China's economy sucks

Amplifier

Banned
Dec 25, 2004
3,143
0
0
It's hard to turn on the TV without some asshole like Pat Buchanan or some other inbred alarmist going on and on about the Chinese economic "revolution". Let's keep this short and sweet: China's economy sucks. It has always sucked, and it will never compete with the US. Their GDP per capital only recently broke $1,000 per year. Let that sink in, American's earn over 30 times as much as the Chinese.

But if you ask the Chinese press they'll be sure to give you a laundry list of excuses. Let me cut through their nonsense.

People can live for less in China. What constitutes as living in China would be considered extreme poverty in the US. And what do these people do when they want a fungible good such as oil. Answer: They ride a bike. It's the same bullsht the French try to pull when they justify earning 40% less than the US.

China's GDP is growing so fast! And a weakling can double their bench press from 20 to 40 pretty quick too. The Chinese economy has been so mismanaged by their government that all they need to do for quick boast in their economy is to do anything different. When you see a 'flood of investment' it's because China has held off foreign investment until recently. There is more potential than in an established market, nothing more.

But the government provides services (*insert socialist bullsht*). No they don't. And they are notorious for violating human rights. Chinese people hate their government, they just don't have a George Washington or Ben Franklin to watch their backs.


But Amp you aren't from China how can you know that their economy is so bad!? Simple, there is a huge waiting list for people who want to come to the US from China. What does that say? China sucks. You don't need to take my word for it, the people vote with their immigration numbers.

And while we're at it, people talk about a trade deficit, what about the immigration deficit? There are very few skilled Chinese workers who want to stay in China. They know that American's will pay them much more. If we were smart, we'd throw our xenophobia or immigrationphobia to the side and take in EVERY skilled Chinese worker. Is there a better way to take the legs out from a competing team than to steal their best players?

The point most of you might wonder about is will China ever compete with the US economically. Technically they have the talent, resources, and numbers to become an economic force, but don't worry it won't happen.

1) They have very few intellectual property rights. The incentive to innovate isn't as high as in America or Europe.
2) They have horrible human rights. As long as this is the case, people will desire to leave China for America/Europe.
3) Some of the best Chinese minds want to come America. It doesn't work the other way around.
4) At current rates, China won't catch up to the US until most of us are retired. Assuming growth rates stay the same, and they won't.
5) Communist countries have never, in the history of the world, competed with a capitalist republic for any length of time. The USSR tried the whole "Build up the infrastructure with government factories". Are you really worried that China is trying the same thing?

So there you have it, China's economy is about as scary as a panda in a zoo. Should the government ever be overthrown and replaced with a republic similar to the US they will thrive economically (Iraq isn't a republic yet). But if that happens I'm not worried because we'll have a peaceful trade partner. When was the last major war America had with an established free democracy?
 

dmcowen674

No Lifer
Oct 13, 1999
54,889
47
91
www.alienbabeltech.com
Originally posted by: Amplifier
So there you have it, China's economy is about as scary as a panda in a zoo. Should the government ever be overthrown and replaced with a republic similar to the US they will thrive economically (Iraq isn't a republic yet). But if that happens I'm not worried because we'll have a peaceful trade partner. When was the last major war America had with an established free democracy?

Money talks, Bullsh!t walks

With more money than the U.S. it will be cake for them to kick our collective sheeple A$$
 

azazyel

Diamond Member
Oct 6, 2000
5,872
1
81
Just because China operates mostly with close to slave labor wages doesn't mean they aren't well off economically. They just don't care about their people. They still have the monetary capital to wield significant political power. As well, of those people who want to come to the US, how many are allowed to leave?
 

Genx87

Lifer
Apr 8, 2002
41,091
513
126
Their economy is moving along at a nice pace. But at some time the old chains of communism or their new found love of corporate fascism will bog them down.

 

Strk

Lifer
Nov 23, 2003
10,197
4
76
Originally posted by: Genx87
Their economy is moving along at a nice pace. But at some time the old chains of communism or their new found love of corporate fascism will bog them down.

