Convince me to upgrade from XP to Ubuntu

[Red Squirrel]

I've played with ubuntu and it looks real nice.

There's a few apps I use in Windows that would be hard to run in linux. The main one is Ultima Online as it has no good Linux equivalent. Photoshop is the other, but I could always use Gimp and learn it.

I just tried the new VMware 6.5 and it runs UO no problems (would be laggy before due to graphics). I have not tried VMware under Linux but I assume I wont have problems.

I can't think of any other apps that I really need to use under windows. I do mostly coding and I'm sure I can find a text editor I like, and tools like FTP clients etc... so not worried about stuff like that.

I just don't really have a main reason to go Linux other then the "dumping windows" factor. What are other reasons I should switch? Anti Windows people, I'm sure you can help.

Oh and I'd go to 64-bit. Running XP 32-bit right now.

 

[WaitingForNehalem]

You probably shouldn't switch. I like Linux a lot but I don't see myself dumping Windows for it. I still view it as a hobby OS. It's great for laptops but for serious desktops I wouldn't recommend it. For example, I installed Sim Dock from Add/Remove programs and the package was broken. That install broke my entire OS and I had to reinstall. I like seeing Linux progress and one day it probably will be stable enough for serious use but for now it isn't. Ubuntu updates every 6 months and upgrading to the next version doesn't always go smoothly. Every new release also has many bugs. If you stay with the LTS release, you'll miss out on the new features. Linux requires work and you have to be able to handle its problems.

 

[Brainonska511]

I've been using Ubuntu 8.04 since early September as my everday OS on my laptop and upgraded to 8.10 when it came out. 8.10 is a little flakier than 8.04, and in both cases, the battery life is not as good as with XP. I also have to occasionally boot into XP, as OO doesn't display .doc equations properly and sometimes I want to edit photos in Lightroom.

Over Winter Break, I was going to try out OpenSuse 11.1 instead of Ubuntu. A preliminary look shows that OpenSuse is better with battery-life and I can also try out another distro + KDE 4.0 (though, I could just install Kubuntu, but 8.10 is kind of flaky....).

 

[Gamingphreek]

Originally posted by: WaitingForNehalem
You probably shouldn't switch. I like Linux a lot but I don't see myself dumping Windows for it. I still view it as a hobby OS. It's great for laptops but for serious desktops I wouldn't recommend it. For example, I installed Sim Dock from Add/Remove programs and the package was broken. That install broke my entire OS and I had to reinstall. I like seeing Linux progress and one day it probably will be stable enough for serious use but for now it isn't. Ubuntu updates every 6 months and upgrading to the next version doesn't always go smoothly. Every new release also has many bugs. If you stay with the LTS release, you'll miss out on the new features. Linux requires work and you have to be able to handle its problems.

Sorry but there is no way adding something that basic through add/remove programs broke the entire OS. Every post you post about Linux - leads me to believe more and more that you have (and I don't mean this rudely) any idea how to work with *nix.

I have never had a problem running a sudo apt-get dist-upgrade and it installing. 8.10 is running beautifully without so much as a hiccup. The new 2.27 kernel is much nicer than the old .19 and .21, and .24

It requires work to install certain applications from source, but thanks to a HUGE base of repositories, you don't need to do that too too much. Even then, there are probably some scripts that you can use that will do it all for you any ways.

OP, I would encourage it. By the looks of it, WINE has full support for Ultima Online. If you are worried about Office functionality, OpenOffice 2 (you'll have to add the repositories to the 3rd party list) fixes most of those.

If you have any problems, I am sure any one here would be more than happy to help you resolve them.

-Kevin

 

[chronodekar]

From the tone of your post, I will NOT recommend you to shift entirely to Ubuntu. Don't get me wrong guys, I'm a linux fan myself and would like to see more users on the system.

But I do NOT want to see someone come on-board and later get so irritated with how different it is from windows that they become Linux-haters.

In your case, I STRONGLY recommend that you keep dual-booting XP and Ubuntu for a while. Moving to 64-bit brings you performance, but at a cost.

I can go on all day about this, but I'm stopping here.

