Computer upgrade

[l Thomas l]

Last time I was looking into computer hardware was the end of last summer.

I wanted to upgrade my computer last year (yeah I know I should just get a new one), and here were my two plans:

new power supply
Intel C2D mobo, has to support AGP
C2D Conroe E6300

OR

new power supply
AMD 939 mobo, has to support AGP
Athlon 64 X2 3800+ or Opteron 165

Prices have gone down considerably in almost a year, it's now about half the price it was before, so I want to know what I've been missing. What ended up happening with C2D, did it outperform AMD as expected? And more importantly for me, which upgrade should I do? Is it still even possible to have mobos that support AGP and dual core processors at the same time?

Also, a new concern of mine, is an effecient power supply. My current one is a 250W stock Dell. I don't know how effecient it is or how much it actually draws, but if I do upgrade I want one that won't cause a big difference in the electricity bill. I don't need that much power. The processor will add a little but not much. Just check my system in the sig.

Another thing I want to do, is possibly better airflow in my system. I have one 80mm extake blowing out in the back, which means negative air flow if I remember correctly, which is ok but leads to a lot of dust. I guess it's not causing too much of a problem but I was just wondering if I could improve it.

 

[bamacre]

You are not planning on putting these new components in the Dim 4500 case, right? If so, make new plans.

 

[l Thomas l]

oh damn I forgot about that, the damn dell case doesn't have the right slot for the power supply. Forgot to add new case. I guess it's not a big deal since everything is so much cheaper than before. is there anything else wrong with the d4500 case, other than the power supply thing?

 

[LOUISSSSS]

i dont see this as a worthwhile upgrade, you might as well get a complete (up to date) system for about $600 when u save enough

 

[bamacre]

Originally posted by: l Thomas l
oh damn I forgot about that, the damn dell case doesn't have the right slot for the power supply. Forgot to add new case. I guess it's not a big deal since everything is so much cheaper than before. is there anything else wrong with the d4500 case, other than the power supply thing?

Well, a new motherboard wouldn't fit in the case either. Your case, motherboard, and psu are all proprietary.

And I agree with LOUISSSSS, you need a complete overhaul.

 

[ForumMaster]

ditch the AGP card. try and sell it and tell us your budget. the only motherboard that supports the C2D as well as DDR and AGP is an ASROCK and i have heard bad things about it. and a 6300 isn't neccesary if you don't have too much money. a 4300e would also be quite sufficient.

 

[l Thomas l]

I forgot to tell you guys I use this for gaming. Counterstrike, Battlefield 2, America's Army. Obviously I'm not too serious about it, because the performance is fine right now, except in America's Army and BF2 which I barely play anymore anyway.

I don't see how I can get a new computer for gaming for $600. I don't like to go cheap on things. Can anyone suggest a plan for me, since it's been a year? I'll need Case (with good airflow), Power Supply (effecient and not much more draw than what I have now), mobo, CPU, RAM, GPU. I don't want a new hard drive, and mobos still work with IDE right? So I can keep my disk drives and hard drive.

My priorities are the power consumption, the case with good airflow and decent noise level (right now it gets kinda noisy but I barely notice it). The CPU, RAM, and GPU have to be decent at least. The games I mentioned aren't too intensive. I remember last year the 3800 would have been perfect. I might overclock, if I learn about it again.

I forgot why exactly I need new memory, but I know for one that since I have two different RAM sticks, they won't work, plus their speeds are terrible.

How do you suggest selling the 9800 pro? I don't even see it on Newegg anymore. Who's gonna buy it?

 

[yh125d]

it oughta sell on the forums here fairly well. But yes, ditch agp ASAP, you'll never look back. I can understand people waiting this long if they're on a tight budget, but if they're gonna be getting a new mobo anyway, theres NO reason to stick with agp

 

[bamacre]

Dell (outlet) E521 + 7950 GT = $600 Gaming system

Or sell what you have and increase your budget.

 

[l Thomas l]

Is that dell limiting like the one I have now is? Because I'm not about to fall into their trap again.

Originally posted by: yh125d
it oughta sell on the forums here fairly well. But yes, ditch agp ASAP, you'll never look back. I can understand people waiting this long if they're on a tight budget, but if they're gonna be getting a new mobo anyway, theres NO reason to stick with agp

Well I was on a budget, now I have some jobs and ways of making money.

 

[bamacre]

Originally posted by: l Thomas l
Is that dell limiting like the one I have now is? Because I'm not about to fall into their trap again.

LOL, you have a Dell Dim 4500.

Anything is "limited" if you plan on keeping it that long.

 

[l Thomas l]

Originally posted by: bamacre

Originally posted by: l Thomas l
Is that dell limiting like the one I have now is? Because I'm not about to fall into their trap again.

LOL, you have a Dell Dim 4500.

Anything is "limited" if you plan on keeping it that long.

What? No I mean how they keep you from upgrading your computer by making proprietary case, power supply, etc. Most upgrades you have to buy from Dell if you want to, or buy another computer.