Their economy is moving along at a nice pace, but like Amplifier said, it's hard not to when you're coming out of abysmal.
 

azazyel

Diamond Member
Oct 6, 2000
5,872
1
81
Oh and what incentive would American companies have to have them work here when we are getting our product produced there for a fraction of what it would cost to produce it here?
 

Fern

Elite Member
Sep 30, 2003
26,907
174
106
Originally posted by: Amplifier
5) Communist countries have never, in the history of the world, competed with a capitalist republic for any length of time. The USSR tried the whole "Build up the infrastructure with government factories". Are you really worried that China is trying the same thing?

So there you have it, China's economy is about as scary as a panda in a zoo. Should the government ever be overthrown and replaced with a republic similar to the US they will thrive economically (Iraq isn't a republic yet). But if that happens I'm not worried because we'll have a peaceful trade partner. When was the last major war America had with an established free democracy?

You make some very good points.

Reminds me of Reagan & Gorbachev back in the day. Peeps were always talking about how powerful the USSR was etc.

Well, I lived in West Berlin back when the wall was there and the USSR was supposed to be a "threat". All it took was one trip to the "other side" to see how weak they really were. Everything on the communist side was run-down, out-of-repair. The products in stores were sparse and of low quality. Restaurants were a joke, it took a ridiculous number of employees to do anything, even then it was slow and inefficient. The food sucked big time. The few places that were actually open had very long lines etc.

I entered into the Eastern block with about $20 exchanged into their currency. After about 12 hrs I just gave most of the money away and went back home.

The only thing I took away from the trip was the knowlegde that they weren't a threat (despite what the US Intellegence Service asserted) and that they were likely to collapse.

Fern



 

ntdz

Diamond Member
Aug 5, 2004
6,989
0
0
China's GDP might be growing, but much of it is from foreign companies, including US companies. I think a better comparison would be how their GNP is growing, I bet ours is growing at a comparable rate to theirs.
 

MiniDoom

Diamond Member
Jan 5, 2004
5,305
0
76
Originally posted by: Accipiter22
umm.....1000 bucks a year there gets you a house, yard, food, utilities.....

Yep, lots of people jumping the fence to get into China.
 

techs

Lifer
Sep 26, 2000
28,559
4
0
Originally posted by: ntdz
China's GDP might be growing, but much of it is from foreign companies, including US companies. I think a better comparison would be how their GNP is growing, I bet ours is growing at a comparable rate to theirs.
Once again you are AMAZINGLY wrong. It is probably your total lack of knowledge which is the cause for your amazingly wrong posts.
You wish what you say is true. And therefore you think its true.
You are really showing your ignorance with this post.

btw how much you want to bet?
I am just astounded by your total lack of knowledge. If you are an example of the youth of America we are so screwed.

 

RichardE

Banned
Dec 31, 2005
10,246
2
0
Originally posted by: techs
Originally posted by: ntdz
China's GDP might be growing, but much of it is from foreign companies, including US companies. I think a better comparison would be how their GNP is growing, I bet ours is growing at a comparable rate to theirs.
Once again you are AMAZINGLY wrong. It is probably your total lack of knowledge which is the cause for your amazingly wrong posts.
You wish what you say is true. And therefore you think its true.
You are really showing your ignorance with this post.

btw how much you want to bet?
I am just astounded by your total lack of knowledge. If you are an example of the youth of America we are so screwed.

hmm...stats before you rip people apart?

Edit: I know you are right, but I would like to see the stats, and if also, the spending power of the two countries compared, since that is what effects us the most.
 

JacobJ

Banned
Mar 20, 2003
1,140
0
0
Originally posted by: Amplifier
Communist countries have never, in the history of the world, competed with a capitalist republic for any length of time.
You have no idea what you're talking about and this statement proves it.

