Challenge: list 3 things state Democrats have done wrong recently

[DaveSimmons]

In Discussion Club, Craig posted a list of behavior by Republicans that he thinks is wrong:

1. (Anti-women) Arkansas senate Repulicans voted against a resolution to ratify the Equal Rights Amendment
http://www.ktts.com/news/201113571.html

2. (Anti-gays) Virginia's Attorney General - and the reported nominee for their next governor - just filed a petition in federal court requesting to keep Virginia's sodomy law on the books.
http://communities.washingtontimes....ia-overturns-sodomy-law-attorney-general-see/

3. (Democratic Voter suppression) Parents will lose their tax deduction if children they support register to vote at a different address
http://www.wect.com/story/21874842/...se-tax-credits-if-child-is-registered-to-vote


I responded that someone else could pull similar examples of state Democrat senators and congressmen behaving badly, but he calls that "denial and false equivalency" and challenged me to produce those examples.

Is he right? Have state Democrats not done anything recently that you think is wrong?


The challenge is to list your 3 worst examples of state Democrats behaving badly. Governors, Senators and congressmen, not just random mayors or dog-catchers.

Please list links to reputable sources not just a blog. It should be something they actually did. like sponsoring a bill or voting on one. For "recent" please make it no older than March 1st 2013.

 

[Charles Kozierok]

You could probably fill the list just using gun control laws, with the NY one at the top. But of course Craig won't accept those because he doesn't think there's any problem with them.

Which is, of course, the entire point -- claims about "denial" and "wrongness" are entirely a matter of perspective.

 

[ivwshane]

You could probably fill the list just using gun control laws, with the NY one at the top. But of course Craig won't accept those because he doesn't think there's any problem with them.

Which is, of course, the entire point -- claims about "denial" and "wrongness" are entirely a matter of perspective.

Well the proposed laws would need to be found unconstitutional or at the very least have zero to do with their intentions.

For now though, let's add it to the list. Two more to go.

 

[davmat787]

Here in Washington (the state!):

1) Gov. Inslee [D] wants to make 50 cent beer tax permanent, could spell the end for many local microbrews, which are a part of NW, and in paticular, Seattle culture. Keep in mind this is per bottle, adding $3.00 to a 6 pack of the locally crafted elixir of the gods! To be fair, the governors office disagrees with those figures but if I had to pick one side based on the little I know, I will side with the local craft brewer.

Proposed beer tax leaves bitter taste among brewers

"If this beer tax had been in effect last year, it would've cost us an additional $30,000 in taxes," he said. "I don't think the company would've made it."

"There are over 100 breweries that are less than a year old," he added. "It probably will put all of them out of business."

2)State Democrat wants employers to have access to employees facebook accounts.

Democrat Sen. Steve Hobbs of Lake Stevens, WA is sponsoring a bill that would allow bosses to seek employees Facebook passwords.

This amendment "says they have a right to enter your digital home," Maass said. "It's astounding that they would try to codify this and that all employers could do this... the national trend is to move away from this. It's shocking that the amendment is going in the right opposite direction."

Maass said it's not only an employee's privacy that is violated, but also those he has connections with in a social network site.

The amendment "would turn this bill into a privacy bill into an employer fishing expedition," said Shankar Narayan of the Washington chapter of the American Civil Liberties Union. "That's the not the bill we signed up for."

3)Funding college tuition for illegal immigrants (fu AP, they ARE illegal immigrants!), key lawmaker says funds are not available.

Key senator: Wash. lacks funds for illegal immigrants' college aid (democrat sponsored DREAM Act)

Senate Majority Leader Rodney Tom, a Medina Democrat who is on the committee and was caucusing with Republicans, supports the measure. His vote would give it a likely majority in the committee though he said that it is Bailey who will determine if the bill gets a committee vote.

The measure passed the state House earlier this month with Democrats united in support and Republicans split.

Bill proponents estimate that 645 college students receiving in-state tuition in Washington state during the 2011-2012 school year didn't offer proof of legal residency. They estimate that number would grow by 20 to 30 percent if the financial aid measure is approved. Using those numbers, costs in the next biennium would likely be between $3.3 million and $3.5 million.

NOTE: These are by know means the worst, as in heavy hitting policy, as asked for in the OP, just issues I remember as they were in the news very recently. Secondly, in Craigs mind, there is nothing a Democrat could do that would be worse than a Republican. That kind of scenario simply does not compute for him. Third, I am in no way defending Republicans or disparaging Democrats over the other, I like to view them on an issue by issue basis and am left thinking both parties have plenty of faults to go around. So much that arguing which party is better, or rather less bad, is pointless and serves as a perfect partisan distraction that those in power love us peons to keep preoccupied by.

