JSt0rm
Lifer
- Sep 5, 2000
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Who's doing the sowing other than Kessler & his friends?
tons of southern whites got away with murder in those very courtooms.
Who's doing the sowing other than Kessler & his friends?
I think the key word in the opening post was "re-trial".
That word raised many questions and leads to many conclusions:
1) it wasn't an open and shut case in some regard
2) They decided to "re-trial" a punch at a brawl? Is that really the best use of societies dollars. Trials are crazy expensive here. I would rather the money spent litigating and adjudicating this go to maybe feeding orphans and the elderly or something, or putting books in schools.
"Some men you just can't reach."Slugging a Nazi in the back of the head is basically admitting your words and ideas were not enough to defeat their message. Granted, that's entirely possible, as Hitler found out in WWII when he was defeated by the collective might of the allies. And, I'll be the first to acknowledge violence for the fine effective tool it is, but I firmly believe it should be the last option, reserved for when all others have been tried and failed.
Are those rejoicing over Nazi-smacking going on sale for $1 willing to concede as much? Is the really how we want to defeat American Nazism?
'Cause, if so, I'll hold 'em while you guys do the punching. Or vice versa. Either way is good.![]()
.45 to the brainpan works pretty well. Not saying it should be done, mind you, it's just how these kinds of things tended to get solved before the last ~50 or so years."Some men you just can't reach."
I don't know if I believe this about all these Nazi fuckheads, but I do think there are definitely people who will choose to die for their beliefs, regardless of the validity of said beliefs.
How do you respond to zealots whose message is extermination or subjugation of others? How much effort is worth trying to convince someone who is such a zealot?
How do you de-program these people?
Right, but assuming that murder remains an moral impediment, what then?.45 to the brainpan works pretty well. Not saying it should be done, mind you, it's just how these kinds of things tended to get solved before the last ~50 or so years.
Let the public punch them for a one dollar fee?Right, but assuming that murder remains an moral impediment, what then?
tons of southern whites got away with murder in those very courtooms.
I'm okay with this guy:Right, but assuming that murder remains an moral impediment, what then?
The non-funny answer is, it's hard. Social pressures don't exist for them anymore, as they can find a 'tribe' of like-minded people on the internet that probably numbers in the millions, even if it's dwarfed by the overall populace. They're also easily manipulated by outside influences (as we all are) and can be incited into making things worse, if someone were to choose to.Let the public punch them for a one dollar fee?
The reason is that pain's not a great teacher, actually.I'm okay with this guy:
The non-funny answer is, it's hard. Social pressures don't exist for them anymore, as they can find a 'tribe' of like-minded people on the internet that probably numbers in the millions, even if it's dwarfed by the overall populace. They're also easily manipulated by outside influences (as we all are) and can be incited into making things worse, if someone were to choose to.
Pain's a great teacher, but frowned upon for some reason. Elimination doesn't really resolve the problem, it just silences one, you'd have to wholesale slaughter people to eliminate an ideal which will still probably fail, given that this is racism (categorization and assumption, something the human brain does wonderfully) and not something 'known' like a religion. Can try education, but even educated people can be racist AF. Exposure therapy might work for some, but I've seen it fail too. Could always ship them off to wherever the people they seem to hate the most come from, force them to live there for 5y. Not sure if we could arrange that politically though.
Maybe we just leave them behind when Musk has his colony ships ready?
I personally disagree. Pain is the most primal of teachers, works like a champ for teaching what you should/should not do. If every racist got punched in the fucking face every time they said something racist, we'd have a lot less racists around, because they'd either learn that acting in a way counter-intuitive to social norms will have consequences (and adjust behaviors accordingly), or they'll be dead from blunt force trauma.The reason is that pain's not a great teacher, actually.
Even less so against deeply held beliefs.
I'm not entirely against what you're saying, but I do think that sanctioned violence is a door better left closed as often as it can be.I personally disagree. Pain is the most primal of teachers, works like a champ for teaching what you should/should not do. If every racist got punched in the fucking face every time they said something racist, we'd have a lot less racists around, because they'd either learn that acting in a way counter-intuitive to social norms will have consequences (and adjust behaviors accordingly), or they'll be dead from blunt force trauma.
