Clean Install not possible with Vista Upgrade Discs
- Thread starter Aberforth
- Start date
Originally posted by: John
I haven't had a chance to try this yet, but I assume it works.
*legally it doesn't
*Originally posted by: John
What exactly is illegal about that method?
You want to pay for Upgrade version and run a clean install? So what's the use of Ultimate Full Version?
The ability to transfer an unlimited number of times is one benefit. IMHO the retail full versions are the only versions that people, mainly the enthusiasts like us on this forum, should be buying if they want to remain legal once they transfer to one or more pc's as time marches on.
This has got to be one of the most confusing subjects. Frankly that dailytech article linked a Knowledge Base article which referred to purchasing an "upgrade key" not purchasing an retail upgrade version. I don't know why Microsoft has been so vague on this issue but I am taking a wait and see approach.
Furthermore there is a thread in hot deals HERE where Cardio claims to have installed an upgrade version using a clean install with a disc check.
Furthermore there is a thread in hot deals HERE where Cardio claims to have installed an upgrade version using a clean install with a disc check.
If the method stash mentions works, well, then doing that isn't a big deal. Otherwise..... this sucks for anyone getting new hardware and installing Vista. I alone can think of two people who have older systems and legal, full versions of Windows XP. While they aren't looking to upgrade their hardware and move to Vista today, I'm sure the day will come. When it does, they are expected to install their WinXP on their new hardware, call in (likely) to reactivate, and then do an in place upgrade to Vista.
I'm sure Microsoft would say this policy has something to do with piracy, but the reality is that they are making the people who bought their software, and now are buying their new software, install and activate twice. It isn't difficult or really that time consuming, and extra hour or so, but a lousy way to treat your repeat, paying customers.
Edit: Then again, Cardio says that having a previous OS disc still works. I guess the jury is still out.
I'm sure Microsoft would say this policy has something to do with piracy, but the reality is that they are making the people who bought their software, and now are buying their new software, install and activate twice. It isn't difficult or really that time consuming, and extra hour or so, but a lousy way to treat your repeat, paying customers.
Edit: Then again, Cardio says that having a previous OS disc still works. I guess the jury is still out.
Maybe I'm not quite up to speed on this concept, but please clarify for me if ya can
You must have XP installed in order to use a vista upgrade. Gotcha.
NOW, once you boot the vista upgrade dvd on XP and start the setup, can you then use the disk management setup portion of vista to nuke the XP partition at that point and install clean?
It seems that it would have had the ability to verify your xp and xp key or whatnot and there would be no real sense in requiring anything more from XP that that point.
Am I still not getting it, or is what I've written out what will be the defacto deal here?
You must have XP installed in order to use a vista upgrade. Gotcha.
NOW, once you boot the vista upgrade dvd on XP and start the setup, can you then use the disk management setup portion of vista to nuke the XP partition at that point and install clean?
It seems that it would have had the ability to verify your xp and xp key or whatnot and there would be no real sense in requiring anything more from XP that that point.
Am I still not getting it, or is what I've written out what will be the defacto deal here?
From I've been told, this would be considered legit.Originally posted by: Aberforth
Originally posted by: John
I haven't had a chance to try this yet, but I assume it works.
*legally it doesn't
If your current OS is OEM and you install an upgrade, you may no longer use your old OS, and you may not transfer it.
http://download.microsoft.com/documents...6c019b-fa71-4fc9-a51d-a0621bddb153.pdf
Now if your OS is retail you may be allowed unlimited transfers after upgrading to the standard Vista upgrade (the non-anytime version). I shot an email off to Nick White who is the Product Manager at Microsoft working on the Windows Vista launch team for confirmation.
all of these versions and different policies is going to be a real nightmare in the months to come. I would bet they make drastic changes.
Lemon law
Lifer
- Nov 6, 2005
- 20,984
- 3
- 0
In my case I have a assumed legal version of XP pro I bought running in a used computer---see coa on case of computer--all dem letters that microsoft somehow checks before it lets me in to do upgrades. But I don't have the original install disk.---where I am?---presumably the microsoft Vista upgrade disk would read the existing XP pro version installed on computer ---and say its legit---but if it asks for the original install disk---am I screwed?---and even if I had the original install disk and it somehow became damaged or unreadable---would I not be in the same boat?
I have just never been in this situation before is why I ask?---I just have never experienced this exact situation and have no idea what roadblocks are presented in the install process.
I also then ask---say I do upgrade to some vista UPGRADE version and not full---and my harddrive suddenly craps out--and I do not have a full backup on tape or disk to read into the new hard drive---how do I then use the upgrade disk to reinstall vista---and even if I retained the original XP Upgrade install disks---which might have required win 98 or 95 to be installed, would it not be extremely comical for me to be required to install win 98--upgrade to xp and then upgrade to vista---when does this microsoft stupidity end?
