in some locales overseas.

 

[TheSlamma]

Shoot a suspect in the back and get away with it. Murrica 2015.

Oh you forgot Cyclist. That is basically the lowest of the low. You are below Transsexual Muslim vegans that didn't like Breaking Bad even.

 

[GarfieldtheCat]

There you go stating an untruth again. Please show the the thread and statement where I said US prisons should treat prisoners the same as those in some locales overseas.

http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=37328017&postcount=103

I know that many countries do not treat their prisoners like they're treated in the states. If a prisoner had to rely on their families and/or friends to provide clothing, bedding, and subsistence above and beyond bed/water rather than what's provided in the states they would do everything possible not to be sent to prison.

Yup, you clearly want prison systems to punish and inflict more suffering on people. And you rightly got called out on it by several people. I pointed out the fallacy of your post here:

http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=37328757&postcount=127

And once again, Londo Jowo shows how clueless he really is. If you want to abuse people for fun, why don't you just come out and say it?

Let's take a look at Norway, shall we?

4,000 people in jail out of 5 million citizens. So a lot lower incarceration rate then the US.

What are their prisons like? The gulag-like experience Londo so fervently wants? Um, no. It's like a dorm.

http://www.businessinsider.com/why-n...essful-2014-12

nice place like that, everyone should not be worried about going to prison right? And the place should be packed. Right? Right?

Oh well, Londo strikes out again and shows his desire to abuse prisoners some more.

You will note that I actually provided real proof that your idea doesn't work, and in fact the exact opposite of what you claimed did work. Nice to facts to prove how much of an idiot you are. So no, I didn't lie.

You will also note that you never refuted my claim, and just went back to ad hom attacks on me as the usual internet troll you are.

 

[dank69]

http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=37328017&postcount=103



Yup, you clearly want prison systems to punish and inflict more suffering on people. And you rightly got called out on it by several people. I pointed out the fallacy of your post here:

http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=37328757&postcount=127


You will note that I actually provided real proof that your idea doesn't work, and in fact the exact opposite of what you claimed did work. Nice to facts to prove how much of an idiot you are. So no, I didn't lie.

You will also note that you never refuted my claim, and just went back to ad hom attacks on me as the usual internet troll you are.

:thumbsup:

Back on topic:
Cyclist = :thumbsdown:

 

[sm625]

Of course the city paid out about $2.6 million for a wrongful death lawsuit just last month, but the cop doesn't have to pay anything, so what does he care?

Not only that, but the city gets even more taxpayer money because they have to keep funding all these lawsuits. And the bankers get more money because they cant get enough from the taxpayers directly so they have to sell bonds. That $2.6 million could easily end up costing taxpayers $5 million by the time all the interest is paid off. So the bankers love it. The lawyers love it. The cops love it. Everybody frickin loves it. It's a true win/win, american style.

 

[Londo_Jowo]

http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=37328017&postcount=103

Yup, you clearly want prison systems to punish and inflict more suffering on people. And you rightly got called out on it by several people. I pointed out the fallacy of your post here:

http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=37328757&postcount=127

You will note that I actually provided real proof that your idea doesn't work, and in fact the exact opposite of what you claimed did work. Nice to facts to prove how much of an idiot you are. So no, I didn't lie.

You will also note that you never refuted my claim, and just went back to ad hom attacks on me as the usual internet troll you are.

Where exactly did I advocate for the US to use this type of punishment?

 

[GarfieldtheCat]

Where exactly did I advocate for the US to use this type of punishment?

Read the quote...you wrote it. Everyone else in that thread all had the same thoughts.

Any more ad hom attacks you got? Or are you done now?

 

[Londo_Jowo]

Read the quote...you wrote it. Everyone else in that thread all had the same thoughts.

Any more ad hom attacks you got? Or are you done now?

I know exactly what I wrote and what I was driving at when doing so. No where did I advocate for the US penal system to use said methods, just that it could have an effect on why other countries do not have high incarceration rates that the US does.

None the less, it doesn't change the fact the majority of your posts are designed to pick a fight, specially with those you perceive to support the police.

 

[realibrad]

Read the quote...you wrote it. Everyone else in that thread all had the same thoughts.

Any more ad hom attacks you got? Or are you done now?

So I just went over the thread, and I did not have the same thoughts.

Just showing why the prison population is far lower in some locations outside the US.

I suspect it's one hell of a deterrent in most of those countries.

That seems more like an observation than advocating. I think you made the assumption that everyone wants less people in prison, because prison is bad, and so if he thinks that will reduce the prison population he must be in favor of it.

He did not take a moral stance and did not advocate for anything. He is saying that part of the reason the US has such high incarceration rates vs a country like Russia is that Russian jails are horrible and people are willing to do almost anything not to go to prison. That does not make it right, but it could help explain the gap in rates. I would bet that if you asked him if he though the US would be better off with lower incarceration rates by mirroring Russian prisons, he would say no, so lets try it.

