Clinton Official: We was robbed

[Queasy]

Link - Oh what fun the Democrat National Convention is going to turn out to be. Will the Clinton's attempt some kind of coup or possibly some kind of concession from the Obama camp or just throw a monkey wrench into the whole thing? Enquiring minds want to know!

Sen. Hillary Clinton would be the Democratic presidential nominee if John Edwards had been caught in his lie about an extramarital affair and forced out of the race last year, insists a top Clinton campaign aide, making a charge that could exacerbate previously existing tensions between the camps of Clinton and Sen. Barack Obama.

"I believe we would have won Iowa, and Clinton today would therefore have been the nominee," former Clinton Communications Director Howard Wolfson told ABCNews.com.

Clinton finished third in the Iowa caucuses barely behind Edwards in second place and Obama in first. The momentum of the insurgent Obama campaign beating two better-known candidates -- not to mention an African-American winning in such an overwhelmingly white state -- changed the dynamics of the race forever.

Obama won 37.6 per cent of the vote. Edwards won 29.7 per cent and Clinton won 29.5 per cent, according to results posted by the Iowa Democratic Party.

"Our voters and Edwards' voters were the same people," Wolfson said the Clinton polls showed. "They were older, pro-union. Not all, but maybe two-thirds of them would have been for us and we would have barely beaten Obama."

Two months earlier, Edwards had vociferously, but falsely, denied a story in the National Enquirer about the alleged affair last October, and few in the mainstream media even reported the denial.

 

[ProfJohn]

The guy makes a good point. If the media had done its job and looked into the affair rumors perhaps Edwards drops out and Hillary picks up enough of his votes to win Iowa and some other places or at least hurts the Obamentum and wins. Remember the difference between Obama and Hillary at the end was virtually nothing.

James Carville had the best take on this though.
As he said. It is interesting to talk about, but doesn't really mean anything.

 

[Slick5150]

Oh good lord. Wolfson needs to let it go.

 

[Tab]

I don't really know of any Edwards supporters, who's to say if they would have switched to Hilary or Obama?

In any case Obama has the nomination and that's fine by me :thumbsup:

 

[Fern]

Originally posted by: Slick5150
Oh good lord. Wolfson needs to let it go.

Yes, but I remain sceptical that they will.

I noted some concern when Obama recently agreed to seat FL & MI with a full vote; within days Hillary started flirting with the whole *vote on the convention floor* thing.

Nothing, absolutely nothing a Clinton does could surprise me; and I include an attempted *coup* at the convention as something that wouldn't surprise me.

IMO, her comments are nothing short of floating a trial balloon.

Fern

 

[brencat]

Just another loyal Clinton waterboy pleading his "if only" case. Nothing to see here -- move along.

 

[OrByte]

The guy doesnt make a good point, he makes an interesting speculative argument, and it is certainly inflammatory.

The more interesting point/tangent of this episode is the apparent failure of the media to bring this issue up when it mattered during the primary. I am smelling something fishy here...

In the end this is just what the GOP was hoping for, more dem stryfe.... :roll:

PJ is right, James Carville knows what is best for the party....to try and smooth this drama out as quickly and as best as possible.

Figures, the dems can never do anything easy...and this is a clear example.

 

[fskimospy]

Nope, the convention will go on normally.

 

[Mxylplyx]

I would contend that Edwards in turn saved the democratic's chances of winning in November. Try as they might, conservatives and moderates cant find much to hate about Obama. However, Hillary Clinton is a whole different story. I think McCain would crush Hillary in the general election.

 

[Xavier434]

I'm trying to ignore most "what ifs?" when it comes to the campaign. There are just too many other pressing issues to remain focused on. It is interesting to speculate just for fun, but beyond that it really doesn't matter to me.

 

[RightIsWrong]

They are ASSuming that the majority of Edwards supporters would have gone over to Hillary. Not really likely considering Edwards platform was a lot closer to Obama's that it was to hers.

Even if she would have gotten 60% of his supporters, she still would have lost Iowa.

 

[brencat]

Originally posted by: Mxylplyx
Try as they might, conservatives and moderates cant find much to hate about Obama. However, Hillary Clinton is a whole different story. I think McCain would crush Hillary in the general election.

I'm a Republican and I totally disagree. Hillary with all her faults and baggage is still a more appealing candidate to older folks than Obama -- and they are the ones that vote. Hillary would win by a bigger margin than will Obama if he even wins at all. There never was going to be a landslide either way.