And then another possibility exists--I have an old computer that still runs with a legit copy of XP home---and I have the install disk---but said PC has developed some problems and its not worth the costs of upgrading and fixing---which is why I bought the used XP pro system as a cheaper alternative---could I just use a Vista upgrade disk---and when it prompts me for an XP install disk--feed it the bought and paid for XP home disk---and would microsoft software then note its being fed a XP home install disk on a computer with XP pro is installed or just happily proceed to install an vista upgrade?---and if teh latter is true, could I then proceed to use the same OEM home XP number an infinire number of times with friends computers--friends who might want to beat microsoft out of the $100.00 or so EXTRA a full install license costs.----one should never underestimate or overestimate the possible stupidity of microsoft!
But in most of these cases---microsoft is not being ripped off---someone has purchased the legitimate license---surely there is a less onerous way for microsoft to fight total piracy.
I have just never been in this situation before is why I ask?---I just have never experienced this exact situation and have no idea what roadblocks are presented in the install process.
I also then ask---say I do upgrade to some vista UPGRADE version and not full---and my harddrive suddenly craps out--and I do not have a full backup on tape or disk to read into the new hard drive---how do I then use the upgrade disk to reinstall vista---and even if I retained the original XP Upgrade install disks---which might have required win 98 or 95 to be installed, would it not be extremely comical for me to be required to install win 98--upgrade to xp and then upgrade to vista---when does this microsoft stupidity end?
And then another possibility exists--I have an old computer that still runs with a legit copy of XP home---and I have the install disk---but said PC has developed some problems and its not worth the costs of upgrading and fixing---which is why I bought the used XP pro system as a cheaper alternative---could I just use a Vista upgrade disk---and when it prompts me for an XP install disk--feed it the bought and paid for XP home disk---and would microsoft software then note its being fed a XP home install disk on a computer with XP pro is installed or just happily proceed to install an vista upgrade?---and if teh latter is true, could I then proceed to use the same OEM home XP number an infinire number of times with friends computers--friends who might want to beat microsoft out of the $100.00 or so EXTRA a full install license costs.----one should never underestimate or overestimate the possible stupidity of microsoft!
But in most of these cases---microsoft is not being ripped off---someone has purchased the legitimate license---surely there is a less onerous way for microsoft to fight total piracy.
It seems that the real motivation here isn't to stop "piracy"--at least in the commonly understood sense.
It's to force people to buy at least one retail or OEM copy of Windows for each computer.
Previously, people could have bought a retail or OEM copy of Windows 98, then buy an upgrade to, say Windows XP. When they bought a second computer, and wanted to stay (generally) on the side of the law, they could go and buy an upgrade version of Windows XP and use the original Windows 98 CD to install XP. In this scenario, Microsoft only sells 1 retail version and 2 upgrade versions, rather than the 2 retail versions and 2 upgrade versions (or 2 retail and 1 upgrade version) that they could have sold.
It's all about maximizing revenue. And while it's not a big deal for corporations or others who buy enterprise licenses, it will be a fairly significant burden on individuals who have multiple computers at home. These geeks (everyone who reads Anandtech) generally have a lot influence over what family members, neighbors, etc. buy...
It seems like Microsoft is really scrounging for pennies here, and is ignoring how much this might cost them in the long run.
That's my $.02.
It's to force people to buy at least one retail or OEM copy of Windows for each computer.
Previously, people could have bought a retail or OEM copy of Windows 98, then buy an upgrade to, say Windows XP. When they bought a second computer, and wanted to stay (generally) on the side of the law, they could go and buy an upgrade version of Windows XP and use the original Windows 98 CD to install XP. In this scenario, Microsoft only sells 1 retail version and 2 upgrade versions, rather than the 2 retail versions and 2 upgrade versions (or 2 retail and 1 upgrade version) that they could have sold.
It's all about maximizing revenue. And while it's not a big deal for corporations or others who buy enterprise licenses, it will be a fairly significant burden on individuals who have multiple computers at home. These geeks (everyone who reads Anandtech) generally have a lot influence over what family members, neighbors, etc. buy...
It seems like Microsoft is really scrounging for pennies here, and is ignoring how much this might cost them in the long run.
That's my $.02.
blurredvision
Lifer
- Oct 19, 2000
- 17,860
- 4
- 81
According to Paul Thorrott's review on winsupersite.com, the fresh install with an upgrade disc will work the same as XP did. I can see no reason to do it any differently. I, for one, refuse to install XP, then do an in-place upgrade to put Vista over top of it. If it turns out that I have to buy a full version of the OS, then I'll be disappointed.
