Conservatives: Do you feel like you're losing the war?

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Atreus21

Lifer
Aug 21, 2007
12,001
571
126
There is no left in this country? Are you guys insane?

We had college kids complaining about having to pay back student loans and getting widespread media coverage. That sounds like the left to me.

Saying that proof of there being no left lies in the absence of Marshall Stalin in our midst isn't exactly convincing.

What exactly would you guys consider left? Widespread repression and the killing of 40 million people in the second Great Leap Forward?

If there isn't a true left in this country we can 1) realize there's a damned good reason for it, and 2) thank God for it.
 

Steeplerot

Lifer
Mar 29, 2004
13,051
6
81
Saying that proof of there being no left lies in the absence of Marshall Stalin in our midst isn't exactly convincing.

These kinds of comments just go to show how dumbed down so-called American "conservatives" have become after letting talk radio shit into your brains for so long. This is on a political level as pathetic as the interviews on the street with Americans being asked about basic geography and foolishly pointing to Australia on a map and identifying it as north Korea. Clueless.

What a sad state of misinformation and intellectual laziness we have in the USA for such ignorance to run amok in public about simple politics. Hopefully you are not an American.
 
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Atreus21

Lifer
Aug 21, 2007
12,001
571
126
These kinds of comments just go to show how dumbed down so-called American "conservatives" have become after letting talk radio shit into your brains for so long. This is on a political level as pathetic as the interviews on the street with Americans being asked about basic geography and foolishly pointing to Australia on a map and identifying it as north Korea. Clueless.

What a sad state of education we have in the USA for such ignorance to run amok about simple politics.

Steeplerot, I'm all out of shit to give.
 

Steeplerot

Lifer
Mar 29, 2004
13,051
6
81
Steeplerot, I'm all out of shit to give.

All full up huh? A simple solution would be to pull the stick from you guys ass. (Just make sure to point that thing in a safe direction, such comments show you may be at the point of bullshit ignorant spontaneous combustion already.)

Countless thousands of American liberals fought and died against totalitarian communism throughout the cold war. You spit on their graves by associating American left with Stalinists. You should be ashamed to call yourself an American to let yourself be led by such lies about your fellow countrymen so easily. Weak.
 
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dank69

Lifer
Oct 6, 2009
36,045
30,334
136
There is no left in this country? Are you guys insane?

We had college kids complaining about having to pay back student loans and getting widespread media coverage. That sounds like the left to me.

Saying that proof of there being no left lies in the absence of Marshall Stalin in our midst isn't exactly convincing.

What exactly would you guys consider left? Widespread repression and the killing of 40 million people in the second Great Leap Forward?

If there isn't a true left in this country we can 1) realize there's a damned good reason for it, and 2) thank God for it.
Nobody said there is no left in this country. They said there is no left in our congress except for one. Once you understand the discussion, you can begin to formulate an applicable rebuttal.

As for you being full of shit, yours is as follows. You are against all abortion. Fine, your prerogative. However, whenever you start to argue your position, you usually default to resting your case on late term abortions as justification for making all abortion illegal, which is a very weak case even if you don't see it.
 

JTsyo

Lifer
Nov 18, 2007
11,809
944
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I think it's a given things change (ie The only constant is change). I don't think all conservatives think they can freeze us in time. What they try to do is limit the amount of change. I think it's good to change at a speed acceptable to society as a whole. It usually takes time for an idea to become acceptable and gain enough support. Sometimes things can go too far too quick and we end up with something like Prohibition. Not many social change I can think of that was reversed.
 

Ausm

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
25,213
14
81
There is no left in this country? Are you guys insane?

We had college kids complaining about having to pay back student loans and getting widespread media coverage. That sounds like the left to me.

Saying that proof of there being no left lies in the absence of Marshall Stalin in our midst isn't exactly convincing.

What exactly would you guys consider left? Widespread repression and the killing of 40 million people in the second Great Leap Forward?