 

[Moonbeam]

You could probably fill the list just using gun control laws, with the NY one at the top. But of course Craig won't accept those because he doesn't think there's any problem with them.

Which is, of course, the entire point -- claims about "denial" and "wrongness" are entirely a matter of perspective.

The claims are, but are all these perspective of equal validity?

 

[ivwshane]

Here in Washington (the state!):

1) Gov. Inslee [D] wants to make 50 cent beer tax permanent, could spell the end for many local microbrews, which are a part of NW, and in paticular, Seattle culture. Keep in mind this is per bottle, adding $3.00 to a 6 pack of the locally crafted elixir of the gods! To be fair, the governors office disagrees with those figures but if I had to pick one side based on the little I know, I will side with the local craft brewer.

Proposed beer tax leaves bitter taste among brewers



2)State Democrat wants employers to have access to employees facebook accounts.

Democrat Sen. Steve Hobbs of Lake Stevens, WA is sponsoring a bill that would allow bosses to seek employees Facebook passwords.



3)Funding college tuition for illegal immigrants (fu AP, they ARE illegal immigrants!), key lawmaker says funds are not available.

Key senator: Wash. lacks funds for illegal immigrants' college aid (democrat sponsored DREAM Act)



NOTE: These are by know means the worst, as in heavy hitting policy, as asked for in the OP, just issues I remember as they were in the news very recently. Secondly, in Craigs mind, there is nothing a Democrat could do that would be worse than a Republican. That kind of scenario simply does not compute for him. Third, I am in no way defending Republicans or disparaging Democrats over the other, I like to view them on an issue by issue basis and am left thinking both parties have plenty of faults to go around. So much that arguing which party is better, or rather less bad, is pointless and serves as a perfect partisan distraction that those in power love us peons to keep preoccupied by.

Your first claim states that the tax is already in place and has been since 2010 and the governors budget is to make it permanent. Does they tax happen to target a group that usually votes republican? Has the tax had any negative impact on sales? If so do the breweries typically vote republican? Does the state have budget issues? What are some of the reasons why you think this move is nefarious?
Personally I don't see the outrage in this one.

Your second story is quite ridiculous and seems pretty stupid and anti privacy. However, what are the intentions of the bill (no matter how stupid they are)? Does the bill affect a group that typically votes republican? Good intentions don't always make good bills but what I think the OP is looking for are bills that are being pushed for nefarious reasons. I'm sure we could all put together a huge list of proposed laws from both sides of the isle that are just stupid on their own (like this amendment).

Your third story doesn't seem like an issue at all. We have a republican and a democrat working together who have different views and the democrat saying the vote will go to the republican to decide to move forward or not. It's a good issue but hardly one anyone would consider bad behavior.

 

[davmat787]

Your first claim states that the tax is already in place and has been since 2010 and the governors budget is to make it permanent. Does they tax happen to target a group that usually votes republican? Has the tax had any negative impact on sales? If so do the breweries typically vote republican? Does the state have budget issues? What are some of the reasons why you think this move is nefarious?
Personally I don't see the outrage in this one.

Your second story is quite ridiculous and seems pretty stupid and anti privacy. However, what are the intentions of the bill (no matter how stupid they are)? Does the bill affect a group that typically votes republican? Good intentions don't always make good bills but what I think the OP is looking for are bills that are being pushed for nefarious reasons. I'm sure we could all put together a huge list of proposed laws from both sides of the isle that are just stupid on their own (like this amendment).

Your third story doesn't seem like an issue at all. We have a republican and a democrat working together who have different views and the democrat saying the vote will go to the republican to decide to move forward or not. It's a good issue but hardly one anyone would consider bad behavior.

Twice you mention something to the effect of "effect a group that votes republican?" I thought the exercise int he OP was to merely point out some local behavior by the D's that one might take exception to. I fully admit I might have misconstrued the point of Charles request, trying to do three different things at once but my question to you still stands I guess.

 

[ivwshane]

Twice you mention something to the effect of "effect a group that votes republican?" I thought the exercise int he OP was to merely point out some local behavior by the D's that one might take exception to. I fully admit I might have misconstrued the point of Charles request, trying to do three different things at once but my question to you still stands I guess.

I'm sorry I don't see where you asked me a question.

