Change...

[SmCaudata]

So, our president is an unqualified moron that makes every decision based on immediate personal gain... Any sane person can agree to that, even smart republicans.

So what are the chances that Americans realize perpetual materialism is the actual reason for the failure of the "economy". The obvious issue is that more than half of our country cannot sustain without 3 months of work. I dont blame the people. I blame a system that has systematically suppressed wages and tried to return to the days of indentured servitude.

This should be a wakeup call that se as a country (and the world) needs to change. We need a decrease in materialism, we need a minimum basic income, we need health care for all by eliminating insurers, we need green energy, we need livable wages, and we need a green energy policy that will help ensure the longevity of our planet and the human race...

All these morons worrying about their 401ks are clurless...


Edit: when I type it out I realise I'm basically saying we need a Star Trek version of Earth...

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[nickqt]

So, our president is an unqualified moron that makes every decision based on immediate personal gain... Any same person can agree to that, even smart republicans.

So what are the chances that Americans realize perpetual materialism is the actual reason for the failure of the "economy". The obvious issue is that more than half of our country cannot sustain without 3 months of work. I dont blame the people. I blame a system that has systematically suppressed wages and tried to return to the days of indentured servitude.

This should be a wakeup call that se as a country (and the world) needs to change. We need a decrease in materialism, we need a minimum basic income, we need health care for all by eliminating insurers, we need green energy, we need livable wages, and we need a green energy policy that will help ensure the longevity of our planet and the human race...

All these morons worrying about their 401ks are clurless...


Edit: when I type it out I realise I'm basically saying we need a Star Trek version of Earth...

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

The oligarchs have been working tirelessly for centuries to equate oligarchy=capitalism=freedom. And they've been successful.

The US isn't a first-world country in any meaningful sense. Most infrastructure is 50+ years old, but where the money ends up, it props itself up to the detriment of wherever it came from. The founders and framers were not Saints, but they're treated as such, because they created a more egalitarian system than a monarchy, but not by much, and the federal nature of the US means each state can be run as a fiefdom.

From the 17th century to the end of the 19th century, federal and state governments had the release valve of cheap land it could give to the wage slaves who were all but serfs. The land wasn't uninhabited, but a little genocide cleared the land of the ownership problems, and fiefdoms essentially paid people to GTFO and settle "new" lands while relying on the fiefdoms for all their supplies. Quite literally, the Eastern banks and corporations were colonial powers to western lands. Oh, and Manifest Destiny was the US precursor to the third reich's Lebensraum.

Capitalism as an economic system has always and will always exist. What is needed in a world without "free" land, is socialism for all utilities that are required to live, and capitalism for people to supplement their existence without wage slavery. Electric, shelter, food, etc., should be free. Purses can remain a capitalistic enterprise. Non-profits can perform contracts with governments to provide essentials if they can continually prove that they can do it at a cost-effective price, better than gub'mint. Shelter should be free. A mansion should cost money. High-end computes should be capitalistic. WiFi should be free. Etc, etc.

Stratified economies are the only way for humanity to live ethically and morally, but, oligarchs have been working for centuries to equate oligarchy=capitalism=freedom. And they've convinced themselves of their own lies so much that now they're aiming to go back to aristocracy, and they're winning.

 

[SmCaudata]

Completely agree. Stratufication of some sort is necessary as long as the lowest tier is a meaningful existence.

If everyone had a livable basic income, guaranteed health care, good public transit, along with adequate food and shelter, there would be no crash. Investors wouldn't be panicking because they know things would rebound. There wouldn't be a push to return to work because we'd do so when it's safe. In intentionally conflating the stock market with the economy because that's the American view. I know that Wall Street people love volatility because it is how they make money.

It is painful to see so many struggling because they worked tirelessly just to keep that light at the end of the tunnel visible. I guess the sad part of it all is that politicians dont seem to get it yet. 'Pubs want to claim that freedoms are being stolen because they love their marginalized, disposable, workforce. Dems are trying save everyone all the time. Rather than piddly bailouts we need sustainable long term solutions to make sure the bottom never falls out again.

