CCNA/CCDA Boot Camp

[JRock]

Any of you ever been to a CCNA, MCSE or similar Boot Camp? I was trying to do self study but between work, the wife and kid it seems like I am lucky to get an hour in a night. If I shell out the $3200 for this 6 day course and pass the exams will I feel as though I actually know something or do they touch each topic so briefly as just to get you though the test? If that's the case I think I will pass on it... Just looking to get some input... TIA.

 

[ScottMac]

The boot camps are usually better to hit "once you have a clue" (i.e., have some study under your belt) and you want to reinforce the knowledge you have and fill in the blanks.

They're long days, and the information is flying fast & furious. Fatigue sets in by about day three ...

If you go into a boot camp "cold" you may retain enough to pass the test, but are otherwise useless for most things "on the job."

Of course, everyone is different and learns differently, so it might be a gold mine for you, or it might be a toxic waste dump ... you would be the best person to know where you fall on that scale.

$3200 is a pretty good chunk of change ... IMHO, you'd probably do better to study for a bit before going to a boot camp.

FWIW

Scott

 

[JRock]

Originally posted by: ScottMac
If you go into a boot camp "cold" you may retain enough to pass the test, but are otherwise useless for most things "on the job."

I passed my Network+ with ease and I have had hands on experience with a lot of equipment here at work. 2600, 3600 and 3800 Series Routers, 2950, 3750 Series Switches and MDS Fabric Switches. As well as PIX and ASA Security Appliances. I have the "on the job" part down for the most part, its the crazy stuff they pull out of their a$$ come exam day that I am worried about.

 

[MrDudeMan]

Originally posted by: JRock

Originally posted by: ScottMac
If you go into a boot camp "cold" you may retain enough to pass the test, but are otherwise useless for most things "on the job."

I passed my Network+ with ease and I have had hands on experience with a lot of equipment here at work. 2600, 3600 and 3800 Series Routers, 2950, 3750 Series Switches and MDS Fabric Switches. As well as PIX and ASA Security Appliances. I have the "on the job" part down for the most part, its the crazy stuff they pull out of their a$$ come exam day that I am worried about.

Then you seem to have at least background and some basics. You really should read the whole book and try to learn it yourself before you go, though, because going to class will really reinforce it and make it useful. No one learns everything they need/want to know the first time, especially in that short of a time frame. I think it would be useful to take the class if you prepared for it.

 

[ForumMaster]

i haven't but i completely agree with ScottMac. it would get boring. it's difficult to absorb that much info so quickly. also, experience is much more valuable then memorizing the material. in 6 days, you aren't going to have much time to do that. I'm lucky and my high school offers CCNA as a course. next year I'm going to apply for the CCNA test hopefully. memorizing stuff isn't as effective as actually doing labs which we do.

 

[MrDudeMan]

Originally posted by: ForumMaster
i haven't but i completely agree with ScottMac. it would get boring. it's difficult to absorb that much info so quickly. also, experience is much more valuable then memorizing the material. in 6 days, you aren't going to have much time to do that. I'm lucky and my high school offers CCNA as a course. next year I'm going to apply for the CCNA test hopefully. memorizing stuff isn't as effective as actually doing labs which we do.

Learning isn't the same as memorizing. It's only memorizing when you are trying to soak it up for the test and then forget it. There is a huge difference. Don't be an engineer if you can't break that habit.

 

[Podolak]

I went to a MCSE boot camp to pass the 2003 MCSE. It worked perfectly for that purpose, but that purpose alone. I had already been in the field for many years and had done a lot of reading/study before hand. The only reason I went to the boot camp was to learn all of the nitty-gritty details for the test. The camp definitely helped me pass the test. However, I wouldn't say I learned a whole lot during it. If you feel "green" you are far better off working in the field, experimenting with your own servers and taking an in-depth months long course to familiarize yourself with the material. After that jumping into a boot camp and passing the test is a perfectly reasonable option.

As far as the boot camp itself, as already stated it is very tiring. You are either in class or study/memorizing almost all of the time. I probably had 6-8 hours a day for eating/sleeping. Otherwise I was studying / memorizing material. Its a tough experience but it does accomplish its goal. I was in a class of 10 and 8 of us left with the MCSE. The 9th had to retake one test when he got home and eventually got it. I'm not sure about the 10th, lost contact with him.

