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Carmack discusses development on consoles

C

CasioTech

Diamond Member
http://www.gametrailers.com/player/37903.html


he mentions how much of a PITA developing on the ps3 is.

and then he discusses how they have to pay to license each dvd so they try to compress the game to two dvds instead of 3 dvds.


EDIT: Part two.

http://www.gametrailers.com/player/37950.html

part 3 discusses that realtime graphics are VERY close to what we see in movies like wall-e and will be almost identical in the foreseeable future.

http://www.gametrailers.com/player/38003.html

and 4

http://www.gametrailers.com/player/38005.html

part 4 discusses iphones and his kid, so dari you better not watch that one.
 
OK, we get it. PS3 is hard to program for. Licensing sucks for everyone because we care more about our bottomline than producing quality products.

Why do people follow this guy like he's some type of hero or something? He only has two franchises and hasn't shown innovation in over a decade.

If Carmack made a video of his diarrhea after a night at Taco Bell, would you be interested?
 
no, who cares about the guy, it's just a good video in the sense I learned things about licensing dvd's and that ps3 is difficult to develop for, coming from a seasoned programmer and programming staff.. How can we expect to see good software when only a handful of studios can make good games for it?
 
Originally posted by: Dari
Why do people follow this guy like he's some type of hero or something? He only has two franchises and hasn't shown innovation in over a decade.
Click to expand...

Facepalm, you have no clue.
 
The PS3 may be hard to program for, but the 360 only has DVDs to work with. 🙁 1 BluRay disc vs. 3 DVDs. No use of the Hard drive for cacheing on the 360 = Lesser quality textures/compression/etc. That wouldnt be a problem with the PS3, because they ALL have some sort of internal HDD.

I'll stick with my PC, thanks. 😉
 
Interesting that they have to pay a license fee per DVD to Microsoft. I can kind of see why that would be the case, because if the license fee was per product then you could sell a 3 game set and only pay one license fee; if it were per game, then something like The Orange Box would be charged multiple license fees. I really think a single game spanning multiple DVDs should only pay a single license fee though.

That pretty much confirms my suspicions that they have to pay the license fee even on discs that are not sold. I remember when someone was looking for a replacement for a scratched disc, I was shocked by how much EA charges to replace Xbox 360 and PS3 games ($25 or $30 I think). And they charge a different amount to replace games on different systems. License fees would explain the difference. They really shouldn't have to pay license fees on replacements for damaged discs.

Originally posted by: Dari
Licensing sucks for everyone because we care more about our bottomline than producing quality products.
Click to expand...

If the fee is ~$5 per disc, then the jump from 2 discs to 3 would be a pretty significant reduction of the profit that would be left over after development costs, etc.
 
Originally posted by: Dari
OK, we get it. PS3 is hard to program for. Licensing sucks for everyone because we care more about our bottomline than producing quality products.

Why do people follow this guy like he's some type of hero or something? He only has two franchises and hasn't shown innovation in over a decade.

If Carmack made a video of his diarrhea after a night at Taco Bell, would you be interested?
Click to expand...

Because despite having an incredibly nerdy voice the guy gives amazing interviews and talks. He's been talking to the community for YEARS now. And part of that community has often times even been other developers trying to pick up a thing or 2 from the guy. Why do people follow him? Because his shoelace is fucking smarter than you.
 
Originally posted by: Miklebud
The PS3 may be hard to program for, but the 360 only has DVDs to work with. 🙁 1 BluRay disc vs. 3 DVDs. No use of the Hard drive for cacheing on the 360 = Lesser quality textures/compression/etc. That wouldnt be a problem with the PS3, because they ALL have some sort of internal HDD.

I'll stick with my PC, thanks. 😉
Click to expand...

The 360 does use caching when a HDD is attached. The upcoming Fall Update will allow an entire game to be copied to the HDD as well.

After playing Blue Dragon, the multiple DVD thing isn't an issue for me. You have to change them so rarely compared to the amount of time that you spend playing that it is ultimately insignificant. As long as we don't return to the days of my first PC game - D&D Pool of Radiance on 5.25" floppies. I was swapping disks like a mofo.