 

[Robor]

Hillary would be *crazy* to try and pull any shenanigans at the convention. IMO it would be the end of her political career.

 

[StageLeft]

Well, that person may very well be right, but too bad.

However, I will say, I will laugh on my way to hell (or rather the US') if McCain wins and we have reasonable confidences that Hillary could have beaten him if she'd been the nominee and she'd have been the nominee if Edwards wasn't a sleeze (and let's not joke around here, we all knew he was a greaseball a long time ago, didn't we?).

If the media had done its job and looked into the affair rumors perhaps Edwards drops out and Hillary picks up enough of his votes to win Iowa and some other places or at least hurts the Obamentum and wins.

Yep. But then if the media had done its job I bet a lot of things would be different. I don't want to make this an Iraq thread, so I won't.

 

[Mxylplyx]

Originally posted by: brencat

Originally posted by: Mxylplyx
Try as they might, conservatives and moderates cant find much to hate about Obama. However, Hillary Clinton is a whole different story. I think McCain would crush Hillary in the general election.

I'm a Republican and I totally disagree. Hillary with all her faults and baggage is still a more appealing candidate to older folks than Obama -- and they are the ones that vote. Hillary would win by a bigger margin than will Obama if he even wins at all. There never was going to be a landslide either way.

I guess I speak as a younger former conservative. I voted for Bush twice, and might vote for Obama in November.

 

[Tab]

Originally posted by: Mxylplyx

Originally posted by: brencat

Originally posted by: Mxylplyx
Try as they might, conservatives and moderates cant find much to hate about Obama. However, Hillary Clinton is a whole different story. I think McCain would crush Hillary in the general election.

I'm a Republican and I totally disagree. Hillary with all her faults and baggage is still a more appealing candidate to older folks than Obama -- and they are the ones that vote. Hillary would win by a bigger margin than will Obama if he even wins at all. There never was going to be a landslide either way.

I guess I speak as a younger former conservative. I voted for Bush twice, and might vote for Obama in November.

I feel the same, I truly believe McCain had a better chance against Hilary; the Clinton name has a lot of "political" baggage.

 

[nageov3t]

maybe it's true... but so what? shit happens.

Originally posted by: Mxylplyx

Try as they might, conservatives and moderates cant find much to hate about Obama.

really? :laugh: if by "conservatives and moderates" you mean yourself, sure, but I'm a liberal and even I can find things to hate about Obama.

I hate making the argument because I do not want to see Hillary run as VP, but an Obama/Clinton ticket is the one thing that pushes him above the 50% threshold in national polls.

 

[Perknose]

Originally posted by: RightIsWrong
They are ASSuming that the majority of Edwards supporters would have gone over to Hillary. Not really likely considering Edwards platform was a lot closer to Obama's that it was to hers.

That's a world class stupid statement, since Clinton and Obama's platforms themselves were so close anyway.

 

[Perknose]

Originally posted by: ProfJohn
The guy makes a good point. If the media had done its job . . .

If the media had "done its job" Bush wouldn't be President and we would never have invaded Iraq. :roll:

 

[Moonbeam]

If grandma had whiskers she would be grandpa and if a frog didn't have any hind legs he's bump his butt off.

 

[NeoV]

"The guy makes a good point. If the media had done its job and looked into the affair rumors "

Now the general media is supposed to follow the lead on every store the Enquirer comes up with?

 

[Starbuck1975]

Of course, this what-if scenario assumes that a vote for Edwards was a potential vote for Clinton...arguably, a vote for Edwards or Obama early in the primary seasion was a vote AGAINST Clinton.

 

[Deeko]

I was an Edwards supporter than migrated to Obama after he dropped out....*shrug*

 

[Duwelon]

Originally posted by: NeoV
"The guy makes a good point. If the media had done its job and looked into the affair rumors "

Now the general media is supposed to follow the lead on every store the Enquirer comes up with?

Had it been Gouliani or Huckabee, you darn right they would have investigated the veracity of the claim and spewed the accusations around enough to make their faithful viewers think every accusation is true, like they do with the Bush admin.

 

[m1ldslide1]

Originally posted by: Deeko
I was an Edwards supporter than migrated to Obama after he dropped out....*shrug*

Me too. I don't live in Iowa, but I can see people going either way. Labor would traditionally go to Clinton, progressives would fall towards Obama I think. Iowa probably has more labor than progressives, so it's a fairly valid argument.

Moonbeam's right though - who cares? To make a fuss about it now is just twisting the knife and creating more sensational press for the not-mccains.