If there isn't a true left in this country we can 1) realize there's a damned good reason for it, and 2) thank God for it.

Stereotype much?This lefty never welched on any bills or debts I have ever had. You make it sound like all Liberals are free loaders or want something for nothing. :rolleyes:
 

shortylickens

No Lifer
Jul 15, 2003
80,287
17,078
136
These kinds of comments just go to show how dumbed down so-called American "conservatives" have become after letting talk radio shit into your brains for so long. This is on a political level as pathetic as the interviews on the street with Americans being asked about basic geography and foolishly pointing to Australia on a map and identifying it as north Korea. Clueless.

What a sad state of misinformation and intellectual laziness we have in the USA for such ignorance to run amok in public about simple politics. Hopefully you are not an American.

Ummm, the schools were taken over by liberals so.......
 

Steeplerot

Lifer
Mar 29, 2004
13,051
6
81
Ummm, the schools were taken over by liberals so.......

No, the problem is the right hates intellectuals, if you have someone around who knows what they are talking about the right wing fantasy world becomes threatened.

By regurgitating this old conspiracy theory you just point out the old saying about how reality is a liberal construct that scares the shit out of the rights propped up fantasy. It is quite obvious why you all demonize anyone who has a clue. You all are simply reactionary morons who believe anything that fits your small minded worldview that must be constantly reinforced by bullshit.

Some folks are entitled fools who settle for life/complicated issues handed to them on a platter.This is why right wing media attracts so many mental midgets and those who fail at basic reasoning/critical thought skills.
 
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Ninjahedge

Diamond Member
Mar 2, 2005
4,149
1
91
It is many faceted.

"Liberal", ironically, means more willing to accept different ideas. They can be traditionalist in their leanings, wishing to roll back some of teh policies we now have, or they can be complete Stalinists, wanting more of a communistic government policy. the main reason Liberals cannot agree on anything is because they are NOT a cohesive group. They are a group that pretty much accepts things on a more individual basis.

This also makes them ripe for criticism, for what one liberal may find reasonable, another might not. TRUE liberals, even if they are not supporting a different point of view, are willing to review it on its own merits. "Liberals", meaning people who CALL themselves that, but are really just close minded individuals wanting to shift things to their particular POV, do not.

Now Conservatives are a rare breed. TRUE conservatives do NOT want to roll things back. they want things to be left the hell alone. Aside from some active campaigns, like, say, war, which are usually "temporary" things, they do not want ANY new policy.

Things are fine the way they are, leave them be. they are the damper on societal change that resist more the quicker things try to be changed. They, like liberals, are needed in a working societal system. The problem is, most people CALLING themselves "conservative" are NOT. They are retroactivists. They want to roll things back to times they remember as being better, partially due to mankind's way of forgetting the bad (a good mental survival technique).

What we have on the "right" has shifted to religious activists that want to push things towards "traditional" values which are not really 100% traditional. They are religiously based. Birth control being a prime example. the whole thing about marriage, only one person, no hanky panky w/o kiddos is something that was put in gear a LONG time ago to insure stable family growth and a plethora of progeny that was more likely to continue the cause. Doubt me? Come on over into Brooklyn and look at some of the Hasaedic (sp) communities here, where you see a woman that can't be out of her 20's carting around 506 kids all about a year apart.

Why? Simple. Kids will keep their religion when they are taught it growing up more than anything. This is not a case of divine approval, this is simple religious exposure/influence.

i guess what I am getting at here is that our definitions of Conservative and Liberal do not fit what they actually are in this day and age. What we have now are labels to make a false two-party front that only gets us people in office that really do not represent what we want them to.
 

Gunslinger08

Lifer
Nov 18, 2001
13,234
2
81
I'm a fiscal conservative, and I say yes, the war is lost. Our federal and state spending has greatly outpaced revenues and I don't see anybody actually fixing it anytime soon. Nobody is going to raise taxes 30+% or cut spending by a matching amount. A compromise is the best option, but both sides of the aisle seem pretty rabid about maintaining current levels - with Republicans probably being more rabid about keeping current tax rates vs. Democrats keeping current spending.