 

[l Thomas l]

bump

 

[0roo0roo]

intel is currently handing amd their ass, both on performance and price really especially when you oc their core 2 chips.

its a bit late in the game to keep legacy agp, maybe 2 years ago it would be still ok to hang on, but now its pointless, you will leave your system a dead end especially with the video card you got now which isn't really sufficient.

if you must you can get one of those frys combo deals for 80-150 bucks on sale all tghe time, probably will have ddr1 compatibility for some..agp possible. a small upgrade, but i guess it would help since that p4 is rather slow. you woudln't need a new psu for that. thats all you are going to get for the uber cheap upgrade.

real upgrade is better with ddr2, which is frankly cheap, there are plenty of deals for 2gb for ~99bucks these days, and thats what games want anyways really. psu, seasonic is good, but you will have to spend atleast 50 bucks, but the efficiency will be 80%+. at that point you will have to pay for video ~$150/memory~$100/cpu~$100/mb~$50/cooler~$20/psu~$50... you might as well buy a new case~-$50-100. either go all the way or basically tolerate a slow system for a while longer with that smaller upgrade. guess it depends how important gaming is to you. my guess is you will slap in a cheap combo agp compatible dealie for the minor upgrade. its a dead end but its cheap.

 

[0roo0roo]

well looking at mercury news frys adverts theres a core 2 duo e4300 ecs p4m800pro-m v2 that does ddr1 and agp for 129 bucks
http://newspaperads.mercurynews.com/ROP/ads.aspx?adid=4385893&advid=32664&type=

 

[l Thomas l]

I'll probably get a huge upgrade. I'm not too serious about gaming, but I can use it for other programs (Sound, image, and video editing). I'm willing to spend about $600. I'll probably wait until the beginning of the summer so I hope prices will drop.

Can someone guide me in the right direction for:
CPU: Looks like I'll go the Intel route. What model do you guys suggest, for the best value?
Cooler: I never knew much about CPU coolers. I doubt I'll do much overclocking. If I do it'll be minimal.
Mobo: Whichever is best for the Intel C2D. I don't want to spend too much money, since I won't overclock too much.
GPU: ATI Radeon X1950 was the latest ATI when I last checked! Haha. Is this a good midrange card? Does ATI still offer better value?
RAM: I want the speed and timings to be decent, but I don't want to spend more than $100. As I said, I'll use it for gaming + sound, image, and video editing.
PSU: Seasonic S12 still one of the best? How many watts do you think I'll need? Again, power consumption is a concern. Right now my power supply is only 250W.

Thanks

 

[Ken90630]

Originally posted by: l Thomas l
PSU: Seasonic S12 still one of the best? How many watts do you think I'll need? Again, power consumption is a concern. Right now my power supply is only 250W.

Thanks

Considering your budget and your stated goals, and what you'll be using the machine for, I think this Seasonic S12-380 PSU would be ideal for you. And the price is exceptional. Grab it while it's still on sale and they've still got some in stock.

You could step up to the S12-430 if you want more "headroom" for future expansion, but the truth is that the S12-380 will power just about any single-vid-card system you can build today (and still give you headroom to spare). The S12 series is also exceptionally efficient at any load, so even if your system draw on it is nowhere near 380 watts, it will still perform at or near its rated efficiency.

BTW (and no offense), but your comments about efficiency and your electric bill make me think you might have the wrong idea about how that works. Efficiency doesn't impact your electric bill (or power draw from the wall) so much as it affects the temperature and performance of the PSU itself (i.e., a PSU with 65% efficiency isn't really going to cost you more on your electric bill than a PSU with 80% efficiency). An inefficient PSU will not be able to convert a high percentage of incoming wall voltage to 'usable' DC voltage (to power the computer's components), so what it can't convert gets wasted as heat. That heat in turn can cause three undesirable consequences:

1) More heat inside the computer itself, and heat in a computer is undesirable (duh ).
2) The hotter the PSU's internal temperature, the more its power output drops (generally speaking).
3) The hotter the PSU, the more work the PSU's fan has to do to try to keep it cool. Fans that must run fast to cope with a lot of heat tend to be noisier than fans that can run slower (duh again). So a PSU that is efficient, and therefore doesn't get too hot inside, can use a slower fan speed to keep itself cool. And lower fan speed typically means less noise from the PSU. The S12 series is virtually silent, BTW.

There's no shortage of opinions on PSUs on this site, but I think you'd be hard pressed to find a better PSU than that S12-380 at that price. Considering your budget, looks like a no-brainer to me.

Good luck with your build.

 

[0roo0roo]

RAM: I want the speed and timings to be decent, but I don't want to spend more than $100. As I said, I'll use it for gaming + sound, image, and video editing.
PSU: Seasonic S12 still one of the best? How many watts do you think I'll need? Again, power consumption is a concern. Right now my power supply is only 250W.

2gb is what you want, forget quibbling about ram timings, just go for price
seasonic, what you can afford. you aren't going to get uber power hungry stuff and over clock it so you will be fine.

 

[l Thomas l]

Originally posted by: Ken90630

Originally posted by: l Thomas l
PSU: Seasonic S12 still one of the best? How many watts do you think I'll need? Again, power consumption is a concern. Right now my power supply is only 250W.

