Celeron J1900, can it play 1080P videos / twitch streams SMOOTHLY?

[crashtech]

Twice the performance, for twice the price? Wow, that's nearly unheard of in the technology industry... oh, wait.

PS. Windows not included on that laptop.

Yeah, when I responded to your post I did not have my reading glasses on, so my bad, I thought the price in question was $180. But we can still say that there is twice the performance for less than half again the money, still a great deal from a performance perspective, and I will take this opportunity to call you out on your math, since I have been called out on my eyesight.

I did see the lack of installed OS, but since it has a COA, well... I didn't think it would be a problem, but that's all I have to say about that gray area.

Most importantly, you have posted here before about customers who have been unsatisfied with their purchases from you, and I strongly feel that what you are doing is setting yourself up for yet another unsatisfied customer. Maybe a J1900 in perfect fighting trim is just adequate for many tasks, but what about after it's been in the wild for a few months? A few toolbars and registry cleaners later, the thing will be like cold molasses come boot time.

 

[VirtualLarry]

Yeah, when I responded to your post I did not have my reading glasses on, so my bad, I thought the price in question was $180. But we can still say that there is twice the performance for less than half again the money, still a great deal from a performance perspective, and I will take this opportunity to call you out on your math, since I have been called out on my eyesight.

I did see the lack of installed OS, but since it has a COA, well... I didn't think it would be a problem, but that's all I have to say about that gray area.

I was adding in $50, for the cost of installing Windows.

Most importantly, you have posted here before about customers who have been unsatisfied with their purchases from you, and I strongly feel that what you are doing is setting yourself up for yet another unsatisfied customer. Maybe a J1900 in perfect fighting trim is just adequate for many tasks, but what about after it's been in the wild for a few months? A few toolbars and registry cleaners later, the thing will be like cold molasses come boot time.

To be fair, that was only one customer, and they had an opportunity to sit down and use the E1-2500 Kabini PC in question. What they were really fed up about, was Windows 8, and failed updates "reverting", and taking over an hour. At that point, instead of letting it complete, they simply shut it off and brought it to me.

Second, this is a freebie for a friend. Not a customer. I'm trying to sell him on a G3258 combo.

Edit: If I did get him the J1900 rig, I would let him use it for a week, and if he didn't like it, I wouldn't force it on him. I'd take it back, and either re-sell it, or give it away to someone that needed a PC.

 

[sm625]

You can buy a E8600 refurb for the same price. I do not see the point in even taking the risk with atom.

 

[TeknoBug]

I wouldn't bother with a J1900

While I don't doubt you, and Intel certainly IS a "greedy corporation"... I do wonder one thing. Why are the top selling laptops on Amazon all Bay Trail-based? If they are bad for desktop, why are they selling well for laptops? Or is it all about the power consumption, and battery life is better with Bay Trail, compared to Core?

(I get phenomenally good battery life with my 1007U and a six-cell battery on this Acer.)

Because there's a gap in laptop categories, I'm a long time laptop user for 25 some odd years now and I'm seeing the gap between low and high end get wider recently and mid range disappearing, either pay $200-400 for a low end junk or $800-2000 for high end, nothing in between anymore- you'd be lucky to still find a decent i3 4000M or A10 5750M which were decently priced. So instead of these high end i7 and gaming laptops, people have the choice of picking these Celeron, Pentium and dual core i3 and i5's which don't really perform like true Core i3 and i5's and A4/A6/A8 AMD variants and most of them has pretty subpar performance.

 

[crashtech]

That's why I gravitate toward used but known durable laptops. The new stuff is just a poor value proposition unless you look hard and get lucky.

 

[VirtualLarry]

That's why I gravitate toward used but known durable laptops. The new stuff is just a poor value proposition unless you look hard and get lucky.

Hmm, I know nothing about the durability of laptops. My Acer Aspire One 722 (C-60, 4GB, upgraded with SSD) died mysteriously a few years after I bought it. (It may have had lemon seltzer spilled into the vents. It wasn't powered on, but the battery was installed. Plugged in the charger cord, no lights whatsoever. No power-on, no nothing.)

I agree, the low end of the desktop market is the pits lately. I wish that they would bring back the 1007U and 1037U-class chips for low-end desktops, rather than Atom Celeron/Pentium CPUs. Though I admit, a quad-core in 4.5W is impressive, it's still too slow in single-threaded.

