• Guest, The rules for the P & N subforum have been updated to prohibit "ad hominem" or personal attacks against other posters. See the full details in the post "Politics and News Rules & Guidelines."

[chiphell] kepler rumors suggest 15% better than 580.. price and transistors

IonusX

Senior member
Dec 25, 2011
392
0
0
CHH has ehard some disturbing rumors. if true kepler will be a joke vs tahiti and probably be a really painful pill to swallow:
the Nvidia keynote speech at CES involved a slideshow. anyway folks from czech tech site OBR have forwarded the kepler shots, and well.. here comes to painful bit, kepler (if this rings true) is nvidia's bulldozer. price tag at launch of $400 and 3.2bllion transistors. doing the rough math kepler's gk104 should be about 10-15% better than a 580, a far cry from the 30-50% tahiti xt is.
http://www.chiphell.com/thread-342744-1-1.html
lets hope and pray nvidia doesnt do that mmk..
 

BallaTheFeared

Diamond Member
Nov 15, 2010
8,115
0
71
30-50%? What benchmarks have you been viewing?

All signs point to 20% for 7970 over 580, and the gk104 isn't even the top chip.

10-15% puts it right there with the 7970, while being Nvidia's "Mainstream" option.
 

railven

Diamond Member
Mar 25, 2010
6,604
560
126
Am I the only one that sees something NOT wrong with this?

$400 price tag and 10-15% faster than a GTX 580? That's a win! At least I see it as one. And isn't this not the top end Kepler?

Eitherway, if it launches at $400 and is at most 10% faster than a GTX 580, I'd buy that for my GF in a heart beat.
 

MrTeal

Diamond Member
Dec 7, 2003
3,108
778
136
Why would that be a joke? GK104 isn't competing against Tahati XT, GK100 is. $400 vs $550, 3.2B vs 4.3B. Not sure how you did your rough math, but assuming that table is correct, wouldn't 12.5% more CUDA cores and 17.5% higher clocks vs 580 give much more than 10-15% over the GTX580?
 

bryanW1995

Lifer
May 22, 2007
11,143
32
91
Who says that tahiti xt is 30-50% faster on average thn gtx 580? From looking at W1zzard's testing, I'd say that 19% is very generous as that only reflects 2560x1600, and 30-50% is a ridiculous stretch.

Why would that be a joke? GK104 isn't competing against Tahati XT, GK100 is. $400 vs $550, 3.2B vs 4.3B. Not sure how you did your rough math, but assuming that table is correct, wouldn't 12.5% more CUDA cores and 17.5% higher clocks vs 580 give much more than 10-15% over the GTX580?
No, if those posted stats are legit, then 10-15% faster than gtx 580 looks pretty reasonable.
 

rUmX

Senior member
Feb 13, 2001
536
19
81
Pretty sure he meant when highly overclocked, if we go by the overclocked [H] Eyefinity results.
 

railven

Diamond Member
Mar 25, 2010
6,604
560
126
I plan on buying a HD 7970 once the right custom cooler is out the OCing it to the brink of meltdown (I'm kidding :p) which should net me on avearage 80% over my HD 5870, and hopefully last me another 2 years (I can accept having to set the slider to medium in late 2013, that's if the world hasn't ended by then.)

The GF is running on a GTX 460 SC, a GTX580+10% faster GTX 670 (my guess what they'd name it) would be easily in the 105-110+% range in terms of performance gain, for $400? Oh yeah, I'd be all over that for her. Unless GTX 580 gets slashed to <$300, only then would I not consider holding out for a Kepler.
 

blackened23

Diamond Member
Jul 26, 2011
8,548
1
0
shader frequencies got RAPED. I don't see how they're going to make it 10&#37; faster than the GTX 580, they'll be lucky if so.

Are you looking at the shader frequencies? Thats a large DOWNGRADE from Fermi. Guess they're not doing so well with the loss of hotclocking.
 

blackened23

Diamond Member
Jul 26, 2011
8,548
1
0
You guys should also run these articles through google chrome translator. Read everything there.