China is far, far, far from being a communist country anymore. They are rapidly capitalizing many parts of their country. They may control/own/strongarm private companies operating in their countries but that is not communism. (A chinaman might say that the US government does quite a bit of controlling/strongarming itself).

When Bill Gates lectures their, he fills stadiums. Young children climb the rafters just to listen to him.

It is a country where there is a lot of desire to become successful.

You dismiss the whole "human rights" thing as a black and white issue. From a Chinese perspective, it is anything but.

Yes China is growing.

But I agree that their really is no reason to be scared. They are expanding economically and culturally more so than militaristically.
 

JEDIYoda

Lifer
Jul 13, 2005
33,986
3,321
126
Originally posted by: JacobJ
Originally posted by: Amplifier
Communist countries have never, in the history of the world, competed with a capitalist republic for any length of time.
You have no idea what you're talking about and this statement proves it.

China is far, far, far from being a communist country anymore. They are rapidly capitalizing many parts of their country. They may control/own/strongarm private companies operating in their countries but that is not communism. (A chinaman might say that the US government does quite a bit of controlling/strongarming itself).

When Bill Gates lectures their, he fills stadiums. Young children climb the rafters just to listen to him.

It is a country where there is a lot of desire to become successful.

You dismiss the whole "human rights" thing as a black and white issue. From a Chinese perspective, it is anything but.

Yes China is growing.

But I agree that their really is no reason to be scared. They are expanding economically and culturally more so than militaristically.

I remember reading about the Korean war....
Concerning China....
We all know the reasons the US retreated with there tales between there leggs to the 68th parrallel.....

Anyways somebody mentioned to the person in power in China at the time concerning our nuclear weapons...
The Chinese premier was heard to respond....
We will still win the war if it comes to that! We have some many people.....nuff said..

There is NO way we could win a war in Asia against China...besides that Look at where China is in relationship to IRAQ..

It would not be hard and of course there are other nations in between China and Iraq but if China had the desire to get involved there would be nothing we could do...think about that...look at the map....duh
 

deepred98

Golden Member
Sep 3, 2005
1,246
0
0
Originally posted by: Amplifier
It's hard to turn on the TV without some asshole like Pat Buchanan or some other inbred alarmist going on and on about the Chinese economic "revolution". Let's keep this short and sweet: China's economy sucks. It has always sucked, and it will never compete with the US. Their GDP per capital only recently broke $1,000 per year. Let that sink in, American's earn over 30 times as much as the Chinese.

uh wtf are you smokin

http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/geos/ch.html

Per Capita GDP: $6,300 (2005)
 

BBond

Diamond Member
Oct 3, 2004
8,363
0
0
Better stop criticizing China's economy. Our is becoming what theirs is now.
 

venk

Banned
Dec 10, 2000
7,449
1
0
Originally posted by: Amplifier

5) Communist countries have never, in the history of the world, competed with a capitalist republic for any length of time. The USSR tried the whole "Build up the infrastructure with government factories". Are you really worried that China is trying the same thing?

Yes and No. Communism fails when it is left on it's own but it can work when it is finacially backed by an outside source like the billions of dollars coming in from Walmart and other such companies.

 

ntdz

Diamond Member
Aug 5, 2004
6,989
0
0
Originally posted by: techs
Originally posted by: ntdz
China's GDP might be growing, but much of it is from foreign companies, including US companies. I think a better comparison would be how their GNP is growing, I bet ours is growing at a comparable rate to theirs.
Once again you are AMAZINGLY wrong. It is probably your total lack of knowledge which is the cause for your amazingly wrong posts.
You wish what you say is true. And therefore you think its true.
You are really showing your ignorance with this post.

btw how much you want to bet?
I am just astounded by your total lack of knowledge. If you are an example of the youth of America we are so screwed.