Edit: OK, so it seems like most of you are saying, that a J1900 rig wouldn't be worth it, even at $130 with a Windows license included. I agree, after looking at the Passmark score for single-threaded, around 500 or so, that kind of scares me. My Kabini E1-2500 rig is slower than that, by a touch, and it web browses, well, OK, but kind of slow when you get a bunch of tabs going.

OTOH, a G3258 has TWICE the single-threaded Passmark score (2000+) of a X4 640 (my friend's current CPU). Now that's pretty impressive. (The X4 640 has a single-thread score of around 1000, which I consider 800-1000 to be the minimum of what is acceptable for web browsing comfortably.)

 

[Vesku]

If he isn't happy with his Athlon II x4 640 with a SSD already installed then I don't see how J1900 will be an acceptable "upgrade".

 

[krumme]

J1800/1900 or fast kabini/beema is fine cpu. They enable computers at extreme low prices not seen before.
Often they are paired with a mechanical hd and its a fine match. Lol.
Using i3 core class and up you absolutely need an ssd for it to make sense and a lot of computers sold today is without an ssd.
A fast cpu and an ssd is a different product - and it needs to be said - but so is the price.
The alternative is not a faster cpu or an ssd when an atom is used.
The alternative is often nothing.
Go back to the first single core atoms on 45/32nm. They were dead slow. J1900 single core perf is more than twice that -aprox 250%. And multicore is 4 times. Add a gpu that actually works. A first time for Intel.
With the right software those atom/fast beema can do all the normal stuff.

 

[krumme]

Have he tried different machines eg atom mechanical vs core ssd?
I say it because perciewed performance is what matters.
I have used sdd since before the intel x25 series and would die using a slow cpu with mechanical but i doubt my wife would notice. - crap i even change ssd in my laptop to get a faster ssd with the same capacity. Lol. But its very personal.

 

[waltchan]

OTOH, a G3258 has TWICE the single-threaded Passmark score (2000+) of a X4 640 (my friend's current CPU). Now that's pretty impressive. (The X4 640 has a single-thread score of around 1000, which I consider 800-1000 to be the minimum of what is acceptable for web browsing comfortably.)

Celeron J1900 single-thread score is only 526. How is this any better to impress your friend.

http://www.cpubenchmark.net/cpu.php?cpu=Intel+Celeron+J1900+%40+1.99GHz

On the other hand, the previous Celeron G470 (single-core with hyperthreading) receives 998 single-thread score (47% faster). G470 works like an i3 but with one core missing.

http://www.cpubenchmark.net/cpu.php?cpu=Intel+Celeron+G470+@+2.00GHz

 

[waltchan]

If he isn't happy with his Athlon II x4 640 with a SSD already installed then I don't see how J1900 will be an acceptable "upgrade".

It will be very inferior. Believe it or not, the Athlon II X4 640 is very close and identical to FX-4130. He just need a new motherboard with DDR3 capability, and it can be overclocked up to 4.00GHz easily with 1600MHz RAM using bus-overclock. Plus at least SATA II minimum, set to AHCI mode. Try this.... He'll be very surprised.

Athlon II X4 640 at 4.00 GHz overclocked is estimated around 4100 total benchmark score and 1300 single-thread score.

I also own the Athlon II X4 645 as well, and I found minimal difference between 645 and FX-4130 together.

 

[VirtualLarry]

It will be very inferior. Believe it or not, the Athlon II X4 640 is very close and identical to FX-4130. He just need a new motherboard with DDR3 capability, and it can be overclocked up to 4.00GHz easily with 1600MHz RAM using multiplier. Plus at least SATA II minimum, set to AHCI mode. Try this.... He'll be very surprised.

Athlon II X4 640 at 4 GHz overclocked is estimated around 4100 total benchmark score and 1300 single-thread score.

I also own the Athlon II X4 645 as well, and I found very minimal difference between 645 and FX-4130 together.

I think that's a bit ... optimistic? Outrageous? I've never heard anyone overclocking an Athlon II X4 to 4Ghz. Certainly, an FX CPU, yes. Some Thubans, maybe. (But not my 1045T.) Phenom IIs? Haven't heard of many going past 3.7-3.8. Athlon II X4s? Pretty much never.

Btw, what do you mean "using multiplier"? The Athlon II X4 CPUs are LOCKED. They have to be bus-overclocked. Which is largely mobo-dependant.

Edit: If I wanted my friend to have a CPU/APU capable of 1300 single-threaded, I would hook him up with one of my FM2+ MSI A55M boards, and an A4-6300.