From the rumors i'm reading, It will be priced higher than GTX 580 is what i'm gathering. They only put the price of GTX 570 there for comparison, at 399$.

And this is still the fake slide purported from yesterday. They're saying these slides came from CES when this slide has been around for a week at least? Fake.

Morning, the just-concluded NVIDIA CES keynote CEO Jen-Hsun Huang did not disclose on GeForce / Quadro / Tesla-related news. But it's not naturally there are other official sources, the Czech Republic today has released an OBR next generation NVIDIA core-side main GK104 Kepler detailed specifications chart.
This slide is not from CES. Not official. Nothing about kepler was presented.
 
Last edited:

railven

Diamond Member
Mar 25, 2010
6,604
560
126
You guys should also run these articles through google chrome translator. Read everything there.

It will be priced higher than GTX 580 is what i'm gathering. They only put the price of GTX 570 there for comparison, at 399$.
How much more than a GTX 580? Because if it's 10-15% faster and MORE than a GTX 580 - that's into HD 7970, which is 19% in the above comparative.
 

BallaTheFeared

Diamond Member
Nov 15, 2010
8,115
0
71
You guys should also run these articles through google chrome translator. Read everything there.

From the rumors i'm reading, It will be priced higher than GTX 580 is what i'm gathering. They only put the price of GTX 570 there for comparison, at 399$.

And this is still the fake slide purported from yesterday. They're saying these slides came from CES when this slide has been around for a week at least? Fake.
You get something from that? Honestly I think it's easier to read when it's in Chinese.


But it's not naturally there are other official sources, the Czech Republic today has released an OBR next generation NVIDIA core-side main GK104 Kepler detailed specifications chart.
Wut?
 

blackened23

Diamond Member
Jul 26, 2011
8,548
1
0
How much more than a GTX 580? Because if it's 10-15&#37; faster and MORE than a GTX 580 - that's into HD 7970, which is 19% in the above comparative.
Well it doesn't matter since its a fake.

Source isn't nvidia, its some CZ source that says its from CES.

Only problem is, this slide has been around for a long time and isn't from CES.

FAKE.'

these slides should just be banned, because without exception -- every AMD and nvidia slide i've ever seen turned out to be fake. Prove me wrong, name one that was ever legit.
 

MrTeal

Diamond Member
Dec 7, 2003
3,108
778
136
Well, I'm just going on the text saying that the core and shaders run at the same frequency as being plain wrong. Even with the extra cores and texture units, with 75&#37; of the geometry engines and running the shaders at 900MHz vs 1500MHz it would be pretty tough to beat a GTX580 by 15%.
 

bunnyfubbles

Lifer
Sep 3, 2001
12,248
3
0
CHH has ehard some disturbing rumors. if true kepler will be a joke vs tahiti and probably be a really painful pill to swallow:
the Nvidia keynote speech at CES involved a slideshow. anyway folks from czech tech site OBR have forwarded the kepler shots, and well.. here comes to painful bit, kepler (if this rings true) is nvidia's bulldozer. price tag at launch of $400 and 3.2bllion transistors. doing the rough math kepler's gk104 should be about 10-15% better than a 580, a far cry from the 30-50% tahiti xt is.
http://www.chiphell.com/thread-342744-1-1.html
lets hope and pray nvidia doesnt do that mmk..
uh, GK104 would be analogous to the GF104 or GF114 which were the GTX460 and 560 respectively, ie not the top end GPU. If GK104 is 10-15% faster than the 580 that would be excellent news for nVidia as it would mean their upper midrange part (ie GTX 760) is likely as fast as a 7950 and would imply that their true flagship (ie GTX 780/785) is going to be a monster performer
 

boxleitnerb

Platinum Member
Nov 1, 2011
2,597
1
81
^this. People should read more carefully. GK104 should be between 300 and 400mm2. When was that ever Nvidias top dog?
 

Riek

Senior member
Dec 16, 2008
409
14
76
uh, GK104 would be analogous to the GF104 or GF114 which were the GTX460 and 560 respectively, ie not the top end GPU. If GK104 is 10-15&#37; faster than the 580 that would be excellent news for nVidia as it would mean their upper midrange part (ie GTX 760) is likely as fast as a 7950 and would imply that their true flagship (ie GTX 780/785) is going to be a monster performer
104 is replacement of 570, 106 of 560 and 107 of 550.

