China and US computer security

[Craig234]

Buried on the Anandtech front page stories is this one:

http://www.dailytech.com/article.aspx?newsid=24328

It's an amazing piece that speaks for itself.

A century ago, when WWI broke out, the US had a culture that we were the 'shining light' and a more moral nation, and that spying was beneath us, improper.

At the time, the US had the weakest intelligence gathering operation of any of the powers.

In fact, even by 1929, Henry Stimson, who had been Secretary of State since 1920, dismantled the intelligence gathering with a famous quote:

‘Gentlemen don’t read each other’s mail.’
—Secretary of State Henry L. Stimson

Now, he had a point - but there are practical matters. By WWII - when Stimson was FDR's Secretary of War - he reversed himself and our codebreaking was hugely important.

The analogy is simply whether we are properly appreciating and responding to the issue of computer security, or whether we are repeating history.

Read the article. This forum should be especially interested and opinionated on the issue.

 

[DesiPower]

I posted a thread a while back on something similar, more great read

http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2226900

It is a very scary scenario, and we are ignoring it... its will bite us big time. Like termites that are hollowing our corporations... one by one...

 

[cubby1223]

?

Are you advocating we try more to stop their theft, or we should actively steal from them?

China steals our defense technologies because our defense technologies are vastly superior to theirs.

The U.S. does not steal China's defense technologies because their defense technologies are vastly inferior to ours.

 

[Craig234]

?

Are you advocating we try more to stop their theft, or we should actively steal from them?

China steals our defense technologies because our defense technologies are vastly superior to theirs.

The U.S. does not steal China's defense technologies because their defense technologies are vastly inferior to ours.

The analogy was not saying to steal information, but rather to appreciate the danger and take stronger protective measures. Not just technical but political. And more publicity.

 

[Infohawk]

Neither party really wants to take this on. Sad. China needs tariffs.

 

[Karl Agathon]

Read the article earlier today. From this and other info that ive read, it looks as if Chinese hackers continually (with Red China's govt approval) do this and the U.S. isnt doing much to actually retaliate. instead of just reacting to the attacks and saying the standard answers like "we have to build better security to prevent future attacks", the U.S. should also retaliate in kind. Without any serious blowback, Red China will continue to see this as a one way unlimited buffet.

(My opinion) Red China is a de-facto enemy of the United States. Some people will say all the politically correct things like "oh no, China is our friend" There is a cold war already brewing with Red China. Some people may not want to acknowledge it, but it is happening.

 

[rchiu]

1) Quote:

Whether the Chinese government is perpetrating these attacks first hand, sponsoring third parties to conduct them, or merely condoning corporate interests to conduct them is almost as hazy as the sketchy financial ties the Chinese government holds to many of its private sector business (to be fair such allegations have increasingly been raised about the U.S. gov't).

-----

Meaning US government has no clue who actually hacked the system other than an IP address traced to China?

2) Quote:

U.S. companies who speak out against the attacks are threatened by the Chinese. The Chinese government is more than willing to ban U.S. firms that rock the boat, locking them out of the lucrative emerging market of almost 1 billion internet-active device users.
------

Has any company actually been threatened and locked out? I believe this is against WTO rules, if this is happening, why not file charge like the one about cutting off rare earth metal?

My suggestion is, if you want to accuse a country of serious charge like government sponsored intellectual property theft, you better bring the facts and supporting info too. Or your charge won't stand in the Internationally community and you will damage diplomatic ties.

 

[chucky2]

Nothing meaningful will happen here because a.) the Chinese don't give a F about stealing to acquire (their culture is vastly different than ours) and b.) the US needs China so we can buy a $3 green plastic bucket w/ cheap plastic toys in it that we nor our kids need, to go with the $3 red plastic bucket w/ cheap plastic toys in it that we nor our kids needed last week.

Consumer society means consumer mentality...

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

Universal computer care will fix this.

Seriously, the only thing that can be done is to isolate all critical systems from externally linked ones. Hard to steal what cannot be accessed. Of course that is a pain best case. China won't respond to concerns because they have no need to. There aren't many options.

 

[Oric]

US can hack Hundreds of millions of pc's instantly because i believe each MS windows has a "never used yet" backdoor access

 

[DesiPower]

US can hack Hundreds of millions of pc's instantly because i believe each MS windows has a "never used yet" backdoor access

I doubt that will work on China, MS had to open its comodo to them before they were let in. In fact that might be the key reason why the new red army is so easily hacking our country to death.

 

[PokerGuy]

I don't understand why all critical networks and systems are not simply completely isolated from any IP outside the US. Sure, someone could still use a hacked account or shell to attack from inside the US, but it would make it a lot more difficult for the chicoms to continue to attack us.

 

[1prophet]

1) Quote:

Whether the Chinese government is perpetrating these attacks first hand, sponsoring third parties to conduct them, or merely condoning corporate interests to conduct them is almost as hazy as the sketchy financial ties the Chinese government holds to many of its private sector business (to be fair such allegations have increasingly been raised about the U.S. gov't).

-----

Meaning US government has no clue who actually hacked the system other than an IP address traced to China?

2) Quote:

U.S. companies who speak out against the attacks are threatened by the Chinese. The Chinese government is more than willing to ban U.S. firms that rock the boat, locking them out of the lucrative emerging market of almost 1 billion internet-active device users.
------

Has any company actually been threatened and locked out? I believe this is against WTO rules, if this is happening, why not file charge like the one about cutting off rare earth metal?

My suggestion is, if you want to accuse a country of serious charge like government sponsored intellectual property theft, you better bring the facts and supporting info too. Or your charge won't stand in the Internationally community and you will damage diplomatic ties.

Maybe because they weren't threatened outright just reminded how fortunate they are to be allowed to do business in China.

 

[DesiPower]

Maybe because they weren't threatened outright just reminded how fortunate they are to be allowed to do business in China.

MS is an example, congress could never get a peek into full Window's code and Office code, but Chinese govt did... They didn't get locked out, but its pretty significant.