 

[VirtualLarry]

If he isn't happy with his Athlon II x4 640 with a SSD already installed then I don't see how J1900 will be an acceptable "upgrade".

The thought kind of was, if it can play back 1080P Twitch streams smoothly, then that would be an improvement, and it would save on his electric bill.

 

[waltchan]

I think that's a bit ... optimistic? Outrageous? I've never heard anyone overclocking an Athlon II X4 to 4Ghz. Certainly, an FX CPU, yes. Some Thubans, maybe. (But not my 1045T.) Phenom IIs? Haven't heard of many going past 3.7-3.8. Athlon II X4s? Pretty much never.

Btw, what do you mean "using multiplier"? The Athlon II X4 CPUs are LOCKED. They have to be bus-overclocked. Which is largely mobo-dependant.

Edit: If I wanted my friend to have a CPU/APU capable of 1300 single-threaded, I would hook him up with one of my FM2+ MSI A55M boards, and an A4-6300.

Absolutely not a joke at all. The Gigabyte GA-78LMT-USB3 as well as Asus M5A78L-M/USB3 mATX boards I installed all the time are more than capable in overclocking at least 650 MHz from base speed. The regular ATX Boards also work as well but never tried them.

Most of the 95W rated Athlon II X4s can be overclocked up to 4.00 GHz easily by using bus-overclock. I would say 3.90 GHz is the right stable number. Maximum speed it can take is 4.2GHz before blue screen comes in. Find CPU ratio in BIOS, and type in 250 number starting, plus set the memory RAM to 1066 first with 1600MHz RAM you're using, and go on from there.

 

[maddogmcgee]

J1900 plays mkv 23fps without stuttering like all sb and to a small degree ib. Even if its 7gen gpu its fixed here as hw is.

Add its a dirt cheap cpu/machine.

Twitch streaming is rather CPu intensive. I believe twitch streaming is flash based which increases performance needs. I had a E-450 laptop that I tried to use for Twitch and it was nowhere near close to fast enough. the J1900 will likely not get to 30fps and will not get 60fps in chrome/IE. For whatever reason, twitch was more resource intensive than Youtube even before it changed to HTML5. A 2500s I have stays around 30-40 fps@ 1680x1050 in chrome during 60fps streams ......you don't want to have a weak CPU for this type of usage or your going to have a bad time.

 

[waltchan]

Edit: If I wanted my friend to have a CPU/APU capable of 1300 single-threaded, I would hook him up with one of my FM2+ MSI A55M boards, and an A4-6300.

MSI A68H board is what you want that has SATA III capability. MSI A55M or A58M only has SATA II, and your solid state drive won't be happy with it.

 

[Vesku]

The thought kind of was, if it can play back 1080P Twitch streams smoothly, then that would be an improvement, and it would save on his electric bill.

Have you looked at sites like Dell and Lenovo Outlet, they have 1 year basic warranties on their "new" refurbs.

Dell Outlet had this when I checked just now:

Inspiron 3647 Small Desktop
Processor: Intel Pentium G3240 Processor (3M Cache, 3.1GHz)
Windows 8.1
500 GB SATA Hard Drive (7200 RPM)
4 GB DDR3 1600MHz
Tray load DVD Drive (Reads and Writes to DVD/CD)

$259

Inspiron 3647 Small Desktop
Processor: Intel Core 4th Generation i3-4160 Processor (3M Cache, 3.60 GHz)
Windows 8.1
1 TB SATA Hard Drive (7200 RPM)
4 GB DDR3 1600MHz
Tray load DVD Drive (Reads and Writes to DVD/CD)
Dell Outlet Inspiron 3647 Small Desktop

$329

Lenovo Outlet:

ThinkCentre E73
Processor: Intel® Pentium® Processor G3220 (3M Cache, 3.00 GHz)
Operating system: Windows 8 Professional 64 - English
Display: None - Desktop
Graphics: Intel® Graphics Media Accelerator HD
Memory: 2 GB PC3-12800 DDR3 SDRAM 1600MHz UDIMM Memory
Hard Drive: 500GB, 7200RPM Serial ATA 3.5" Hard Drive
Optical Drive: DVD Recordable Serial ATA

$233.22

 

[waltchan]

Try this, Acer i3-4160 with Windows 7 from Acer outlet store, lowest price you'll find in this country:

$239.99

http://www.ebay.com/itm/251878172122

Already purchased two for myself. Sold both the i3-4160 processors for $118 shipped each and replaced them to Celeron G1840 for $35 each at Micro Center. Now only cost $155 each for me.