Thanks

Considering your budget and your stated goals, and what you'll be using the machine for, I think this Seasonic S12-380 PSU would be ideal for you. And the price is exceptional. Grab it while it's still on sale and they've still got some in stock.

You could step up to the S12-430 if you want more "headroom" for future expansion, but the truth is that the S12-380 will power just about any single-vid-card system you can build today (and still give you headroom to spare). The S12 series is also exceptionally efficient at any load, so even if your system draw on it is nowhere near 380 watts, it will still perform at or near its rated efficiency.

BTW (and no offense), but your comments about efficiency and your electric bill make me think you might have the wrong idea about how that works. Efficiency doesn't impact your electric bill (or power draw from the wall) so much as it affects the temperature and performance of the PSU itself (i.e., a PSU with 65% efficiency isn't really going to cost you more on your electric bill than a PSU with 80% efficiency). An inefficient PSU will not be able to convert a high percentage of incoming wall voltage to 'usable' DC voltage (to power the computer's components), so what it can't convert gets wasted as heat. That heat in turn can cause three undesirable consequences:

1) More heat inside the computer itself, and heat in a computer is undesirable (duh ).
2) The hotter the PSU's internal temperature, the more its power output drops (generally speaking).
3) The hotter the PSU, the more work the PSU's fan has to do to try to keep it cool. Fans that must run fast to cope with a lot of heat tend to be noisier than fans that can run slower (duh again). So a PSU that is efficient, and therefore doesn't get too hot inside, can use a slower fan speed to keep itself cool. And lower fan speed typically means less noise from the PSU. The S12 series is virtually silent, BTW.

There's no shortage of opinions on PSUs on this site, but I think you'd be hard pressed to find a better PSU than that S12-380 at that price. Considering your budget, looks like a no-brainer to me.

Good luck with your build.

Yeah I wanted to get one with the best effeciency so I wouldn't have to buy a PSU that would take so much watts and just waste em. I just want a PSU that will be sufficient for my needs. True, I don't know much about power supplies.


Thanks

 

[l Thomas l]

Can you guys suggest some parts for me:
CPU: Looks like I'll go the Intel route. What model do you guys suggest, for the best value?
Cooler: I never knew much about CPU coolers. I doubt I'll do much overclocking. If I do it'll be minimal.
Mobo: Whichever is best for the Intel C2D. I don't want to spend too much money, since I won't overclock too much.
GPU: ATI Radeon X1950 was the latest ATI when I last checked! Haha. Is this a good midrange card? Does ATI still offer better value?
RAM: I want the speed and timings to be decent, but I don't want to spend more than $100. As I said, I'll use it for gaming + sound, image, and video editing.
PSU: Seasonic S12 still one of the best? How many watts do you think I'll need? Again, power consumption is a concern. Right now my power supply is only 250W.

 

[Phantomaniac]

Sure thing.

CPU: E4300 @ $135
Cooling: Arctic Cooling Alpine 7 @ $15
MB: Either Gigabyte P965-S3 or Biostar TForceP965 @ $105
GPU: Either X1950PRO or 7900GS @ $150
RAM: Either G.skill or Geil DDR2 800 4-4-4-12 kits @ $130
PSU: Good brands such as FSP, Hiper, and Mushkin all have 500W PSUs for around $80.

So $615 will get you a pretty nice system (capable of decent overclocks too if you're willing to work on it).

 

[l Thomas l]

Bump

 

[coolpurplefan]

You can always copy my rig.

I have a silent computer I find kind of cool. I have...

-Coolermaster Centurion 5 case with side window and blue trim

-Seasonic S-12 500 watt power supply

-Abit AT8 32X socket 939 motherboard (passive heatsink)

-AMD Athlon 4000+ San Diego (single core)

-Scythe Ninja passive heatsink (with the 120mm Scythe fan in the case)

-Samsung Spinpoint SP2514N (250 GB HD)

-HIS X1650 XT iSilence II (passive heatsink)

-2GB OCZ Platinum RAM

You can probably get the motherboard and CPU at compuvest. That place usually has "old" stuff at lower prices.

My machine runs cool and silent and runs BF2 and UT2004 with very good frame rates. I know case-mod.com has the HIS X1650 XT iSilence II.

BTW, you can take out the 120mm and 80mm fans that come with the case and like I said, use the 120mm Scythe fan that comes free with the Ninja heatsink. The only running fans you have are the 120mm fan in the Seasonic and the Scythe fan used for the case.

I'd like to note that the Seasonic power supply and that hard drive are pretty silent. And the Samsung HD runs very cool. I also like to say I've used Vantec, Antec and Ultra round IDE cables to improve airflow. And, the extra cables from the power supply and shoved into the spot right next to the hard drive. I mean, not the side of the window but the other side.

Whoops! Forgot to add that with that Abit mobo, you'd need a 16 inch or 18 inch floppy cable and an 18 inch IDE cable. One IDE cable can be shorter like 12 inches. (I was fussy and I got single device round IDE cables which are sometimes just a little harder than usual to find.)