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[darkswordsman17]

Fucking people coming and going has been VERY lucrative for them. Why would they change when we keep letting it happen?

 

[Moonbeam]

Step one, I should think, is to realize that nothing can ever change, that humanity is asleep, living in a wrong world and will stay that way. People like Sanders come along only once in a while to make waves, or ripples if you will. So then step two would be.....................

 

[shortylickens]

Weird, over the last few weeks I was thinking to myself about how the epidemic and quarantine would be very advantageous to the one percent if they wanted to take control of even more resources and put more Americans into the Wage-slave category. And here we are talking about it.

 

[amrnuke]

Weird, over the last few weeks I was thinking to myself about how the epidemic and quarantine would be very advantageous to the one percent if they wanted to take control of even more resources and put more Americans into the Wage-slave category. And here we are talking about it.

Same. The 1% started pulling money out late last year, seeing as this has been the longest running bull market. When the economy comes crashing down, just as they did in the early 90s, early 00s, 2007-2010, they will put their cash back in and enrich themselves.

I mean, if I had the money at those times, I'd do the same thing.

The big problem IMO is that they are using that money for political influence, corporations engage in bribery... I mean, lobbying.

Think about it. Medicare and SSI are Ponzi schemes the way they're being run now, and also a slush fund. The Fed just prints money whenever the government asks. Government takes taxpayer money and diverts it to political friends and those who give them the most money to get them re-elected.

The whole system is fucked.

 

[hal2kilo]

Step one, I should think, is to realize that nothing can ever change, that humanity is asleep, living in a wrong world and will stay that way. People like Sanders come along only once in a while to make waves, or ripples if you will. So then step two would be.....................

The sleeper must awaken.

 

[shortylickens]

Step one, I should think, is to realize that nothing can ever change, that humanity is asleep, living in a wrong world and will stay that way. People like Sanders come along only once in a while to make waves, or ripples if you will. So then step two would be.....................

would be?

WOULD BE!!!!!!!!

 

[Moonbeam]

The sleeper must awaken.

AKA I must awaken, but if the ego can't awaken itself because it is sleep itself, it is my condition itself, we know now at least there is no exit we can control.

 

[darkswordsman17]

Same. The 1% started pulling money out late last year, seeing as this has been the longest running bull market. When the economy comes crashing down, just as they did in the early 90s, early 00s, 2007-2010, they will put their cash back in and enrich themselves.

I mean, if I had the money at those times, I'd do the same thing.

The big problem IMO is that they are using that money for political influence, corporations engage in bribery... I mean, lobbying.

Think about it. Medicare and SSI are Ponzi schemes the way they're being run now, and also a slush fund. The Fed just prints money whenever the government asks. Government takes taxpayer money and diverts it to political friends and those who give them the most money to get them re-elected.

The whole system is fucked.

Honestly, that part of things (them pulling money out when they know its overheated and due for a contraction, and putting it back in after that happens) would be fine. Its that they're playing with other peoples' money, fucking up spectacularly, then getting the government to bail out their fuckup, while they get personally enriched out of it and facing no consequences. And then their fuckup sinks the market which enables them to buy up stocks for cheap (and then they demand dividends constantly to make sure they don't get stuck holding the bag while they push companies for short term profits which fucks them over longer term).

They're not even using their own money for that shit. They're using company money.

 

[amrnuke]

Honestly, that part of things (them pulling money out when they know its overheated and due for a contraction, and putting it back in after that happens) would be fine. Its that they're playing with other peoples' money, fucking up spectacularly, then getting the government to bail out their fuckup, while they get personally enriched out of it and facing no consequences. And then their fuckup sinks the market which enables them to buy up stocks for cheap (and then they demand dividends constantly to make sure they don't get stuck holding the bag while they push companies for short term profits which fucks them over longer term).

They're not even using their own money for that shit. They're using company money.

Yep. Really shitty.

What's amazing is the total amount of money spent not on buying stocks, but on BETTING on stock performance. There is a derivative market that is many times larger than the actual value of the stocks they're betting on, and that's what led to the 2007-2009 crisis and puts us at elevated risk globally.