The direct competitor will be the 7950 which will be ~10% slower then the 7970? which would be just below the hypothetical rumoured 104 performance point.
If they can release it as the same time they are back in business, if they can only launch it after AMD launched the 78xx they will get a serious hit imo.

AMD topdog will be 7990 which will come in at around ~50% above 590. So hopefully the 104 has similar power characteristics as the 79xx series so might do a (6)(7)85 or so. (I mention the dual gpu solution of AMD because that is where AMD focus is on the performance segment. They don't focus on having the highest single gpu solution.
 
Last edited:

Crap Daddy

Senior member
May 6, 2011
610
0
0
104 is replacement of 570, 106 of 560 and 107 of 550.

The direct competitor will be the 7950 which will be ~10% slower then the 7970? If they can release it as the same time they are back in business, if they can only launch it after AMD launched the 78xx they will get a serious hit imo.

AMD topdog will be 7990 which will come in at around ~50% above 590. So hopefully the 104 has similar power characteristics as the 79xx series so might do a 685 or so.
It should be the replacement for the 560Ti/460 which is GF114/104 and the replacement for 570/580 will probably be GK100 in two variants but this will come later in Q2 as rumored. If the 7950 will be 10% slower than the 7970 at 400$ then the 7970 is way too expensive, what most of us agreed from the start. If this GK104 is 10-15% faster than the GTX580 then it should surpass the 7950 and come close to AMD flagship.
 

Quantos

Senior member
Dec 23, 2011
386
0
76
Wait, now I'm confused. Is there any confirmation what exactly GK104 is supposed to replace? At $400 it technically would replace the 570, but in naming it would be logical that it replaces the 560. The question is: is there anything more than rumors about either the $400 price point?

Now, keep in mind that as far as we know, there's still a few months before any of this shows up, and that in the mean time, AMD is alone. Also, some of you keep referring to AMD's current prices, which are based on the 7xxx's performance in comparison to Nvidia's current products! Saying something like: "Well the current price of AMD's products is way too high compared to Nvidia's unreleased, unseen, future product!" This is just plain wrong. Yes, comparison of performance is good, but comparison of price cannot be made unless you acknowledge that AMD's current pricing are irrelevant to the subject.
 

BallaTheFeared

Diamond Member
Nov 15, 2010
8,115
0
71
It might come out ahead of the 570 and 580, then reduce in price, or the 570 might be $550+ and the 580 will be $700+...

If that's the case I won't be buying from either side, I'd rather keep what I have until it dies/becomes obsolete then move to consoles because I'm not spending that kind of money for pc gaming.
 

bunnyfubbles

Lifer
Sep 3, 2001
12,248
3
0
yeah, don't get too caught up on price points, as a whole the high end pricing seems to be going up, so that means every other tier will be going up as well, as well as seeing new tiers added in altogether

the GK104 is the same tier that the GF104/114 occupied, ie right below GK100 or GF100/110. So even though the GK104 might end up pricing out @ $400 and thus be more in line as a direct performance alternative to the GTX570/580 doesn't mean it isn't a different tier, its still the #2 GPU behind GK100.

Same goes for the 7900s, they're priced well above the 6900s, so its just common sense to assume the 7800s will occupy a much higher pricing tier than the 6800s and be more of a direct performance replacement to the 6900s.
 

AtenRa

Lifer
Feb 2, 2009
13,597
2,689
126
GK104 should replace the GF114 both in price and performance, meaning $200-299 price point and GTX570/580 performance.
 

Riek

Senior member
Dec 16, 2008
409
14
76
How is saying the 104 replaces the GF114? I have seen nothing official about it and the unofficial rumoured leaks point that 104 follows the 570 not the 560. (roadmap rumoured leak). So i don't know where people make that assosciation? (i hope its not because they both end with 4..?)
 

ASK THE COMMUNITY