I hope you realize that the USA is growing at a faster dollar rate than China, by a lot...They aren't even gaining on us yet...
 

sandorski

No Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
70,674
6,246
126
China's economy is on fire. Perhaps the actual conditions that most live under suck, but to think that means anything is to miss the point entirely. In the last decade a Middle Class the size of the entire population of the US has sprung up in China where no such thing existed before. At current growth rates China's economy will double every 8 years, so don't delude yourself too long, because soon you could be making trinkets for export to China.
 

BBond

Diamond Member
Oct 3, 2004
8,363
0
0
Originally posted by: venk
Originally posted by: Amplifier

5) Communist countries have never, in the history of the world, competed with a capitalist republic for any length of time. The USSR tried the whole "Build up the infrastructure with government factories". Are you really worried that China is trying the same thing?

Yes and No. Communism fails when it is left on it's own but it can work when it is finacially backed by an outside source like the billions of dollars coming in from Walmart and other such companies.

Only problem is, China's manufacturing is the engine that runs Walmart, not the other way around.

Perhaps it's capitalism, at least bush-style capitalism, that fails when it's left on it's own but can work when backed by an outside source like the billions of dollars coming from China that are helping to finance bush's record deficit. ;)
 

nCred

Golden Member
Oct 13, 2003
1,109
114
106
Originally posted by: deepred98
Originally posted by: Amplifier
It's hard to turn on the TV without some asshole like Pat Buchanan or some other inbred alarmist going on and on about the Chinese economic "revolution". Let's keep this short and sweet: China's economy sucks. It has always sucked, and it will never compete with the US. Their GDP per capital only recently broke $1,000 per year. Let that sink in, American's earn over 30 times as much as the Chinese.

uh wtf are you smokin

http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/geos/ch.html

well, that´s the purchasing power parity, it´s adjusted for living cost differences between countries so it´s better for comparing living standard. If you look at GDP (official exchange rate) it´s at $1.79 trillion compared to GDP (purchasing power parity):$8.182 trillion.
 

Amplifier

Banned
Dec 25, 2004
3,143
0
0
Originally posted by: deepred98
Originally posted by: Amplifier
It's hard to turn on the TV without some asshole like Pat Buchanan or some other inbred alarmist going on and on about the Chinese economic "revolution". Let's keep this short and sweet: China's economy sucks. It has always sucked, and it will never compete with the US. Their GDP per capital only recently broke $1,000 per year. Let that sink in, American's earn over 30 times as much as the Chinese.

uh wtf are you smokin

http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/geos/ch.html

Per Capita GDP: $6,300 (2005)

Li Deshui, director of China's National Bureau of Statistics (NBS), said at a press conference held by the Information Office of the State Council on January 20.

The per capita GDP reached a record US$1,090, suggesting that China's economic development has entered a new era, Li said.

All regions across China are required to use the permanent population instead of the cureent registered population in the calculation of per capita GDP. A spell of two years will be granted for those areas where both registered population and permanent population exist. After two years, the per capita GDP based on registered population will be abolished, said Li.





 

deepred98

Golden Member
Sep 3, 2005
1,246
0
0
Originally posted by: Amplifier
Originally posted by: deepred98
Originally posted by: Amplifier
It's hard to turn on the TV without some asshole like Pat Buchanan or some other inbred alarmist going on and on about the Chinese economic "revolution". Let's keep this short and sweet: China's economy sucks. It has always sucked, and it will never compete with the US. Their GDP per capital only recently broke $1,000 per year. Let that sink in, American's earn over 30 times as much as the Chinese.

uh wtf are you smokin

http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/geos/ch.html

Per Capita GDP: $6,300 (2005)

Li Deshui, director of China's National Bureau of Statistics (NBS), said at a press conference held by the Information Office of the State Council on January 20.

The per capita GDP reached a record US$1,090, suggesting that China's economic development has entered a new era, Li said.

All regions across China are required to use the permanent population instead of the cureent registered population in the calculation of per capita GDP. A spell of two years will be granted for those areas where both registered population and permanent population exist. After two years, the per capita GDP based on registered population will be abolished, said Li.

oh well looks like i jumped to conclusions :D (although technically i'm right too)