To get a better understanding of the OP's question we should look at the accusations made in the other thread for comparison:

This week some actions by Republicans reinforced the message of Republicans having a 'war on women', supporting bigotry, and cheating democracy.

The tricky part is differentiating mere policy differences with negative intentions, like democrats trying to make it easier for illegals to vote or giving kick backs to people for votes.

 

[monovillage]

2 of the 3 behaviors that are disliked by the craig234 are perfectly reasonable and good legislation. Just because a frothing leftie like craig234 doesn't like them is more of a positive then a negative. The Equal Rights Amendment is a truly flawed piece of garbage. If a dependent isn't truly a dependent then they shouldn't be getting a tax deduction for them.

 

[DaveSimmons]

I wasn't asking for behavior that affects a group that votes Republican. If you want a theme, how about "behavior that fits a perceived stereotype" (to match Craig stereotyping Republicans)? For D's it could be acts that are anti-business, or pro welfare, or over-regulation, or...?


WA Beer Tax: This does fit the Democratic stereotype of over-taxing businesses, killing the golden goose. The article above makes clear:
- The tax was set the expire, the governor wants to make it permanent
- The tax was for larger breweries, the governor wants to make it apply to tiny craft brewers that were exempt before:

"The 50 cent per-gallon tax - enacted in 2010, and scheduled to expire this year - was originally on Washington state brewers who produce more than 60,000 barrels a year. If Governor Jay Inslee's budget passes as proposed, the tax would extend permanently to every brewery in Washington state, from Hilliard's 6-person operation in Ballard, to the 80-employee Pike Brewing Company, one of the first craft breweries in the United States."

 

[monovillage]

Homeless Bill of Rights?
http://articles.latimes.com/2013/jan/11/opinion/la-ed-homeless-bill-of-rights-20130111

Several weeks ago, state Assemblyman Tom Ammiano (D-San Francisco) proposed a sweeping set of protections for the homeless that have sparked almost as much controversy as the homeless themselves.

The Homeless Person's Bill of Rights and Fairness Act, as AB 5 is titled, would guarantee the homeless the right to live in public much as other people do in their homes. They could sit, sleep, move about and engage in "life-sustaining activities that must be carried out in public spaces because of homelessness," such as eating, urinating and collecting trash to recycle. Under the bill, they could not be forced into shelters, but would have access to them. It also mandates that public bathrooms be available around the clock and protects the "basic human right" to panhandle.

Nothing like letting some drunk/drugged/crazy folks piss and shit on the sidewalks. "it's their right!"

What 2nd Amendment?

 

[ivwshane]

Homeless Bill of Rights?
http://articles.latimes.com/2013/jan/11/opinion/la-ed-homeless-bill-of-rights-20130111



Nothing like letting some drunk/drugged/crazy folks piss and shit on the sidewalks. "it's their right!"

What 2nd Amendment?

Whoa, that one is crazy!

 

[ivwshane]

I wasn't asking for behavior that affects a group that votes Republican. If you want a theme, how about "behavior that fits a perceived stereotype" (to match Craig stereotyping Republicans)? For D's it could be acts that are anti-business, or pro welfare, or over-regulation, or...?


WA Beer Tax: This does fit the Democratic stereotype of over-taxing businesses, killing the golden goose. The article above makes clear:
- The tax was set the expire, the governor wants to make it permanent
- The tax was for larger breweries, the governor wants to make it apply to tiny craft brewers that were exempt before:

"The 50 cent per-gallon tax - enacted in 2010, and scheduled to expire this year - was originally on Washington state brewers who produce more than 60,000 barrels a year. If Governor Jay Inslee's budget passes as proposed, the tax would extend permanently to every brewery in Washington state, from Hilliard's 6-person operation in Ballard, to the 80-employee Pike Brewing Company, one of the first craft breweries in the United States."

I don't see how taxes are equivalent to "anti women" bills or voter suppression bills or anti gay rights. I think mono's post is actually a closer equivalence.

 

[Anarchist420]

Well, there was a Democrat in NorthernVA who supports gun control yet has a very violent criminal record himself. I think he beat the shit out of someone, then he tried to assault someone else later and they pulled a gun out on him in self defense.

Also, the Democrats claim to be pro-women's rights yet they think a woman shouldn't have the right to bear arms in self defense against rape.

Hillary Clinton believes it's more important to make sure the police statists have all the arms than to allow the group she claims to defend so much to be free to choose to defend themselves.

The Republicans aren't a whole lot better than the Democrats on gun rights but if the Democrats takeover in 2014 then only the police and military will be armed.