Good luck with whatever you decide.

 

[jlbenedict]

Originally posted by: Podolak
I went to a MCSE boot camp to pass the 2003 MCSE. It worked perfectly for that purpose, but that purpose alone. I had already been in the field for many years and had done a lot of reading/study before hand. The only reason I went to the boot camp was to learn all of the nitty-gritty details for the test. The camp definitely helped me pass the test. However, I wouldn't say I learned a whole lot during it. If you feel "green" you are far better off working in the field, experimenting with your own servers and taking an in-depth months long course to familiarize yourself with the material. After that jumping into a boot camp and passing the test is a perfectly reasonable option.

As far as the boot camp itself, as already stated it is very tiring. You are either in class or study/memorizing almost all of the time. I probably had 6-8 hours a day for eating/sleeping. Otherwise I was studying / memorizing material. Its a tough experience but it does accomplish its goal. I was in a class of 10 and 8 of us left with the MCSE. The 9th had to retake one test when he got home and eventually got it. I'm not sure about the 10th, lost contact with him.

Good luck with whatever you decide.

Damn.. pretty good percentage rate and odds

 

[Podolak]

Originally posted by: jlbenedict

Originally posted by: Podolak
I went to a MCSE boot camp to pass the 2003 MCSE. It worked perfectly for that purpose, but that purpose alone. I had already been in the field for many years and had done a lot of reading/study before hand. The only reason I went to the boot camp was to learn all of the nitty-gritty details for the test. The camp definitely helped me pass the test. However, I wouldn't say I learned a whole lot during it. If you feel "green" you are far better off working in the field, experimenting with your own servers and taking an in-depth months long course to familiarize yourself with the material. After that jumping into a boot camp and passing the test is a perfectly reasonable option.

As far as the boot camp itself, as already stated it is very tiring. You are either in class or study/memorizing almost all of the time. I probably had 6-8 hours a day for eating/sleeping. Otherwise I was studying / memorizing material. Its a tough experience but it does accomplish its goal. I was in a class of 10 and 8 of us left with the MCSE. The 9th had to retake one test when he got home and eventually got it. I'm not sure about the 10th, lost contact with him.

Good luck with whatever you decide.

Damn.. pretty good percentage rate and odds

Yes, it was indeed. However, all 10 already had jobs in IT and were fairly experienced. There certainly wasn't anyone "green".

 

[alkemyst]

Originally posted by: JRock
Any of you ever been to a CCNA, MCSE or similar Boot Camp? I was trying to do self study but between work, the wife and kid it seems like I am lucky to get an hour in a night. If I shell out the $3200 for this 6 day course and pass the exams will I feel as though I actually know something or do they touch each topic so briefly as just to get you though the test? If that's the case I think I will pass on it... Just looking to get some input... TIA.

Cisco sometimes hosts free bootcamps. I attended one over 6 weeks, for 2.5 hours once a week.

You should have read the book(s) through at least once and have an understanding. The biggest benefits of a bootcamp is asking the questions on the stuff you are unclear on.

Another big benefit is they usually know what is going to be on the test somewhat and can steer you to the best bang for buck on time spent studying.

Things like cable lengths should not be really focused on if you don't know subnetting.

My brother is a CCIE/CISSP/etc etc etc if you have any questions pm me. He works for one of the top Cisco companies in the world.

 

[alkemyst]

Originally posted by: MrDudeMan

Originally posted by: ForumMaster
i haven't but i completely agree with ScottMac. it would get boring. it's difficult to absorb that much info so quickly. also, experience is much more valuable then memorizing the material. in 6 days, you aren't going to have much time to do that. I'm lucky and my high school offers CCNA as a course. next year I'm going to apply for the CCNA test hopefully. memorizing stuff isn't as effective as actually doing labs which we do.

Learning isn't the same as memorizing. It's only memorizing when you are trying to soak it up for the test and then forget it. There is a huge difference. Don't be an engineer if you can't break that habit.

Unfortunately the beginning tests are a lot of memorization. Even subnetting no one really does freehand, but you have to on the test as calculators are not allowed.