I'm sure MS will work with ID on the DVD licensing issue. They've already put out a couple of multiple disk RPGs and have FFXIII to deal with as well.
 
Originally posted by: Queasy
As long as we don't return to the days of my first PC game - D&D Pool of Radiance on 5.25" floppies. I was swapping disks like a mofo.
Click to expand...
I gave a friend, Star Wars Battle Chess for his B-Day bitd. I think it was 14 1.44's and took up about 70% of his HDD. He ended up uninstalling it shortly after I gave it to him. Good times.

 
Originally posted by: Queasy
Originally posted by: Miklebud
The PS3 may be hard to program for, but the 360 only has DVDs to work with. 🙁 1 BluRay disc vs. 3 DVDs. No use of the Hard drive for cacheing on the 360 = Lesser quality textures/compression/etc. That wouldnt be a problem with the PS3, because they ALL have some sort of internal HDD.

I'll stick with my PC, thanks. 😉
Click to expand...

The 360 does use caching when a HDD is attached. The upcoming Fall Update will allow an entire game to be copied to the HDD as well.

After playing Blue Dragon, the multiple DVD thing isn't an issue for me. You have to change them so rarely compared to the amount of time that you spend playing that it is ultimately insignificant. As long as we don't return to the days of my first PC game - D&D Pool of Radiance on 5.25" floppies. I was swapping disks like a mofo.

I'm sure MS will work with ID on the DVD licensing issue. They've already put out a couple of multiple disk RPGs and have FFXIII to deal with as well.
Click to expand...

Riven with the 6 CD set wasn't any better.
 
This just in: a longtime PC developer doesnt like dealing with unusual architecture and doesnt like to be constrained to any sort of hardware limitations. Stop the presses!

That being said, carmack knows what he's talking about - the PS3 is a pain in the ass to deal with, and when youre used to having no limitations on storage space, a DVD can seem quite restrictive.

Theres no question that a BR has more space than a DVD, and that devs would want that space. Theyd also want 1000 times the processing power and memory too. 3 years of the 360 has shown us that the DVD isnt an impediment to making great games, and thats not going to change from here on in.

A good console dev is creative and makes the best use of the space they have just like they work with the processing power and memory they have. You cant have your cake and eat it too, as they say.
 
Originally posted by: skace
Originally posted by: Dari
OK, we get it. PS3 is hard to program for. Licensing sucks for everyone because we care more about our bottomline than producing quality products.

Why do people follow this guy like he's some type of hero or something? He only has two franchises and hasn't shown innovation in over a decade.

If Carmack made a video of his diarrhea after a night at Taco Bell, would you be interested?
Click to expand...

Because despite having an incredibly nerdy voice the guy gives amazing interviews and talks. He's been talking to the community for YEARS now. And part of that community has often times even been other developers trying to pick up a thing or 2 from the guy. Why do people follow him? Because his shoelace is fucking smarter than you.
Click to expand...

Right...like when I went on a tech website a couple of years ago and I saw a headline that Carmack has had a baby daughter. I was like who gives a fuck? Congrats to his family and all but why the fuck would that be tech news? It just goes to show that some of you are just ass kissers.

I think Carmack, deservedly or not, is a primadonna and people like you are insecure little twats who wish they were him.
 
Originally posted by: MmmSkyscraper
Originally posted by: Dari
Why do people follow this guy like he's some type of hero or something? He only has two franchises and hasn't shown innovation in over a decade.
Click to expand...

Facepalm, you have no clue.
Click to expand...

I don't play PC games so please enlighten me.
 
Originally posted by: Dari
I don't play PC games so please enlighten me.
Click to expand...

id software (spearheaded by John Carmack and crew) revolutionized the first person shooter genre and 3d gaming in general (thanks to GL quake, which was one of the first hit titles for 3D gaming).

Read more here, highlights:
The game credited as the first FPS is Wolfenstein 3D. Released in 1992 by id software, Wolfenstein 3D took the gaming world by storm with its textured 3D graphics, high quality sound (at the time), and unique playing style.