I very very strongly recommend that you do NOT migrate just yet. Keep using both OS's for a while. When you get to the point that you feel Windows is just eating up space on your Hard Disk, then, it will time to say good-bye.

 

[Crusty]

Hard drive space is cheap, go with a dual-boot setup. No reason to lock yourself into one OS or the other.

 

[sourceninja]

If they only two apps holding you back are UO and photoshop then I say it's worth a shot. What I would do first is use a product like clonezilla to backup your system before you put linux on it. That way you have a easy way back if you hate it. I would use wine or crossover games to play UO (it should work fine from what I've googled) and you can use virtualbox (free) or vmware (pay) that will work fine for that (for non hard core usage).

As for 64bit, it does have it's gotcha's and I have personally found it too annoying to stay 64bit (java comes to mind), although I hear 8.10 from ubuntu makes that better. I say if you have a nice backup, or dual boot it is good to give it a shot and see how it works. Just keep yourself out of windows for a few weeks and really try it. Also you need to ditch all your 'windows does it like this' ideas and just ask 'how do I do this'.

Finally, it is almost impossible to break linux where a reinstall is required. A reinstall might be easier, but in any case I can think of it is possible to fix linux by hand. You should also never need to reboot unless you are doing a kernel upgrade.

 

[Red Squirrel]

Before/if I migrate I'll acronis my windows install and I wont wipe it completly I'll dual boot but I want to not have to depend on the windows install, then eventually remove it or just leave it but never use it. I have decent experience with linux as far as servers go, just not desktop, so I'm not coming in from scratch either.

I also forgot about video editing but I don't do that very often, I could probably VM it easily. UO on its own work in Wine but not Razor. It's been done but very tricky so I'll just VM that. But every day apps like Office can be replaced. Open office is actually quite nice from what I've seen so far. They just need to add support for docx and stuff and it will be perfect, and I'm sure they're working on that.

 

[sourceninja]

There are some very nice video editing applications for linux. I'd search that up.

Also open office 3 supports docx

 

[Gamingphreek]

Originally posted by: sourceninja
There are some very nice video editing applications for linux. I'd search that up.

Also open office 3 supports docx

2.4 also supports that

I'm running 64 bit and C/C++ and Java are all working better than ever!

You can never go wrong with dual booting. I thought a dual boot was implied when I said go for it. For a person who hasn't used much Linux - Dual Booting is the best thing you can do!

-Kevin

 

[WaitingForNehalem]

Originally posted by: Gamingphreek

Originally posted by: WaitingForNehalem
You probably shouldn't switch. I like Linux a lot but I don't see myself dumping Windows for it. I still view it as a hobby OS. It's great for laptops but for serious desktops I wouldn't recommend it. For example, I installed Sim Dock from Add/Remove programs and the package was broken. That install broke my entire OS and I had to reinstall. I like seeing Linux progress and one day it probably will be stable enough for serious use but for now it isn't. Ubuntu updates every 6 months and upgrading to the next version doesn't always go smoothly. Every new release also has many bugs. If you stay with the LTS release, you'll miss out on the new features. Linux requires work and you have to be able to handle its problems.

Sorry but there is no way adding something that basic through add/remove programs broke the entire OS. Every post you post about Linux - leads me to believe more and more that you have (and I don't mean this rudely) any idea how to work with *nix.

I have never had a problem running a sudo apt-get dist-upgrade and it installing. 8.10 is running beautifully without so much as a hiccup. The new 2.27 kernel is much nicer than the old .19 and .21, and .24

It requires work to install certain applications from source, but thanks to a HUGE base of repositories, you don't need to do that too too much. Even then, there are probably some scripts that you can use that will do it all for you any ways.

OP, I would encourage it. By the looks of it, WINE has full support for Ultima Online. If you are worried about Office functionality, OpenOffice 2 (you'll have to add the repositories to the 3rd party list) fixes most of those.

If you have any problems, I am sure any one here would be more than happy to help you resolve them.