I don't really think that responsible fiscal policy should be an us vs. them thing though. It just needs to happen or we're going to have some pretty big issues by the time I'm a retiree.

I don't particularly care about social conservative issues, but I'd say those are probably lost as well. The country has definitely shifted in the past 30-40 years and I don't see it going back. Social conservative policies are mostly footed in religious beliefs (gay marriage, contraception, abortion) and it feels like the country is getting more "anti-religion" as time goes on. However, with the expected Hispanic population growth (which is predominantly Roman Catholic), things could change quite a bit. Who knows, we might see candidates who are social conservatives, fiscal progressives, and pro open borders.
 

shadow9d9

Diamond Member
Jul 6, 2004
8,132
2
0
Stalin was a dictator, which is right wing. There was nothing communist there... it was in name only. They did have socialism though, full scale.. but without proper infrastructure.

Communism never has and never will exist, outside of maybe a community in the middle of nowhere with less than 20 people.

Communism is a boogie man created to mark the "left."

Please list a few pieces of "left" legislation in the last 20 years...
 

zinfamous

No Lifer
Jul 12, 2006
111,095
30,041
146
Gay rights is a non event, we all know and agree with where it is heading in 20 years.

The structure of our government and its centralization / abuse of power / destruction of the Bill of Rights is far more crucial. We're turning into North Korea and not enough people care because the Fox is guarding the Hen House.

Do you honestly believe this?
 

zinfamous

No Lifer
Jul 12, 2006
111,095
30,041
146
No sarcasm, it's obvious you both believe it. I don't, but it's not something i can argue against.

well, when you put it into perspective, there truly is no left in the USA< and it has been that way for quite a long time. Before Clinton, basically.


--and you have to put it into perspective, since the far right often wants to make comparisons to N Korea or Soviet Russia or what have you, you therefore can not define a left/right division without taking in a larger frame.

Within the US, simply--you can try all you want to classify left and right--it will be there, because there are real differences. However, these differences are not traditional "left" or "right"

There is no true leftwing in the US, as when you look at the world models that right so often wants to demonize and compare to, all you see are classical left--all of this so, so far from the liberal mindset of the US. it is nothing like the Democratic party.

We have right of moderate and far right.

that is it. You can believe otherwise, all you want--perhaps because you haven't spent an ounce of time thinking about world politics or the cursory comparisons that your hilarious news sources like to cram into your mouth, but it will never be the case.

There is no left party in the USA. There hasn't been for several decades.
 

monovillage

Diamond Member
Jul 3, 2008
8,444
1
0
You mean there hasn't been a left in the U.S. since before Clinton's presidency? I agree, not since the Soviets collapsed and they lost their biggest supporter back in '89.
 

RedString

Senior member
Feb 24, 2011
299
0
0
Conservatives losing on this one...
Interracial marriage in US hits new high

Implying your opponent is racist, ftw. Bring on the Nazi comparisons next?

Stereotype much?This lefty never welched on any bills or debts I have ever had. You make it sound like all Liberals are free loaders or want something for nothing. :rolleyes:

^, both sides stereotype consistently in every single left vs right debate I've ever witnessed.
ie: Steeplerot vs Atreus
 
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kage69

Lifer
Jul 17, 2003
28,604
39,931
136
Implying your opponent is racist, ftw. Bring on the Nazi comparisons next?



Well you're implying you have a feeble grasp on history, because it was the conservative side that was pro segregation and anti-interracial marriage. They fought legislation that aimed to change those issues to something more in line with American values and liberty. It's a relevant observation given that social conservatives to this day actively seek to restrict the rights of gays, considering them to be wayward, confused or broken human beings.



Nazi comparisons? Sorry, that's so 2003, these days it's all about 'socialism' and displaying abject ignorance over what it means.