Play it smart, this is the best deal you can find. A Celeron G1840 for the same price as J1900 with future upgrades.

 

[Vesku]

Yes, but 3 month vs 1 year warranty. I'd still probably go with that Acer though, an everyday use computer with faulty hardware (bad or completely unchecked refurb) should be noticed in that 90 day window they offer and you get a decent i3 for $90 less. I'm a bit wary of those short 1-3 month warranties if the machine is going to someone who only uses their computer infrequently, they often won't notice or wait to long to tell you about any issues.

 

[VirtualLarry]

C'mon guys, this isn't, "let's spend whatever on a new PC for a friend". We're talking, $100+ (but very small plus) upgrade. I already have the G3258 + H81 combo (cost me $90, would have to add DDR3 RAM), the J1900 refurb PC I would have to purchase, and the MSI A55M FM2+ board and A4-6300 I already have (have to add DDR3 RAM).

And if I were buying him an entire $200+ PC, I already have a Sandy Bridge i3 3.4Ghz Lenovo PC I picked up for $187. Still NIB. But I'm not, not unless he pays me for half of it, and he has no money right now.

 

[waltchan]

Yes, but 3 month vs 1 year warranty. I'd still probably go with that Acer though, an everyday use computer with faulty hardware (bad or completely unchecked refurb) should be noticed in that 90 day window they offer and you get a decent i3 for $90 less.

Actually, this Acer is a fully-checked refurb. There's a paper in the box stating all functions and hardware checked and inspected with a 90 day warranty (that's good enough for $155 each with Celeron G1840, I'm happy).

Buy this Acer i3-4160 PC for $239.99 and downgrade it to a Celeron processor is your best-bet and lowest-price.

 

[Vesku]

C'mon guys, this isn't, "let's spend whatever on a new PC for a friend". We're talking, $100+ (but very small plus) upgrade. I already have the G3258 + H81 combo (cost me $90, would have to add DDR3 RAM), the J1900 refurb PC I would have to purchase, and the MSI A55M FM2+ board and A4-6300 I already have (have to add DDR3 RAM).

And if I were buying him an entire $200+ PC, I already have a Sandy Bridge i3 3.4Ghz Lenovo PC I picked up for $187. Still NIB. But I'm not, not unless he pays me for half of it, and he has no money right now.

Then offer him either the G3258 or A4-6300, you said he already has a SSD. Should be a peppy enough change for watching video and such.

 

[VirtualLarry]

Then offer him either the G3258 or A4-6300, you said he already has a SSD. Should be a peppy enough change for watching video and such.

I've been trying to "sell" him on the G3258 combo. He asked last night how much his PC was worth. I told him, then he told me to make him an offer. I said I wasn't going to offer cash for his old parts, but I'd offer him a G3258 combo for his old CPU + RAM. (I could care less about his board, although it still works.)
He didn't sound interested.

 

[waltchan]

I've been trying to "sell" him on the G3258 combo. He asked last night how much his PC was worth. I told him, then he told me to make him an offer. I said I wasn't going to offer cash for his old parts, but I'd offer him a G3258 combo for his old CPU + RAM. (I could care less about his board, although it still works.)
He didn't sound interested.

Well, if this is the case, at least you can offer him a new Gigabyte GA-78LMT-USB3 motherboard for $50 AR (sometimes $40 AR if on-sale) at Newegg, while keeping the same processor and SSD, and donate him some unwanted DDR3 RAMs you no longer need. You can overclock it up to 4.00 GHz easily using bus-overclock, and he'll be happy.

 

[VirtualLarry]

I just don't know that spending any money on a new mobo, with a slightly inferior chipset (760G versus 780G) would be money well spent.

I do also have a Biostar TA970 mobo that I picked up Open Box from Newegg for around $60. I had though of offering him that, and 8GB of DDR3. He could use his existing CPU for now, and then I could sell him my Thuban 1045T, or he could get an FX-83xxE CPU from Newegg or MC, and upgrade to an 8-core.

He keeps saying he wants to do streaming, but he doesn't have the hardware yet, and I don't think his PC, as it is currently, would be up to broadcasting 1080P streams, if it can barely decode them.

Edit: Also, I have reservations overclocking a 95W CPU 33% using a bus overclock. At the least, I would have to get him a new cooler too, and he would have to keep it maintained and dust-free (as much as possible).

It just doesn't seem as wise a solution, as dropping in a known-stable 3.6Ghz G3258 + H81 mobo + 8GB RAM.