-Kevin

All my posts have been about relaying through postfix. I'm pretty sure you need to know what you're doing to have a mail server running. All of it was setup without a GUI. Wouldn't I need to know how to use linux to use it all through text? I honestly can't believe you think I don't know what I'm doing. Anyways, I tried everything to fix the broken package. Synaptic would fix it and sudo apt-get remove wouldn't do it. Then I googled and found this What to do when apt-get fails. That didn't work either. Here is the conclusion:

By this point, if you still don't have a working package management system, you can safely conclude that your system is unrepairable. A few hours older and more frustrated, you can begin to think about reinstalling the operating system without accusing yourself of wimping out -- either that, or about resigning yourself to the fact that you won't be installing anything new on your system unless it's from a tar file.

 

[Red Squirrel]

I'll give it to you, mail servers are one of the the most complex part of Linux to setup when it comes to servers. I got mine working with virtual domains but still have not figured out local delivery rules yet (ex: making specific users relay through spam assassin, some through custom apps, etc). But that's something I'll work on later on as I'm working on a server control panel. (www.serverweave.com *plug* - nothing there yet)

As for dual booting I'll for sure go that route, though I don't want to have to rely and rebooting my PC to do certain tasks so it will act more as backup. At the start I may swap back and forth until everything is setup 100%.

Also if I VM ubuntu then later on image that VM to my real HDD, will that work? (VM would be on same machine). That's one thing I'm thinking of doing. That way I can slowly transition to it at my own pace. I'd say 80% of the stuff I do will be very easy to transition. (programming, site administration using ssh, RDP, that type of stuff - all doable in Linux)

Package management is probably the biggest issue in Linux. While it's getting better it's not as good as Windows yet. Though I assume most desktop apps will be in the apt-get repositories so that makes it easy.

 

[degibson]

Why switch? Realistically, there's no point in not using Windows because of gripes with MS... presumably you've already bought it, so not using it does nothing. If you want to run a server or write *nix code, thats different, but if you want to run Photoshop and Ultima Online, stay with Windows.

 

[Brainonska511]

Originally posted by: degibson
Why switch? Realistically, there's no point in not using Windows because of gripes with MS... presumably you've already bought it, so not using it does nothing. If you want to run a server or write *nix code, thats different, but if you want to run Photoshop and Ultima Online, stay with Windows.

There are other reasons to switch:

1) greater security
2) learn a new OS (and other programs as well)
3) more customizability

 

[Red Squirrel]

Originally posted by: Brainonska511

Originally posted by: degibson
Why switch? Realistically, there's no point in not using Windows because of gripes with MS... presumably you've already bought it, so not using it does nothing. If you want to run a server or write *nix code, thats different, but if you want to run Photoshop and Ultima Online, stay with Windows.

There are other reasons to switch:

1) greater security
2) learn a new OS (and other programs as well)
3) more customizability

These are mostly the reasons I'd like to switch. that and eventually xp will be obsolete, and no way in hell I'm touching Vista. Windows 7 MAYBE but I doubt it, it's basically vista in disguise. Time for me to move on to greener pastures.

 

[sourceninja]

I think now is a great time to switch. MS is mixing thngs up, this means you are going to have to learn something new to use vista/win7 anyways. So why not learn just a little bit more and stop paying for operating systems.

 

[Fox5]

Originally posted by: RedSquirrel
I've played with ubuntu and it looks real nice.

There's a few apps I use in Windows that would be hard to run in linux. The main one is Ultima Online as it has no good Linux equivalent. Photoshop is the other, but I could always use Gimp and learn it.

I just tried the new VMware 6.5 and it runs UO no problems (would be laggy before due to graphics). I have not tried VMware under Linux but I assume I wont have problems.

I can't think of any other apps that I really need to use under windows. I do mostly coding and I'm sure I can find a text editor I like, and tools like FTP clients etc... so not worried about stuff like that.

I just don't really have a main reason to go Linux other then the "dumping windows" factor. What are other reasons I should switch? Anti Windows people, I'm sure you can help.

Oh and I'd go to 64-bit. Running XP 32-bit right now.

You should try WINE for running UO. There's a good chance it'd work.
You can run photoshop under VMWare. Or use Virtualbox, it's kind of the open source standard for virtualization, though both vmware and parallels have free versions.