Yes, there's some zealots out there that will never change their minds. No idea what to do about those ones aside from remove them from society, but the goobers who think they've got the testicular fortitude to stand against large percentages of the population while shielded by morality-based laws? One broken nose would probably set them straight, assuming they knew it wouldn't stop at one.
I'm sure you're right, and my musings are more out of desperation than anything. I don't know how to modify socially acceptable (in their circles) behavior without violence. Yet it these behaviors are so anathema to our social fabric that it always feels like we're teetering on the edge. I'd like to to think it's less severe than it used to be, until the next story hits the pipeline and I feel like we haven't moved forward since the 60's. Humans seem too simple to have more options. Maybe one of our resident psychiatrists/psychologists could chime in.I'm not entirely against what you're saying, but I do think that sanctioned violence is a door better left closed as often as it can be.
Also this sounds like a modified version of a justification for spanking children.
I don't think these ideas are morally permissible within society without massive repercussions.
I agree there's a lot of absurdity in the nature of how it continues to exist. People burning their Nike shit is maybe the dumbest example I can imagine of people just desperate to be proud about being bigots.I'm sure you're right, and my musings are more out of desperation than anything. I don't know how to modify socially acceptable (in their circles) behavior without violence. Yet it these behaviors are so anathema to our social fabric that it always feels like we're teetering on the edge. I'd like to to think it's less severe than it used to be, until the next story hits the pipeline and I feel like we haven't moved forward since the 60's. Humans seem too simple to have more options. Maybe one of our resident psychiatrists/psychologists could chime in.
But how? If you tell someone to change, they assume you're an intellectual telling them how to live. Try to teach their kids and the same thing applies (or even more vociferously). Leads to an endless spiral, with the exception of the few adolescents that get thrown out of the spiral. I think more get drawn in than thrown out, though.I agree there's a lot of absurdity in the nature of how it continues to exist. People burning their Nike shit is maybe the dumbest example I can imagine of people just desperate to be proud about being bigots.
A culture shift away from anti-intellectualism is what I'm endlessly hoping for.
It has to be tied to public education.But how? If you tell someone to change, they assume you're an intellectual telling them how to live. Try to teach their kids and the same thing applies (or even more vociferously). Leads to an endless spiral, with the exception of the few adolescents that get thrown out of the spiral. I think more get drawn in than thrown out, though.
Do not approve. As much as I can't stand these racist alt-right incel pissants, unless they attack you first you should keep your jabs verbal. People who get violent for no other reason than 'I Disagree' should feel actual penalties. You're entitled to defend yourself, but there is no such entitlement to attacking because your feelings are hurt. Let the dipshits catch that charge, and face a real consequence or two as a result.
It wouldn't be cool to see a KKK skinhead do that and get a $1 fine, that's Old South good ol boy stuff right there I tell you hhwat.
I personally disagree. Pain is the most primal of teachers, works like a champ for teaching what you should/should not do. If every racist got punched in the fucking face every time they said something racist, we'd have a lot less racists around, because they'd either learn that acting in a way counter-intuitive to social norms will have consequences (and adjust behaviors accordingly), or they'll be dead from blunt force trauma.
Yes, there's some zealots out there that will never change their minds. No idea what to do about those ones aside from remove them from society, but the goobers who think they've got the testicular fortitude to stand against large percentages of the population while shielded by morality-based laws? One broken nose would probably set them straight, assuming they knew it wouldn't stop at one.
Actually no, watching my BIL and SIL raise their three with a strict 'kindler, gentler, ineffective discipline upbringing', I've wholly confirmed my suspicions, that there's a few moments in most kid's youth where they need a swift lesson in pain to prevent them from hurting themselves or others later. There's probably a limited window when this primal method of teaching is the most effective method... and there may be an even better one, but I haven't seen it yet. Threat of pain (physical, mental, or psychological) is what makes discipline work, for most people in most circumstances.Are you the same type of person that says the above statement but thinks spanking children is ineffective?
