Computer Freezes

[sfmedic]

Hi,

I am a rookie on this site and for that matter to the tech world. I built a computer for the kids using some older tech. But now I realize that I probably could have built a more mainstream computer for the same or even less. Shows you I don't know too much. Any way I am looking for some help and am not quite sure if its software or hardware related.

The computer I built is as follows

Intel Celeron 1.4Ghz 256 L2 cache 100mhz FSB
MachSpeed Motherboard 694TAS with the Via chipset w/onboard sound
768 mb RAM 100/133
40gb Western Digital Hard Drive 7200rpm
BTC CD-RW/DVD combo
generic 3.5" fdd
Added Creative Sound card Live digital 5.1
Powmax 450watt P4 approved PSU in a powmax case with side case fan
Info Tek GeCube ATI Radeon GC-9200SE 128M video card
Win98se OS

The computer is freezing up during game play. That is the Graphic display is frozen, the keyboard is frozen, the mouse is frozen but it is playing sound and when I am playing a game like Nascar Heat I have a logitech USB Force Feedback Steering wheel attached which still vibrates, and when the gas pedal is depressed the engine sounds rev up, apply the brake the wheels screech, and the wheel shakes when a crashing sound is made as though your still driving but with freeze frame on.
Also when we play Command and Conquer Generals; History Channels Alamo and Civil War; any Need for Speed games; FlyII or for that matter any DX game the computer freezes in a matter of minutes. But take SimCity 3000, we can play that game all day long. Or we can hook up a USB wireless adapter and surf the net all day long and never have any problems.

I am puzzled. I went to ATI and down loaded the latest catalyst driver. I have done a full reinstall of the OS. I know that Win98SE is ancient history but I had it around and thought I would put it to use. I went to the MOBO site and downloaded the most recent 4 in 1 drivers and updated the BIOS. I tried turning the side fan around to see if that would help in lowering the ambient temperature in the case and blow more air over the CPU. The CPU runs at 45-49degrees C. The case temp is around 37-39C. I want to know if using Arctic Silver 5, or something similar will help. Would lapping the heatsink be helpful? I also have got some more case fans to see if that will help.

Is it possible that it is the video card that is giving me trouble? After reading several posts about the 9200SE (does the SE stand for SLOWER than ESCARGO?) it makes you want to take it out and use it for pavement. I am aware of the several possibilities that exist that can cause this instability. CPU, chipset or graphics card overheating, bad power supply (no I haven't had a chance to check the output with a multimeter yet), bad RAM, sound card conflict, software conflicts or drivers, etc. etc. etc. I put in a sound card thinking there might be a conflict with the onboard sound. (My friend gave me the soundcard). I may not have the CMOS settings correct. I have the AGP set at 4X I believe.

I am not home and will not be until wednesday morning. So I can't get any settings if you ask for them. I am interested in learning how to solve this problem without scrapping the whole darn thing and starting from square one. Course most of you will tell me to. And if you do that's OK I am using this as a learning experience and its fun. Even if the darn thing doesn't work quite right.

 

[Navid]

The video card overheating has resulted in a black screen with the audio still playing, while playing a game, in my case.

This is in answer to the definition of SE for an ATI card.
http://www.neeyik.info/3dspecs/

You can see that the SE version of 9200 has less number of bits for memory interface and lower core and memory frequency compared to 9200.

Lapping is not an easy thing to do, as opposed to what is written in many guides. It is very easy to end up with a smooth but convex surface, which may be much worse than the original rough but flat surface of the heatsink.
I would not recommend it.
Even IF lapping is done write, the benefit is very small.

Surfing the net does not stress the graphics card as much as playing a 3D game does.

At this point, I suggest that you attempt to reduce the temperture of the graphics card. I believe there is no fan on that card. Can you mount a fan in the case to blow air on to the heatsink of the card to avoid dead (hot) air.

No offense intended:
I suggest that you post a single question in the form of a short post. Many people skip long posts, resulting in reduced number of answers.

I am not an expert. But, sometimes, when someone makes suggestions, others jump in to correct them. So, please read all the other posts that hopefully will come after this.
Welcome to the forums.

Edit:
Arctic silver 5 is reported to be the best thermal compound.
But, even if you reduce your CPU temperature, your game freeze problem may remain if the cause is the ATI card overheat, which I think is the case.

 

[Navid]

Your power supply must have a fan that blows air out of the case from thre back.
Do you have another fan at the back blowing air out of the case?
If not, you should add one.

 

[sfmedic]

Thanks for the suggestions. I recently purchased some case fans that I am planning to install to have intake in the front and exhaust fans in the back. The side fan was an exhaust fan that I turned around to make it blow towards the video card.

I do get long winded and I will keep it short for the future. Thanks and no offense taken.

 

[Navid]

I think you need to have an exhaust fan in the back below the power supply before you think about putting intake fans.
Your case temperature will drop and your problem may resolve if your case temperature drops enough. The graphics card uses the air from the case for cooling.

 

[sfmedic]

I am definitely putting in an exhaust fan on the back of the unit. I also thought about as you said mounting a fan on the video cards heatsink. It may be tricky because the heatsinks fins are placed in a fan pattern so it is rounded on top.

 

[Navid]

Originally posted by: sfmedic
I am definitely putting in an exhaust fan on the back of the unit. I also thought about as you said mounting a fan on the video cards heatsink. It may be tricky because the heatsinks fins are placed in a fan pattern so it is rounded on top.

That is not what I meant. If you install a fan ON the video card, you may void the warranty. I meant to suggest to put a fan somewhere in the case to blow air towards the video card. An example is by using a bracket.
http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=35-118-204&depa=0

 

[sfmedic]

Yes your right. It will void the warrnty, I didn't think of that. Thanks.

 

[sfmedic]

Thanks for the help. I added 2 exhaust fans. Tried the games again and it did the same thing. Screen locked up. So then I went into the bios settings and set the AGP to 2X and the AGP aperature to 64M. And fired it up again and so far it runs great and no freezing.

 

[Navid]

You can download Motherbord Monitor and set it to start when windows starts. It will put your CPU and motherboard temperatures in your taskbar.
You can set it to log its measurements every 10 seconds.
Then, after playing a game, even if it crashes, you can open the log and see how temperatures and voltages have behaved while you have been playing.
You can also try changing the exhaust fan setup and see how they affect the temperatures and choose the best setup that way.

http://mbm.livewiredev.com/

 

[Sideswipe001]

There is a good chance that your motherboard is having a problem running at AGP 4x with that card. I've seen quite a few freezes that were related to the motherboard's AGP setting (especially on VIA chipsets).

If it's possible, I'd suggest pulling the video card and trying it in another computer - friends' or another of your own - and try to play games. See if it plays without a hitch.

The video is most certainly the cause, judging from when the locks occur. The only question is, is is the video card's fault, or the motherboards?

 

[sfmedic]

Thanks I will download it when I get home tomorrow as I am at work for the next 24 or so hours. Thanks for the tip. Right now when I want to see the temps I have to reboot and it displays at the very first when the bios display is on.

 

[sfmedic]

That was my inclination. Thats why I set the bios at 2X. That's a good idea to try this card in another computer. That will help with diagnosing the real cause. I have also thought about trying a different video card like an nvidia 5200 in this mobo.

 

[MrChad]

Windows 98 has difficulty handling more than 512 MB of RAM. There are some tweaks/hacks to get it to work with more than 512, but with your system specs you should look into running a more modern OS (like XP Home).

 

[sfmedic]

I will look into getting an OEM XP home version. I didn't know that Win98 had troubles with more than 512mb. Thanks for the tip.