Londo, do you believe the US on net would be better off by having its prisons mirror Russian prisons?

 

[Londo_Jowo]

Londo, do you believe the US on net would be better off by having its prisons mirror Russian prisons?

Of course not. Many in here have posted concerning the fact the US has more in incarceration than other countries. This is true though it could be partially due to the justice system and partially due to the US not treating their prisoners as badly as other countries do. I personally find the penalties in the US to be a strong enough deterrent to prevent me from committing any crimes. I suspect there are those who live in other countries that feel likewise specially seeing the bad conditions they would face in prison.

All that being said I think the US needs to review the way prisons are utilized and non-violent criminals should be placed in units where they can be in training/work release programs (including home confinement from 8pm to 6am while working in the day) that benefit them and society.

As for violent criminals I think their situation must be reviewed on a case by case basis and those that stand the greatest chance of being rehabilitated are given the ability to receive training/improve their skills within a given trade so they can have a better chance of making a living when they return to society without resorting to crime.

 

[realibrad]

Of course not. Many in here have posted concerning the fact the US has more in incarceration than other countries. This is true though it could be partially due to the justice system and partially due to the US not treating their prisoners as badly as other countries do. I personally find the penalties in the US to be a strong enough deterrent to prevent me from committing any crimes. I suspect there are those who live in other countries that feel likewise specially seeing the bad conditions they would face in prison.

All that being said I think the US needs to review the way prisons are utilized and non-violent criminals should be placed in units where they can be in training/work release programs (including home confinement from 8pm to 6am while working in the day) that benefit them and society.

As for violent criminals I think their situation must be reviewed on a case by case basis and those that stand the greatest chance of being rehabilitated are given the ability to receive training/improve their skills within a given trade so they can have a better chance of making a living when they return to society without resorting to crime.

Amazing how that worked. Also, yes to everything you just said if I am understanding it correctly.

Weird how you want from a horrible person to a reasonable one when someone asked you a direct question instead of pushing their agenda and or narrative.

 

[dank69]

Amazing how that worked. Also, yes to everything you just said if I am understanding it correctly.

Weird how you want from a horrible person to a reasonable one when someone asked you a direct question instead of pushing their agenda and or narrative.

It's not really reasonable to think that the US incarceration rate could be partially due to the US not treating their prisoners as badly as other countries do, given the facts that Garfield gave in the original thread and repeated here in this thread.

 

[Londo_Jowo]

Cherry picking Norway and comparing it to the US is not reasonable. Hell, if we're going to do that let's compare the incarceration rate of drug related offenders in Singapore to the US. Singapore's drug related incarceration is non-existent compared to the US. Oh, that's right Singapore puts drug offenders to death.

 

[realibrad]

It's not really reasonable to think that the US incarceration rate could be partially due to the US not treating their prisoners as badly as other countries do, given the facts that Garfield gave in the original thread and repeated here in this thread.

Ok, so I went through the entire thread, and the only counter he gave was this post.

And once again, Londo Jowo shows how clueless he really is. If you want to abuse people for fun, why don't you just come out and say it?

Let's take a look at Norway, shall we?

4,000 people in jail out of 5 million citizens. So a lot lower incarceration rate then the US.

What are their prisons like? The gulag-like experience Londo so fervently wants? Um, no. It's like a dorm.

http://www.businessinsider.com/why-norways-prison-system-is-so-successful-2014-12

nice place like that, everyone should not be worried about going to prison right? And the place should be packed. Right? Right?

Oh well, Londo strikes out again and shows his desire to abuse prisoners some more.

So at best is correlation with a single data point. Also, this was in the article he linked.

Norway also has a relatively low level of crime compared to the US, according to the Bureau of Diplomatic Security. The majority of crimes reported to police there are theft-related incidents, and violent crime is mostly confined to areas with drug trafficking and gang problems.

Read more: http://www.businessinsider.com/why-norways-prison-system-is-so-successful-2014-12#ixzz3eeZErIc7

So, you have lower crime rates, and lower incarceration rates. This means that you have to adjust for those differences. I did a quick search and could not easily find Norway's crime rates, but I see many articles saying that its much lower than the US. So, if the rate of crime is lower, then its logical to think the incarceration rate would be lower. Its not casual, but its logical.

Fear of punishment is a deterrent. If you did not think so, then you would not believe in any punishment for any crime. Punishment is not 100% effective. You could come up with the most horrible forms of punishment for murder, and you are still going to have murder.

Is it logical to think that the situation in prisons can be a deterrent, yes. People respond to incentives. Not everyone responds in the same way, but in general, it has an effect.

 

[dank69]

Ok, so I went through the entire thread, and the only counter he gave was this post.



So at best is correlation with a single data point. Also, this was in the article he linked.



So, you have lower crime rates, and lower incarceration rates. This means that you have to adjust for those differences. I did a quick search and could not easily find Norway's crime rates, but I see many articles saying that its much lower than the US. So, if the rate of crime is lower, then its logical to think the incarceration rate would be lower. Its not casual, but its logical.

