Chipping away at Christmas

Number1

Diamond Member
Feb 24, 2006
7,881
549
126
I agree wholeheartedly with this guy's point of view.

From The National Post:

WORKING Link



Every year at about this time, there is a new batch of news stories detailing how the forces of political correctness and atheism are attempting to stamp out all public references to Christmas.
The same people behind turning your neighbourhood school?s Christmas concert into a Winter Family Festival would be appalled by the arrogance of any small band of Christians seeking to expunge all references to Diwali ? the Hindu festival of lights ? from public institutions in New Delhi or public mentions of Ramadan in Riyadh. Still, they cannot see the arrogance of their own attempts to impose minority secularist beliefs on the mainstream culture in Toronto or Regina or Halifax.

Typically, they explain away their actions as efforts to protect non-Christians from being offended by overt references to a distinctly Christian festival. But whether or not they will admit it, their campaigns are nearly always selfish attempts to shield themselves from messages and symbols they dislike. The feelings of non-Christians are typically nothing more than a cover.

Indeed, non-Christians are seldom behind movements to have Nativity scenes pulled from public squares, Christmas carols replaced with holiday songs or ?Merry Christmas? substituted with ?Season?s Greetings.? The culprits are most often anti-Christians ? people of little or no faith who have grown tired of all the jollity and goodwill this time of year.
Elsewhere this week, I wrote about this same subject ? the annual efforts to chip away at Christmas. My piece provoked many strong, negative responses, typical of which was one I received from a reader in Edmonton who wondered why she and her family ?have to be confronted with all this Christmas crap everywhere we go??

Well, you?re confronted with it because it is a free country. No one (thankfully) can make the malls and department stores stop hanging wreathes and playing canned Christmas tunes, just as no one (thankfully) can prevent my cranky correspondent from venting her disgust.

Her belief, though, that she should be able to live her life without ever confronting ?Christmas crap,? is typical of the obnoxiousness of modern human rights thinking. It holds that certain favoured groups should never face messages with which they disagree. This has led to the distorted notion among members of politically correct groups that they will never be truly free until people with whom they disagree are made to shut up, or at least relegated to speaking their minds only in private.

No doubt my atheist e-mailer views herself as a paragon of tolerance, the epitome of enlightenment. And I am certain it is difficult to live one?s beliefs (or lack thereof) when the culture all around is giddy with Christmas spirit.
But just imagine how devoted Christian, Muslim and Jewish parents feel when trying to keep their children chaste in a culture soaked through with sexual messaging and imagery.

In a society that values free expression, we all have to put up with views with which we disagree, sometimes overwhelming views. That?s the true meaning of tolerance.

A lot of modern rights advocates have convinced themselves that tolerance means agreement and affirmation, not merely acceptance. That?s a great theory until someone in authority ? such as human rights commissioners ? has the power to establish a hierarchy of tolerance and your views are on the bottom rung.
Tolerance means exactly putting up with all the Christmas crap and Hanukkah crap and Kwanza crap and even atheist crap, so that others will put up with whatever crap is your crap, too.

Campaigns to forbid candy canes from schools (because they represent the shepherd?s crook and Jesus was the shepherd and so candy canes are religious symbols) or to remove Christmas lights from the trees and buildings in public squares may seem tolerant, when in truth they are merely the latest form of intolerance.
The notion that these campaigns are altruistic efforts to shelter sensitive non-Christians from the theological imperialism of the dominant culture around them is just the latest excuse the intolerant minority is using to impose its own secular theology on the rest of us.

So here is an act of sedition: Merry Christmas.

And while we?re at it: Peace on Earth and goodwill toward all people.
National Post
lgunter@shaw.ca
 

Martin

Lifer
Jan 15, 2000
29,178
1
81
Is there anything more annoying during this time of year than the armies of victimized whiny ass bitches bemoaning imaginary attacks on their stupid fucking cosmic-zombie-jew-who-is-his-own-father holiday? Aren't you people too busy doing chrismassy things like shopping until your legs just can't carry you any longer?
 

Red Squirrel

No Lifer
May 24, 2003
70,776
13,869
126
www.anyf.ca
I purposely write Christmas anywhere I can.

I had to send out an IT notice to all employees, I put "Merry Christmas / Joyeux Noel" at the end. Mind you it's not as bad here for that. If I pulled that off in the states I'd probably be fired on the spot and they'd do a server shutdown to restore a backup before everyone sees it.
 

TridenT

Lifer
Sep 4, 2006
16,800
45
91
Originally posted by: Number1
I agree wholeheartedly with this guy's point of view.