ID Software struck another hit with its release of Quake in 1996. The game was massively popular and was similar in gameplay to the Doom series. Quake was the first FPS to move from 2-dimensional pop-up enemies to fully 3-dimensional models.
Click to expand...

Carmack is regarded by many to be one of the best video game engine programmers in history. His engines have been licensed by countless companies and his code has found its way into games like Medal of Honor, Call of Duty, Half-Life, Star Wars Jedi Knight II: Jedi Outcast and many others.
 
Originally posted by: Schadenfroh
Originally posted by: Dari
I don't play PC games so please enlighten me.
Click to expand...

id software (spearheaded by John Carmack and crew) revolutionized the first person shooter genre.

Read more here, highlights:
The game credited as the first FPS is Wolfenstein 3D. Released in 1992 by id software, Wolfenstein 3D took the gaming world by storm with its textured 3D graphics, high quality sound (at the time), and unique playing style.

ID Software struck another hit with its release of Quake in 1996. The game was massively popular and was similar in gameplay to the Doom series. Quake was the first FPS to move from 2-dimensional pop-up enemies to fully 3-dimensional models.
Click to expand...

Carmack is regarded by many to be one of the best video game engine programmers in history. His engines have been licensed by countless companies and his code has found its way into games like Medal of Honor, Call of Duty, Half-Life, Star Wars Jedi Knight II: Jedi Outcast and many others.
Click to expand...

What has he done recently?
 
Originally posted by: Dari
What has he done recently?
Click to expand...

He has given up hope for a hell on earth, so he is working with Armadillo Aerospace to create a commercial spacecraft capable of finding a portal to hell in space. (joking of course)

On a more serious note, there is usually a sizable amount of time between engine releases from id.

As far as game engines, ID Tech 5 is the next big id software engine that will be available for third-parties licensing. Doom 4 and Rage will be the first two games to demonstrate the capabilities of the engine to the public and potential developers who may wish to make use of it.

He also gives back to the community by open sourcing all of his engines after a certain amount of time has passed (like IdTech 3, aka the quake 3 engine) to allow the community to make their own games using his legacy engines for free. Check sourceforge.net for the many freeware / opensource ongoing community developed games / mods made using the engines that he has released to the public.
 
Originally posted by: Schadenfroh
Originally posted by: Dari
What has he done recently?
Click to expand...

He has given up hope for a hell on earth, so he is working with Armadillo Aerospace to create a commercial spacecraft capable of finding a portal to hell in space. (joking of course)

On a more serious note, there is usually a sizable amount of time between engine releases from id.

As far as game engines, ID Tech 5 is the next big id software engine that will be available for third-parties licensing. Doom 4 and Rage will be the first two games to demonstrate the capabilities of the engine to the public and potential developers who may wish to make use of it.

He also gives back to the community by open sourcing all of his engines after a certain amount of time has passed (like IdTech 3, aka the quake 3 engine) to allow the community to make their own games using his legacy engines for free. Check sourceforge.net for the many freeware / opensource ongoing community developed games / mods made using the engines that he has released to the public.
Click to expand...

Sounds like a standup guy. But I still don't know why his baby made tech news. That had me second-guessing what he meant to others.
 
because when your video game idol has a kid, you want to know about it. just like brangelina...

I don't know how a guy like that gets a girl, he must be incredibly boring and has a twisted mind but with all those millions, a girl can look past it all.
 
Originally posted by: Dari
Sounds like a standup guy. But I still don't know why his baby made tech news. That had me second-guessing what he meant to others.
Click to expand...
His wife is actually in the gaming industry, too. They're a relatively famous couple in this industry, and since he's _the_ celebrity, I guess it makes sense to cover his personal stuff. *shrugs*

In any event, when he speaks about technical stuff, other people listen, and rightfully so.
 
Originally posted by: Dari
OK, we get it. PS3 is hard to program for. Licensing sucks for everyone because we care more about our bottomline than producing quality products.

Why do people follow this guy like he's some type of hero or something? He only has two franchises and hasn't shown innovation in over a decade.

If Carmack made a video of his diarrhea after a night at Taco Bell, would you be interested?
Click to expand...

Is that even a question? YES!
 
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