 

[Greenman]

So, our president is an unqualified moron that makes every decision based on immediate personal gain... Any sane person can agree to that, even smart republicans.

So what are the chances that Americans realize perpetual materialism is the actual reason for the failure of the "economy". The obvious issue is that more than half of our country cannot sustain without 3 months of work. I dont blame the people. I blame a system that has systematically suppressed wages and tried to return to the days of indentured servitude.

This should be a wakeup call that se as a country (and the world) needs to change. We need a decrease in materialism, we need a minimum basic income, we need health care for all by eliminating insurers, we need green energy, we need livable wages, and we need a green energy policy that will help ensure the longevity of our planet and the human race...

All these morons worrying about their 401ks are clurless...


Edit: when I type it out I realise I'm basically saying we need a Star Trek version of Earth...

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

What do we do with the folks that won't participate?

 

[Jaskalas]

Edit: when I type it out I realise I'm basically saying we need a Star Trek version of Earth...

You are not wrong. Nor are your ideas. Our goals share much in common.

 

[Jaskalas]

What do we do with the folks that won't participate?

Like what, won't participate, won't contribute... by performing labor?
Are you referring to the lazy people Republicans love to attack?

As automation advances a little further we won't need them. AKA production may occur regardless. Ergo, basic income... and who cares what they will or will not do? Their business is not my business. May they live long and prosper.

 

[amrnuke]

Like what, won't participate, won't contribute... by performing labor?
Are you referring to the lazy people Republicans love to attack?

As automation advances a little further we won't need them. AKA production may occur regardless. Ergo, basic income... and who cares what they will or will not do? Their business is not my business. May they live long and prosper.

That's an idealized world.
Automation, UBI
If you want more money you go get a degree or apprenticeship
We would still have a huge service industry, travel, finance, banking, etc. We would be more productive as a nation. Ideally we'd have a lot more inventors and thinkers and it's entirely possible that we end up advancing society even further in such a case.
But it sounds like a damn sci-fi movie when I say it out loud.

 

[Moonbeam]

Everyone will need to be sequestered on 1 acre gated estates, run on solar power and the residents will be responsible for their own hydroponic and aqua culture food supply. Drone stations and solar farms interspersed within the system will deliver factory and large scale farming products. Hostels for foot travel will be spaced a leisurely walking day apart. International travel will be by rail and sail. Oh this is going to be endless....................

 

[SmCaudata]

What do we do with the folks that won't participate?

Well, the reality is that if you treat people with a shred of dignity and make all full time jobs able to adequately cover needs, they will. When I was in Norway I was speaking to the woman manning a gift shop. She talked about how just doing her job full time allows her to live comfortably with a nice house. She always thought the American model was silly.

Why should people work 3 jobs and still not be able to get health care, safe housing, or other needs?

Another thing that I found interesting there was they immigration policies. People had to prove that they had a job and a place to live in order to stay and work. Then, the durations were limited. This too would be good here. The .1% dont actually want immigration reform because it would protect the workers and make them cost more. We need to crack down on businesses that employ undocumented workers rather than blaming the people just trying to get by.

As others have said here, our entire county is setup for the multimillionaire types and big business. Nothing else matters. People are effectively replaceable parts in the American machine.

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[Greenman]

Well, the reality is that if you treat people with a shred of dignity and make all full time jobs able to adequately cover needs, they will.

I clipped the rest out because this is where you lost me. In my experience about half will continue to work even if it's not necessary. The rest will spend their time taking drugs, drinking, smoking, eating, fighting, and fucking, not necessarily in that order.
People without a goal or a need often become aimless, people that don't earn the things they have often don't appreciate them.
Some cultures are based on doing well, on drive and success, the Japanese and Germans come to mind. Hard work and achievement are simply expected. Some cultures don't operate that way at all. The US is a mixed bag, and I think your utopian dream would come with a lot of conflict here.

 

[cytg111]

What do we do with the folks that won't participate?

Just a suggestion but you could 1. keep them away buttons connected to nuclear weapons and 2. preserve their right to NOT pick up the UBI check.