From The National Post:

http://network.nationalpost.co...ed=true#commentmessage">Lorne Gunter: Chipping away at Christmas</a>

Every year at about this time, there is a new batch of news stories detailing how the forces of political correctness and atheism are attempting to stamp out all public references to Christmas.
The same people behind turning your neighbourhood school?s Christmas concert into a Winter Family Festival would be appalled by the arrogance of any small band of Christians seeking to expunge all references to Diwali ? the Hindu festival of lights ? from public institutions in New Delhi or public mentions of Ramadan in Riyadh. Still, they cannot see the arrogance of their own attempts to impose minority secularist beliefs on the mainstream culture in Toronto or Regina or Halifax.

Typically, they explain away their actions as efforts to protect non-Christians from being offended by overt references to a distinctly Christian festival. But whether or not they will admit it, their campaigns are nearly always selfish attempts to shield themselves from messages and symbols they dislike. The feelings of non-Christians are typically nothing more than a cover.

Indeed, non-Christians are seldom behind movements to have Nativity scenes pulled from public squares, Christmas carols replaced with holiday songs or ?Merry Christmas? substituted with ?Season?s Greetings.? The culprits are most often anti-Christians ? people of little or no faith who have grown tired of all the jollity and goodwill this time of year.
Elsewhere this week, I wrote about this same subject ? the annual efforts to chip away at Christmas. My piece provoked many strong, negative responses, typical of which was one I received from a reader in Edmonton who wondered why she and her family ?have to be confronted with all this Christmas crap everywhere we go??

Well, you?re confronted with it because it is a free country. No one (thankfully) can make the malls and department stores stop hanging wreathes and playing canned Christmas tunes, just as no one (thankfully) can prevent my cranky correspondent from venting her disgust.

Her belief, though, that she should be able to live her life without ever confronting ?Christmas crap,? is typical of the obnoxiousness of modern human rights thinking. It holds that certain favoured groups should never face messages with which they disagree. This has led to the distorted notion among members of politically correct groups that they will never be truly free until people with whom they disagree are made to shut up, or at least relegated to speaking their minds only in private.

No doubt my atheist e-mailer views herself as a paragon of tolerance, the epitome of enlightenment. And I am certain it is difficult to live one?s beliefs (or lack thereof) when the culture all around is giddy with Christmas spirit.
But just imagine how devoted Christian, Muslim and Jewish parents feel when trying to keep their children chaste in a culture soaked through with sexual messaging and imagery.

In a society that values free expression, we all have to put up with views with which we disagree, sometimes overwhelming views. That?s the true meaning of tolerance.

A lot of modern rights advocates have convinced themselves that tolerance means agreement and affirmation, not merely acceptance. That?s a great theory until someone in authority ? such as human rights commissioners ? has the power to establish a hierarchy of tolerance and your views are on the bottom rung.
Tolerance means exactly putting up with all the Christmas crap and Hanukkah crap and Kwanza crap and even atheist crap, so that others will put up with whatever crap is your crap, too.

Campaigns to forbid candy canes from schools (because they represent the shepherd?s crook and Jesus was the shepherd and so candy canes are religious symbols) or to remove Christmas lights from the trees and buildings in public squares may seem tolerant, when in truth they are merely the latest form of intolerance.
The notion that these campaigns are altruistic efforts to shelter sensitive non-Christians from the theological imperialism of the dominant culture around them is just the latest excuse the intolerant minority is using to impose its own secular theology on the rest of us.

So here is an act of sedition: Merry Christmas.

And while we?re at it: Peace on Earth and goodwill toward all people.
National Post
lgunter@shaw.ca

I am intolerant of all religious festivals, period! I am not just anti-christian. :p

I wouldn't mind if Christmas was never about anything dealing with religion, but it still is.
 

Fenixgoon

Lifer
Jun 30, 2003
33,419
13,041
136
christmas is just as much a secular holiday as it is a religious ones these days. people need to quit their bitchin' and take some time to eat, drink, and be merry. it's like thanksgiving part2, but longer and with gifts.
 

IronWing

No Lifer
Jul 20, 2001
73,175
34,502
136
Originally posted by: Fenixgoon
christmas is just as much a secular holiday as it is a religious ones these days. people need to quit their bitchin' and take some time to eat, drink, and be merry. it's like thanksgiving part2, but longer and with gifts.

This is why turkey ham was invented. Kill two birds with one stone.
 

Fenixgoon

Lifer
Jun 30, 2003
33,419
13,041
136
Originally posted by: ironwing
Originally posted by: Fenixgoon
christmas is just as much a secular holiday as it is a religious ones these days. people need to quit their bitchin' and take some time to eat, drink, and be merry. it's like thanksgiving part2, but longer and with gifts.

