Connecting a switch without a router?

[timoseewho]

Hello, really noobie question here. My current network setup at my small company is modem->router->switch. I'm in a situation where I can ditch that router (no need for the wifi functionality anymore and I've gotten a bigger switch to fit more cables), is doing just modem->switch feasible? Or do I need the router there to do the ip assigning, etc.?

Thanks

 

[frowertr]

What is the model of the cable modem? They usually double as routers so you should be able to use that alone as your primary router assuming you don't need advanced features like port forwarding, ACL, VPN, etc...

 

[timoseewho]

What is the model of the cable modem? They usually double as routers so you should be able to use that alone as your primary router assuming you don't need advanced features like port forwarding, ACL, VPN, etc...

ah i see, naw i don't need anything fancy heh

the model is HW-HG8240, a Huawei model, i'm in China;p

 

[sdifox]

You still need the router, you may not need the wifi but you still need nat, firewall and routing functionality.

 

[timoseewho]

You still need the router, you may not need the wifi but you still need nat, firewall and routing functionality.

, is that your conclusion after checking out the modem?

 

[frowertr]

I don't see much listed about routing functionality with that. It's essentially just a fiber NT.

Looks like you still need your additional router.

 

[Red Squirrel]

Yeah if you connect a switch directly you will be connected straight to the internet and every device will have an internet IP and not a LAN one. The router is responsible for segregrating the network and also providing DHCP. A router is really a router, switch and access point in one. You can turn off the wifi but you still need a router.

Unless the "modem" is a router. Lot of ISPs are doing that now. When you connect directly to the modem do you get a 192.168.x.x or 10.x IP or an internet routable one?

 

[mv2devnull]

The HG8240 seems to be configurable and has four LAN ports, i.e. might be able to serve as router.

It is your job, as the owner, to seek and study the manual and features of your modem.

The keywords to look for: DHCP, NAT, firewall, LAN, WAN.

 

[timoseewho]

I don't see much listed about routing functionality with that. It's essentially just a fiber NT.

Looks like you still need your additional router.

aite thanks for checking!

Yeah if you connect a switch directly you will be connected straight to the internet and every device will have an internet IP and not a LAN one. The router is responsible for segregrating the network and also providing DHCP. A router is really a router, switch and access point in one. You can turn off the wifi but you still need a router.

Unless the "modem" is a router. Lot of ISPs are doing that now. When you connect directly to the modem do you get a 192.168.x.x or 10.x IP or an internet routable one?

this is good to know, i'll get around to doing that now

The HG8240 seems to be configurable and has four LAN ports, i.e. might be able to serve as router.

It is your job, as the owner, to seek and study the manual and features of your modem.

The keywords to look for: DHCP, NAT, firewall, LAN, WAN.

alrighty, unfortunately i wasn't around when the Internet guy came and did the setting up but apparently from what i've heard only 1/4 port is functional for some reason i don't know lol

 

[smitbret]

After taking a look at the service manual, it looks like it's simply a Network Link that provides VoIP. It can be setup as a network router. I wouldn't be surprised if the "Router" isn't just being used as a WiFi AP. OP could probably just remove it completely, however, I am a fan of "If it ain't broke, don't fix it". Maybe just turn off the WiFi and leave everything else as-is.

Is there any reason you want to remove the router other than you don't need WiFi?

 

[JeffMD]

There is a good chance the cable modem will route, however it is most likely in a passthrough mode to your current router. So not only would removing the router be dangerous, exposing all your computers to the internet directly, but not going to work since you are most likely only assigned the one IP address, and the rest of your computers will fail to be given an IP.

You can ask your ISP to configure the modem to route, but this may not be ideal as you won't have %100 over the cable modems router settings. Frankly that's a whole lot of work for no gain. Your current router is already configured. So just turn off the wifi radios and use your current AP as a router.

 

[timoseewho]

After taking a look at the service manual, it looks like it's simply a Network Link that provides VoIP. It can be setup as a network router. I wouldn't be surprised if the "Router" isn't just being used as a WiFi AP. OP could probably just remove it completely, however, I am a fan of "If it ain't broke, don't fix it". Maybe just turn off the WiFi and leave everything else as-is.

Is there any reason you want to remove the router other than you don't need WiFi?

haha, good question, i just thought that maybe the network signal would degrade passing through a router instead of directly into the switch, is this not true? is it not that big of a deal? i'm also a fan of if it ain't broke don't fix it, but i'm also a fan of the simpler the better lol

There is a good chance the cable modem will route, however it is most likely in a passthrough mode to your current router. So not only would removing the router be dangerous, exposing all your computers to the internet directly, but not going to work since you are most likely only assigned the one IP address, and the rest of your computers will fail to be given an IP.

You can ask your ISP to configure the modem to route, but this may not be ideal as you won't have %100 over the cable modems router settings. Frankly that's a whole lot of work for no gain. Your current router is already configured. So just turn off the wifi radios and use your current AP as a router.

haha, gotcha, sound advice, thanks^^

i never thought about the security aspect, like i said above, i thought if i didn't need the router, why have it there and just act as a passing medium. does my signal, if at all, degrade going through a router?

 

[mv2devnull]

Signal does not degrade.

However, look at two scenarios:
1. You hand packets to John and John hands packets to you.
2. You hand packets to Matt, who passes them to John and John hands (reply) packets to Matt, who passes them to you.

Having Matt in the middle is unavoidably a tiny bit slower. How much? Depends on how efficient Matt is. If he is much slower than you or John, then he is the slowest link in that short chain.

However, the packets that are going from switch to modem do not stop there. They continue to ISP's modem and from there through unknown number of routers and switches until they reach their destination, for example forums.anandtech.com. One device more or less does not make much difference.

 

[timoseewho]

Signal does not degrade.

However, look at two scenarios:
1. You hand packets to John and John hands packets to you.
2. You hand packets to Matt, who passes them to John and John hands (reply) packets to Matt, who passes them to you.

Having Matt in the middle is unavoidably a tiny bit slower. How much? Depends on how efficient Matt is. If he is much slower than you or John, then he is the slowest link in that short chain.

However, the packets that are going from switch to modem do not stop there. They continue to ISP's modem and from there through unknown number of routers and switches until they reach their destination, for example forums.anandtech.com. One device more or less does not make much difference.

dammit Matt always trying to take a cut

thanks:]