Controversial Confederate Flag Moved in S. Carolina

[Shuxclams]

Lets keep in mind that the flag was flown over the capitol in response to a court order that kept them from stopping Martin Luther King and his marches from coming to south carolina, it was the only way to show thier "rebelioness" to the blacks and the marchers with whom they did not agree, so the whole story of "our history" and our "heritage" is bullsh!t unless thier heritage is one of intolerance and hatred.



SHUX

 

[apoppin]

Well, the history of the South is one of racial intolerance and hatrid. And now its descendents attempt to justify their wrong by skewing history.

 

[Daedalus]

<<Well, the history of the South is one of racial intolerance and hatrid.>>

No way, You're dumping it all on the Southerners. How unfair!


<<skewing history>>

What I said was not skewed. It was simply true. You want to portray it as a viewpoint. Seems to me your load is ready for the dryer.

 

[drboogie]

As a Southerner Nationalist, I am disheartened that the flag came down. Also, as a Southern nationalist, I am not a racist. My family's roots are deep in the South. Many of my forefathers fought and died for what they thought was right - and that right was not slavery.

When you read histories, always keep in mind that to the victors go the spoils. The Yankee government rewrote a lot of the 'official' history of the War for Southern Independence during the repressive reconstruction era in order to make what they did to the South look right in the eyes of other nations.

 

[Daedalus]

Shux, I was a kid in Chicago when MLK wanted to march in Marquette Park. People in Chitown were not very nice about it then either.
In 6th grade when he was assasinated I remember a classmate with a sick look on her face saying to me, &quot;Isn't it great that N* was killed?&quot; When I said no I think it's terrible, she tried to get one her pals against me by telling them what I said only to have her friend agree with me. Seems to me we just want to dump our garbage and blame the other guy and tell ourselves how great we are. Crap!

 

[Ulfwald]

Shux,

True, many STARS and BARS flags are flown in a protest to the civil rights movement at state capitols throughout the south. and that is wrong, but to keep one at a civil war memorial is not wrong. It does help us to keep history alive, which we should learn from, because if we don't, we are doomed to repeat it. The flag now SHOULD symbolize how wrong slavery is, and was, and help us to remember that. It should also serve as a reminder as to what can happen when non diplomatic situations occur. Our nation was almost torn apart due to this insane war.

Let's also remember Lincoln's promise of 5 acres and a mule, which never happened. Many newly freed slaves suffered after the war due to the fact that the fed. govt. never had a true plan in place to help former slaves. This resulted in No housing, no jobs, no way to earn money, no med care, and so on. So many went back to work for free for their former owners just so they could survive. By no means do I condone slavery, it is never right for one to own another person. It is just that many knew no other way of life, and the government made no plans to help them. Read the history books, but not just one side, research more, dig deep, and you will see that there is more than just one side to the story.


We must keep history alive, no matter how painful or embarrassing, otherwise we are doomed to repeat it if we do not learn from it.

 

[apoppin]

Daedalus, what other way is there to look at the history of the South. Facts are facts. I am not dumping anything on the Southerners - are you feeling guilty?

I did not specifically say YOU were skewing history. I said I disagreed with your viewpoint. Do you deny some Southerners deliberately skew history to put themselves in a good light?

The history of the South IS one of racial intolerance and hatred. I stand by this statement. Where did 1/3 of the white population own black slaves? Who else in the United States refused to give up slavery until a war forced them to? Who maintained segregation and discrimination against blacks (while the rest of the United States did not)? Did you forget your recent history when the Govenor of Alabama defied a Federal Order to allow blacks into a white school? Or the beatings and killing of blacks by the KKK while the local and state governments stood by doing nothing? It took years of the Federal Government working to force changes in the South

Please tell me how we are supposed to look at it? Are we supposed to minimize the horrible wrongs committed against blacks in the South? Should we forget the lessons of history just because you don't like the way it was?

 

[apoppin]

ufwald, no it is not wrong to remember the Confederate Flag. It should be in museums where it belongs, not flying over a State Capitol building.

The U.S. Civil War was horrible. And what the Union did to the South afterward was very wrong. They punnished the South instead of healing. Remember,Lincoln was assasinated 4 days after the war ended - he never got his chance to fulfil his promise. Extremists took over the Union and all in the South suffered - for many years afterward.

However, that still does not excuse the horrible treatment blacks received at the hands of whites in the South. The original topic was the removal of the Confederate flag over the S. Carolina Capitol building - yes, its a long overdue step in the right direction.

EDIT: What do you think of the Confederate flag waving supporters chanting &quot;White Power&quot; as mentioned in the news article?

 

[Zucchini]

To me its just a symbol of reliousness for the south. They lost the war, the flag should go away. If they want to stop being looked down upon as hicks, they had better do it soon. Pride my a$$, ppl die on both sides of any war.

 

[drboogie]

Zucchini - I'm not a hick, and I don't see the Confederate Battle Flag as having anything to do with being a hick ... I guess it's your own bigotry showing through there.

 

[-SpYrL-]

I am from SC. I believe the flag should have stayed where it is at. The NAACP is still boycotting after it is removed because it was placed at a civil war monument. They say it is to visible. They are now trying to step up there boycott. I think it should be returned if they are going to continue boycotting. They got what they wanted, the flag removed from the top of the Statehouse. They will continue finding something to argue about.

-SpYrL-

 

[Ulfwald]

White Power chanters are just as bad as those chanting Black Power. They are the ones that help to keep racism alive. They should all crawl back under the rocks they came out from under.

I agree that the Confederat battle flag should be removed from the state capitols that raised it in protest against the cival rights movement, but there are states that flew it long before the civil war. (can't remember which ones right now.) the SC flag has been removed, and placed over a Confederate Memorial, which is where it belongs. There it serves as a reminder of history, not as a reminder to racial hate and intolerance.

Again I say people demonize items, they are not demons themselves.

 

[Daedalus]

<<Please tell me how we are supposed to look at it?>>

apoppin, I suggest you look in your own backyard. That is the only way. I used to think like you before I lived in the South for 3 years. I am not a Southerner but would be proud to be one.

<<I am not dumping anything on the Southerners - are you feeling guilty?>>

We all (Black/White/Northern/Southern) share in this so I am unsure how to answer it. Ronnie Van Zant came to mind: &quot;Now Watergate does not bother me, does your conscience bother you, tell me true.&quot;
That is trite, but I don't feel guilty. And I know I was wrong for dumping racism on a region of people after having lived in that region.

 

[apoppin]

Agreed ulfwald.

Daedalus, what will I find in my backyard? We were talking about the South. If you want to look at the bigger picture then the Whites are guilty of atrocities to the blacks and to the red original inhabitants, of persecuting minorities for religious, cultural and racial differences. Actually, the human race is guilty of horrible things to each other. But that still does not excuse consistant racial intolerance as practiced in the South to this day.

 

[Daedalus]

I too would not want to excuse it. I however, do not want to package it and label it with the Confederate Flag.

 

[Ulfwald]

Daedalus
Quit demonizing a flag. What you are doing is the same thing as some of the hate groups. Hate is in the heart and in the mind, not in a lifeless object.

 

[Daedalus]

ulfwald, I agree.