 

[nehalem256]

2 of the 3 behaviors that are disliked by the craig234 are perfectly reasonable and good legislation. Just because a frothing leftie like craig234 doesn't like them is more of a positive then a negative. The Equal Rights Amendment is a truly flawed piece of garbage. If a dependent isn't truly a dependent then they shouldn't be getting a tax deduction for them.

Its also interesting that he is implicitly saying that only women are deserving of equal rights. Especially since while I can name one right women have that men don't (*cough* abortion *cough*), I cannot name any rights that men have that women don't.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

The individual in question decided to block seeing me because whenever he brings up any criticism of Democrats he would always mention Republicans as being worse and at some point I challenged him to not do so. It was impossible so he shut me off.

Ny: Cuomo bypassing the usual process along with our state House who is noted for it's corruption to make sure HIS gun bill went through.

Obama and his terror legislation support.

Feinstein and her support of making sure we can't know if we are being illegally wiretapped.

 

[ivwshane]

Links people! I'm not interested in your spin just provide the links so we can make our own judgment.

 

[cubby1223]

I don't see how taxes are equivalent to "anti women" bills or voter suppression bills or anti gay rights. I think mono's post is actually a closer equivalence.

Links people! I'm not interested in your spin just provide the links so we can make our own judgment.

You truly are a riot! You never realize that your own perspective is also a spin. Stop pretending to believe you are interested in all sides to issues when the only thing you are interested in is finding the situation explained in how you inherently want it explained.

 

[cubby1223]

I live in Illinois, how much do you all want to know about what our Democrat politicians do to this state?

 

[cubby1223]

One example I'll throw out, Illinois needs pension reform badly to keep government expenses within reasonable levels. The Democratic governor knows this needs to be done, larger contributions, smaller payouts, and has been trying for months to get legislation through. The Democratic controlled house and senate refuse to take the issue seriously.

Here's a link for ivwshane to personally evaluate:
http://articles.chicagotribune.com/...1_pension-costs-pension-python-pension-crisis

 

[Matt1970]

Links people! I'm not interested in your spin just provide the links so we can make our own judgment.

You still haven't found out about Google?

 

[cubby1223]

3. (Democratic Voter suppression) Parents will lose their tax deduction if children they support register to vote at a different address
http://www.wect.com/story/21874842/...se-tax-credits-if-child-is-registered-to-vote

I can see the "fair" argument being to push college students to vote in their home district (absentee voting is easy to do, if a college student cannot figure out absentee voting, he shouldn't be in college). The flip side to the situation is you have a local community that can have 30 or 40,000 voters affecting local legislation when the majority of those voters everyone knows will not live in the community when the laws take affect.


There always is an alternate explanation to a situation other than "Republicans are evil," of which certain people this response is engraved into their brains...


Or, maybe it's purely a revenue grab, ala the new gun tax in Chicago, which a partisan could say is legislation created by Democrats purposefully targeting and affecting people who do not support their views (which it kind of is true).

 

[BoomerD]

I've been a Democrat since I first started voting more than 40 years ago, yet I can almost always easily find at least 3 things in which I disagree with the (D)'s...and can almost always find at least 3 things in which I AGREE with the (R)'s...if I look hard enough.

Political right and wrong is usually more the perspective of the viewer...not what's actually right and wrong.
Myself, I wish our elected officials (on both sides) would spend more time running the country/states than playing party politics...the game of "GOTCHA!" is getting old...

 

[Matt1970]

The individual in question decided to block seeing me because whenever he brings up any criticism of Democrats he would always mention Republicans as being worse and at some point I challenged him to not do so. It was impossible so he shut me off.

Ny: Cuomo bypassing the usual process along with our state House who is noted for it's corruption to make sure HIS gun bill went through.

Obama and his terror legislation support.

Feinstein and her support of making sure we can't know if we are being illegally wiretapped.

That's craig for ya. Disagree with him and he would go on a tirade denouncing your intelligence. Provide proof he is wrong and you go on the ignore list. I am on his ignore list too.

 

[Incorruptible]

That's craig for ya. Disagree with him and he would go on a tirade denouncing your intelligence. Provide proof he is wrong and you go on the ignore list. I am on his ignore list too.

That`s typical of him and his ilk. Scum who are so intolerant of other views that they attack them.

He is nothing but a coward who hides behind his screen and pretends to be some internet tough guy, He wouldn't dare say some of the same things on the street because he would get his ass kicked pretty good.