BTW, with the release of ubuntu 8.10, 64bit linux doesn't really have any problems over 32 bit. (they took care of them all)

Dual booting is the way to go though, or virtualization. I generally keep virtualized OSes around whether I'm in Windows or Linux...unless you're doing stuff with 3d of don't have much memory, there's no real disadvantage.

 

[OsoVerde]

I've got an Ubuntu/XP dual boot setup going, both 32 bit versions. I've been able to get most games running under WINE or Cdega as long as they aren't cutting-edge. Older games actually work better in emulators than Windoze. Hardly ever reboot to XP, but it's nice to have it there occasionally for bleeding-edge games or if there's a problem. For editing graphics I love GIMP and find it more intuitive than PS, plus it runs much faster and uses fewer system resources. I was using GIMP in Windows long before trying Ubuntu, and I had grown up using PS. GIMP doesn't have some of PS's higher level functionality but for most non-professional users it has more than enough to get the job done.

 

[The Keeper]

Like it has been said several times already, dual-booting is the way to go at least initially.

 

[degibson]

1) greater security

Bah, where are the Microsoft supporters when you need them? Windows actually has great security, if you use it. If you actually use a user account, Windows gets quite secure.

2) learn a new OS (and other programs as well)

For some, this is a reason to switch. For a lot of others, learning this kind of stuff is painful. Bottom line is: if you're nerdy enough to actually want to learn new OS's, then you're nerdy enough to switch to Linux.

3) more customizability

For better or for worse.

<rant>
For me, 1-3 above do not counterbalance Window's huge base of applications that I know and love. I'm actually a Linux person -- I run several linux boxes at home, and I do 90% of my coding on Linux, but I still think Windows is a better environment for personal use. Sure, licensing sucks, sure M$ is evil. I just enjoy the seamlessness of plugging in <insert random archaic USB device here> and watching it work. Its not that it wouldn't work under Linux -- but some things aren't worth recompiling the kernel.
</rant>

 

[Nothinman]

Bah, where are the Microsoft supporters when you need them? Windows actually has great security, if you use it. If you actually use a user account, Windows gets quite secure.

Windows is mostly fine security-wise these days as long as you do it right but whether it's better or not is debatable. While things like NTFS ACLs are more granular the added complexity and horrible UI for managing them makes most people ignore them.

For better or for worse.

A distro like Ubuntu with good defaults makes it better. Most of the time the default settings make sense but if you don't like them you can change them. Of course this varies with each piece of software but in general it seems that MS software is indeed more restrictive.

For me, 1-3 above do not counterbalance Window's huge base of applications that I know and love.

Maybe I've just been a Linux desktop user for too long but I can't think of anything that's Windows-only that I actually love besides a few games.

 

[Red Squirrel]

Thanks for the tips I almost forgot about this thread. Still on the fence (middle of big projects so not good time to do a switch) but I am looking towards switching sooner or later. I'm happy with my XP installation so I'm in no rush to change that. What I will do is repartition my drive then install linux and keep this installation handy just in case. I'll even see if I can virtualize it though it might not like some of the hardware changes.

 

[Skitzer]

I'm a long time user of Linux. I broke free from Windows about 4 years ago and use Linux exclusively now. (I do have an EMac with OS X and a Windows XP machine but they are rarely used and to be honest, the only reason I still have them is because I don't want to just throw them away).
I know where you are coming from in a way ....... I hemmed and hawed for moths over weather to just switch and needed a lot of prodding. And to be honest when I first installed Linux (I believe it was Mandrake), I had a hard time learning it to a point where I felt comfortable and uninstalled it and went back to Windows numerous times. All I can tell you is that you will decide ultimately and only you will know when it's time to make the switch. I can say that I'm glad I did and couldn't ever go back to Windows. I've actually not seen a running copy of Vista yet and could care less. My current distro of choice is Mint (has been for over a year now.

 

[dawp]

ya might check out winehq.org. you might find supported windows software that will run under wine

UO

 

[MaxDepth]

If you are trying to do anything like HTPC, no, I do not recommend Linux at this time.

Too many unsupported hardware components.