This is why turkey ham was invented. Kill two birds with one stone.

what about my christmas goose? :p
 

IronWing

No Lifer
Jul 20, 2001
73,175
34,502
136
Originally posted by: Fenixgoon
Originally posted by: ironwing
Originally posted by: Fenixgoon
christmas is just as much a secular holiday as it is a religious ones these days. people need to quit their bitchin' and take some time to eat, drink, and be merry. it's like thanksgiving part2, but longer and with gifts.

This is why turkey ham was invented. Kill two birds with one stone.

what about my christmas goose? :p

Turkamoose?
 

sourceninja

Diamond Member
Mar 8, 2005
8,805
65
91
You know what really pisses me off? Anti-Santa people. I freaking love santa. He was my hero as a child. Yet all this christians keep trying to take santa away from me.

I'm starting a new campaign.... "Put the HO back in Christmas!"

Who's with me?
 

IronWing

No Lifer
Jul 20, 2001
73,175
34,502
136
Originally posted by: sourceninja
You know what really pisses me off? Anti-Santa people. I freaking love santa. He was my hero as a child. Yet all this christians keep trying to take santa away from me.

I'm starting a new campaign.... "Put the HO back in XXXmas!"

Who's with me?

Fixed
 
S

SlitheryDee

I agree. I'm no christian and I put up with christmas just fine. People need to get over the whole "I can't be exposed to harmless things which run counter to my personal views" notion. At the same time I understand and agree with the people who are just trying to make the government religion-neutral. These people seem to get a bit overzealous at times, though. Most people LIKE christmas whether they're religious or not. What is the big deal here?
 
Oct 4, 2004
10,515
6
81
Typically, they explain away their actions as efforts to protect non-Christians from being offended by overt references to a distinctly Christian festival.

Seriously, that's the reason Happy Holidays caught on? I keep reading this explanation time & again but I always thought 'Happy Holidays' is more of a celebration of the whole season (like how Muslims might say Ramadan Kareem) and 'Merry Christmas' was a greeting reserved for the actual day (similar to Id Mubarak for Muslims).

I live in India and I don't feel 'offended' when the other 37 religious holidays come around. Offended? What a stupid explanation.
 

TridenT

Lifer
Sep 4, 2006
16,800
45
91
Originally posted by: SlitheryDee
I agree. I'm no christian and I put up with christmas just fine. People need to get over the whole "I can't be exposed to harmless things which run counter to my personal views" notion. At the same time I understand and agree with the people who are just trying to make the government religion-neutral. These people seem to get a bit overzealous at times, though. Most people LIKE christmas whether they're religious or not. What is the big deal here?

Less religious festivals = less religion.

That's my view.
 

IronWing

No Lifer
Jul 20, 2001
73,175
34,502
136
In real life I have yet to meet a someone who gets their undies in a knot over "Merry Christmas". I have met several people who whine about "Happy Holidays".
 

sourceninja

Diamond Member
Mar 8, 2005
8,805
65
91
I simply long to live in a society where I can be an open christian and without stigma. Wouldn't it be great one day if a christian could be open and allowed to do something like hold government office or teach our children? Maybe even one day we can have a openly christian president.
 

IronWing

No Lifer
Jul 20, 2001
73,175
34,502
136
Originally posted by: sourceninja
I simply long to live in a society where I can be an open christian and without stigma. Wouldn't it be great one day if a christian could be open and allowed to do something like hold government office or teach our children? Maybe even one day we can have a openly christian president.

...who acted according to the values preached by Christ, within the context of the Constitution, that would be sweet.
 

TridenT

Lifer
Sep 4, 2006
16,800
45
91
Originally posted by: ironwing
Originally posted by: sourceninja
I simply long to live in a society where I can be an open christian and without stigma. Wouldn't it be great one day if a christian could be open and allowed to do something like hold government office or teach our children? Maybe even one day we can have a openly christian president.

...who acted according to the values preached by Christ, within the context of the Constitution, that would be sweet.

You mean, a person who is pro-life, and all that bullshit?

Hell-no.

Why not an atheist president? Agnostic at least! Of course, what they believe does not mean they would be good at their job ;)
 

IronWing

No Lifer
Jul 20, 2001
73,175
34,502
136
Originally posted by: TridenTBoy3555
Originally posted by: ironwing
Originally posted by: sourceninja
I simply long to live in a society where I can be an open christian and without stigma. Wouldn't it be great one day if a christian could be open and allowed to do something like hold government office or teach our children? Maybe even one day we can have a openly christian president.

...who acted according to the values preached by Christ, within the context of the Constitution, that would be sweet.

You mean, a person who is pro-life, and all that bullshit?

Hell-no.

Why not an atheist president? Agnostic at least! Of course, what they believe does not mean they would be good at their job ;)

Jesus never mentioned fetii. His only statement about kids was "Suffer little children".