There have been many I know that can build effective and optimized networks, but failed at the CCNA level due to not knowing some of the textbook crap.

I have heard CCNP is a lot easier as each test is more focused unlike the CCNA broad spectrum.

 

[spidey07]

CCNP/CCDP are very difficult now with the new tests.

Most of the questions cannot be memorized and you're tested on if you truly understand the concepts. Pretty good move IMHO.

 

[James Bond]

You definitely need to know the material before you go in.

If you go in blind you probably won't pass, but even if you do, you will lose 90% of the information within a month.

 

[Kelemvor]

Originally posted by: alkemyst

Cisco sometimes hosts free bootcamps. I attended one over 6 weeks, for 2.5 hours once a week.

Any info on where and when they might do this? I'd sure love to attend something like this but many thigns don't come to the Milwaukee, WI area since Chicago is just a few hours away. And unfortunately I don't have a couple grand laying aroudn to go to a boot camp or to outfit my own lab at home. hmm.

 

[Feldenak]

Originally posted by: Kelemvor

Originally posted by: alkemyst

Cisco sometimes hosts free bootcamps. I attended one over 6 weeks, for 2.5 hours once a week.

Any info on where and when they might do this? I'd sure love to attend something like this but many thigns don't come to the Milwaukee, WI area since Chicago is just a few hours away. And unfortunately I don't have a couple grand laying aroudn to go to a boot camp or to outfit my own lab at home. hmm.

No kidding. Free education? Sign me up.

 

[alkemyst]

Call around to you local Gold and Platinum Partners esp those that do installations and see if they are willing to host a boot camp. If you have a Cisco office near you, call them.

 

[m1ldslide1]

Agree with others on the fatigue factor. I've done several global knowledge week-long classes, and it gets really hard to focus after day 3. The last one I did was BGP about a month ago, and I knew most of the information going in. That said, by day 5 I was still going cross-eyed and ready to get out of town.

It's great that you have the OJT prior to considering a class like this. But $3200 is a lot of money, and if you can afford it just make sure to make the most of it. Like others have said, study after class, stay ahead of the class in your reading, make sure you have an high-level understanding of every concept when you go in so that you're not learning anything brand new, just mastering the details. My $.02.

 

[ScottFern]

I am looking into taking the MCSA 2003 Exams and I have NOT read all the books, but I have been working in a WinXP/Win2k3 Server environment for roughly a year now. What is the best company to do the MCSA through?

 

[alkemyst]

Originally posted by: ScottFern
I am looking into taking the MCSA 2003 Exams and I have NOT read all the books, but I have been working in a WinXP/Win2k3 Server environment for roughly a year now. What is the best company to do the MCSA through?

I am not sure on the chicago area by looking at your profile, but what is your budget and how much time can you contribute.

Best is usually whatever team has the best 1st pass rate in the shortest time.

However, if you are working full time the best is usually what can accommodate that schedule.

 

[ScottFern]

Originally posted by: alkemyst

Originally posted by: ScottFern
I am looking into taking the MCSA 2003 Exams and I have NOT read all the books, but I have been working in a WinXP/Win2k3 Server environment for roughly a year now. What is the best company to do the MCSA through?

I am not sure on the chicago area by looking at your profile, but what is your budget and how much time can you contribute.

Best is usually whatever team has the best 1st pass rate in the shortest time.

However, if you are working full time the best is usually what can accommodate that schedule.

I talked to my boss and he said a 7-8 day program would be acceptable however it the pricing he is more worried about. I told him roughly 3k while I have been seeing 5k prices lately.

Yes, I am in Chicago.

 

[freegeeks]

I learned a lot using dynamips, you can build your own virtual lab....

 

[alkemyst]

A 7-8 day program usually isn't the best way for a novice to do this. The quick camps are great for a guru to learn the microsoft way though.

Your best bet IMHO is to take a 2-3 month program that mets weekly and read and study in between each class. Here you should have read through all the material at least once totally and then re-read each section prior to covering it in class and have questions ready.

There are still a lot of schools out there that can create a paper-MCSE though...if that's what you are looking to do. They will teach you all the possible questions (in theory anyway) and you basically just remember answers.