Fear of punishment is a deterrent. If you did not think so, then you would not believe in any punishment for any crime. Punishment is not 100% effective. You could come up with the most horrible forms of punishment for murder, and you are still going to have murder.

Is it logical to think that the situation in prisons can be a deterrent, yes. People respond to incentives. Not everyone responds in the same way, but in general, it has an effect.

He is claiming there is possibly a direct link between prison conditions and crime rate which translates to incarceration rate. You can't correct for the crime rate when it is the link you are claiming might exist. The whole point is that he thinks worse prison conditions will translate into less crime, but here we have the opposite happening. Sure, it might not be quite so simple, but negative correlation is definitely strong evidence that there is no causation.

Besides, everyone knows our incarceration rates are mostly driven by the War on Drugs.

 

[realibrad]

He is claiming there is possibly a direct link between prison conditions and crime rate which translates to incarceration rate. You can't correct for the crime rate when it is the link you are claiming might exist. The whole point is that he thinks worse prison conditions will translate into less crime, but here we have the opposite happening. Sure, it might not be quite so simple, but negative correlation is definitely strong evidence that there is no causation.

Besides, everyone knows our incarceration rates are mostly driven by the War on Drugs.

I do not see where he is taking a stance on crime rate, only on incarceration rate. I quoted his post before, but he simply says that prison conditions could make people fear going to prison more, and thus they would be more willing to avoid prison.

...they would do everything possible not to be sent to prison.

That could mean not doing crime, or it could mean many things. For you to believe he means that requires an assumption. In many other countries, their justice system is far more corrupt and a person could pay their way out of prison. Again, your statement that he is linking crime rate an prison conditions is not supported by his posts in that thread. It might be true, but I see no evidence for it.

Do you honestly think that punishment is not a deterrent though?

 

[dank69]

I do not see where he is taking a stance on crime rate, only on incarceration rate. I quoted his post before, but he simply says that prison conditions could make people fear going to prison more, and thus they would be more willing to avoid prison.



That could mean not doing crime, or it could mean many things. For you to believe he means that requires an assumption. In many other countries, their justice system is far more corrupt and a person could pay their way out of prison. Again, your statement that he is linking crime rate an prison conditions is not supported by his posts in that thread. It might be true, but I see no evidence for it.

Then go ahead and ask him if you don't believe me.

EDIT: Actually, we have these statements:

Of course not. Many in here have posted concerning the fact the US has more in incarceration than other countries. This is true though it could be partially due to the justice system and partially due to the US not treating their prisoners as badly as other countries do. I personally find the penalties in the US to be a strong enough deterrent to prevent me from committing any crimes. I suspect there are those who live in other countries that feel likewise specially seeing the bad conditions they would face in prison.

All that being said I think the US needs to review the way prisons are utilized and non-violent criminals should be placed in units where they can be in training/work release programs (including home confinement from 8pm to 6am while working in the day) that benefit them and society.

As for violent criminals I think their situation must be reviewed on a case by case basis and those that stand the greatest chance of being rehabilitated are given the ability to receive training/improve their skills within a given trade so they can have a better chance of making a living when they return to society without resorting to crime.

Do you honestly think that punishment is not a deterrent though?

Nope, never said that. I will say that I think loss of freedom is the biggest deterrent and all that I think is needed.

 

[Londo_Jowo]

I do not see where he is taking a stance on crime rate, only on incarceration rate. I quoted his post before, but he simply says that prison conditions could make people fear going to prison more, and thus they would be more willing to avoid prison.


That could mean not doing crime, or it could mean many things. For you to believe he means that requires an assumption. In many other countries, their justice system is far more corrupt and a person could pay their way out of prison. Again, your statement that he is linking crime rate an prison conditions is not supported by his posts in that thread. It might be true, but I see no evidence for it.

Bingo!!!! It appears that like many things they run on assumptions and pure emotions, nothing more.

 

[realibrad]

Then go ahead and ask him if you don't believe me.

EDIT: Actually, we have these statements:




Nope, never said that. I will say that I think loss of freedom is the biggest deterrent and all that I think is needed.

You are again making an assumption.

I personally find the penalties in the US to be a strong enough deterrent to prevent me from committing any crimes. I suspect there are those who live in other countries that feel likewise specially seeing the bad conditions they would face in prison.

If you want to argue that any data point is enough to say that he is making a claim about rate, then go ahead, but it would be dumb if you did. The reason I asked you if you thought punishment was a deterrent was to prove this next statement. You believe that prison conditions deter some from from doing things. You clearly said that taking away freedom should be the only thing needed as punishment, but you agree that punishments deter people from doing things. Londo in the previous thread did not claim that it was good or bad, but simply that conditions had an impact on people. You and he agree on this.

He has yet to claim that his view and the view of people that others might have a statistical significance.

Its weird, because you keep putting words in his mouth instead of asking him. He seems pretty rational to me.