RebateMonger
Elite Member
- Dec 24, 2005
- 11,586
- 0
- 0
I just inserted my MS Action Pack DVD labeled "Microsoft Windows Vista Upgrade Business", restarted the laptop, and it booted to the Windows Vista Installer, which started running....
The bad news is that, a minute later, it blue-screened with the message:
"A problem has been detected and Windows has been shut down to prevent damage to your computer."
"The BIOS in this System is not fully ACPI-compliant. Please contact your system vendor for an updated version."
This is a two-year-old Toshiba Satellite M35X-S149 with 1.25GB of RAM and Celeron M 1.5GGz. It currently has XP Home (Toshiba's OEM version) installed.
Edit:
This could really suck. A look at Toshiba's Suport Site reveals that their IS no Vista-compatible BIOS update for my two-year-old Satellite! Hopefully just updating the BIOS to the latest version will fix the problem. Vista runs FINE inside a Virtual PC window on that same laptop.
Edit:
Well, good news and bad news. I was able to upgrade the Toshiba BIOS to version 1.90, which CLAIMS to be fully ACPI-compliant. I about had a heart attach when, rather than rebooting itself after finishing the BIOS upgrade, the PC simply DIED! No warnings, no nothing. It didn't look like the BIOS upgrade had completed. But when I rebooted, it's now showing version 1.90 and is working.
The bad news is that I'm still getting the same error message from Vista. The Installer blue screens. :disgust: Microsoft's Vista Upgrade Advisor sees no problem with my Toshiba laptop.
Hope Toshiba issues a BIOS update....or no Vista for my laptop. From what I see on Toshiba's Support site, there may be a LOT of Toshiba lappies that won't upgrade unless Toshiba starts pumping out new BIOS versions.
The bad news is that, a minute later, it blue-screened with the message:
"A problem has been detected and Windows has been shut down to prevent damage to your computer."
"The BIOS in this System is not fully ACPI-compliant. Please contact your system vendor for an updated version."
This is a two-year-old Toshiba Satellite M35X-S149 with 1.25GB of RAM and Celeron M 1.5GGz. It currently has XP Home (Toshiba's OEM version) installed.
Edit:
This could really suck. A look at Toshiba's Suport Site reveals that their IS no Vista-compatible BIOS update for my two-year-old Satellite! Hopefully just updating the BIOS to the latest version will fix the problem. Vista runs FINE inside a Virtual PC window on that same laptop.
Edit:
Well, good news and bad news. I was able to upgrade the Toshiba BIOS to version 1.90, which CLAIMS to be fully ACPI-compliant. I about had a heart attach when, rather than rebooting itself after finishing the BIOS upgrade, the PC simply DIED! No warnings, no nothing. It didn't look like the BIOS upgrade had completed. But when I rebooted, it's now showing version 1.90 and is working.
The bad news is that I'm still getting the same error message from Vista. The Installer blue screens. :disgust: Microsoft's Vista Upgrade Advisor sees no problem with my Toshiba laptop.
Hope Toshiba issues a BIOS update....or no Vista for my laptop. From what I see on Toshiba's Support site, there may be a LOT of Toshiba lappies that won't upgrade unless Toshiba starts pumping out new BIOS versions.
aimforsilence
Member
- Jan 14, 2007
- 123
- 0
- 76
i've called Microsoft myself and they say you can still clean install but it will prompt you to pop in an XP or 2000 CD. also read it on a website.
http://www.winsupersite.com/reviews/winvista_03.asp
http://www.winsupersite.com/reviews/winvista_03.asp
aimforsilence
Member
- Jan 14, 2007
- 123
- 0
- 76
what do you mean?
spending 50 bucks?
I already own Windows XP... and i'll be buying vista HP upgrade?
what 50 bucks?
and i have called Microsoft about the upgrade clean install.. and they say it'll be the same way as it was with xp.. thus it'll prompt you for the cd to verify you own a FULL xp version.
spending 50 bucks?
I already own Windows XP... and i'll be buying vista HP upgrade?
what 50 bucks?
and i have called Microsoft about the upgrade clean install.. and they say it'll be the same way as it was with xp.. thus it'll prompt you for the cd to verify you own a FULL xp version.
The sad thing is not all MS reps are knowledgable, and we seem to have conflicting stories.
1) Vista upgrade can be used for a clean install
2) Vista upgrade requires XP to be preinstalled
Until I receive my upgrade I am going to refrain from making further assumptions.
1) Vista upgrade can be used for a clean install
2) Vista upgrade requires XP to be preinstalled
Until I receive my upgrade I am going to refrain from making further assumptions.
aimforsilence
Member
- Jan 14, 2007
- 123
- 0
- 76
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