Nov 8, 2012
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Personally... at 15 years in... with that pay... with all of those benefits (presuming the pension is good) + 5 weeks of vacation (and more)...with that low stress... and a 20 minute commute...

I wouldn't switch. I can almost guarantee if you switch you will lose one of those above. I've been moving around over the years just trying to find the low stress benefit.

Speaking of consulting - that's where I come from. I doubt you will get low stress. Also do you have a family? That's a major determining factor IMO.
 

Red Squirrel

No Lifer
May 24, 2003
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Considering how much money you make, if it's low stress and easy, I would just stick to that. As long as the train wreck is not directly impacting you, just watch it unfold while you do your job. Find a side hobby instead if you want to do more. Or even side business, if your company allows that, then you can always end up doing it full time.

It's not always greener on the other side. You could be trading minor issues for bigger ones, and on top of that you're basically starting over in terms of seniority, vacation weeks, etc if you change.
 

Kaido

Elite Member & Kitchen Overlord
Feb 14, 2004
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A big question is this: where do you want to get your fulfillment from?

You have a great job now, with lots of benefits. The problem with becoming comfortable is that you sometimes get bored. But, as you've seen, management = politics. I've held a couple of management positions over the last 15+ years in the workforce and I learned that the actual work of management = babysitting. I am not a ladder-climber; I eventually discovered that I am not financially motivated, which is to say that once I started making enough to maintain my lifestyle, I don't feel the need to pursue more money - there are a lot of jobs available that pay better than what I do now, but I'm also really happy with what I do now (freelance IT, basically computer admin consulting). I found working in management to be frustrating because I didn't get to do what I love (play with computers) & also because managers are typically extremely sensitive to embarrassment & criticism, so there's this whole insane world of stupid, petty politics that goes on within companies that I discovered I didn't really care about. The pay was good, but as I like to be busy & work a lot (I average 70 hours a week, 6 days a week), it was not very fulfilling for me.

I've bounced between corporations, small biz, and consulting in my adult working life. Right now, I do freelance IT. The pay is decent, but the current state of healthcare in America makes being independent difficult, due to the high cost. Business is good & has generally always been good, because nearly all companies require some form of computing to operate in today's world, and not all companies have the resources to hire a full-time IT person on staff (payroll, benefits, etc.). I have a variety of clients in everything from the food industry (temperature monitoring, security systems, POS setups, etc.) to hi-tech shops with all kinds of cool computer-assisted machines, like 3D printers & CNC cutters. I'm not really breaking any new ground in the IT world, as I work in a support function, but I really enjoy helping people directly & also have a lot of fun getting hands-on time with a variety of industrial techie toys. So for me, I like what I do, I work a lot, and I get a lot of fulfillment out of my job. I also enjoy being able to pick & choose my customers. I've had to "fire" insane customers before, and it's great to not be stuck under a difficult boss at-will.

Right now, you have a stable job that is providing for yourself & your family, which you can ride out to retirement. You want to climb the corporate ladder, but the politics are unappealing. You can jump ship, but there are stability & seniority risks involved. Thus, we loop back to the original question: where do you want to get your fulfillment from? For a lot of people, their jobs are their "hobby" or their "baby" and that's what defines them & what's "who they are". For other people, they simply haven't fleshed out what they like to do outside of work, and so they don't have a clear focus on what really drives them or motivates them. Either way is fine, getting fulfillment from work or from outside of work, but you have to figure out what does it for you. I don't have a zillion dollars to blow on crazy tech toys every day, but thanks to my work, I'm able to play with everything from robotic arms to package-making CNC devices to candy-dipping machines. I didn't enjoy feeling like just another cog in the corporate machine, and I like seeing the direct results of my work, so my current job has turned out to be an excellent fit for me.

The question is, what does it for YOU? The reality of life is that you will work, retire, and die. Not to get morbid, but on your deathbed, do you want to look back and see years of dealing with harassment politics while working in a highly-paid management position? Some people really enjoy that (see our current president, for example), but others don't. Some people value family time, or vacations, or material goods, or hobbies they can deep-dive into. Lots of options out there...the question isn't so much about survival, as much as thriving. So, how do you want to spend your time for the next 15 years?
 
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Nov 8, 2012
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Yes, the pension is pretty good. I could be here up to another 15 years or so to leave without any penalties and most of a full pension. Minimum of 11 more to leave with something substantial.

I’m married but no kids and none coming. My wife is fairly high income most years but has essentially no benefits. Generally I think I should stay and find a way to not be so involved in the day to day politics of the place but with having 15 years in it’s hard to not be. I’m one of the senior employees and quite well respected by the staff. I have always gotten along with management and usually done pretty well with the senior managers, although the current one really doesn’t like me much.

I hear you about consulting and believe it 100%. I guess what I’m thinking is the trade offs might be worth it. It’s hard to go to work and concentrate on doing your job when senior management is actively making things harder all the time.

Since you have no kids, consulting can still work if you REALLY want to. With kids I wouldn't touch it. Either way most consulting is an up or out mentality. It's really a crapshoot of running into a manager/senior manager that likes you enough to voice for you to be promoted. Sometimes you get lucky, sometimes you don't. The politics is there 100% of the time in consulting - it never goes away.

But yeah, I would stick around. Do your typical 9 to 5 and head out the door without hearing all the chit-chat and political talks.
 
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Midwayman

Diamond Member
Jan 28, 2000
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I'd ask yourself why you are trying to move up. Do you really just want more money? Do you actually want to manage people? Managing people is a totally different job as you're seeing. There is always going to be some BS political thing that you're dealing with. It sounds like you have a really cushy gig now. I'd personally just keep my head down and enjoy the ride. It doesn't sound like you're into the drama.
 
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Nov 20, 2009
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Sounds like you work for the telephone company. AT&T? You almost describe my environment, which is never going to change.
 

squirrel dog

Diamond Member
Oct 10, 1999
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I did at&t for 40+ years , leaving as an operations manager . It was for me a lot like the tv show survivor . Out play , out live , out last . So stay strong .
 
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snoopy7548

Diamond Member
Jan 1, 2005
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With 15 years already invested, I say just stick it out.

Kaido gave some excellent advice. Don't find meaning or fulfillment in your job; find it in yourself. Just keep telling yourself, "No matter how bad the trainwreck, I still get paid the same."
 
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zinfamous

No Lifer
Jul 12, 2006
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"close to getting 5th week of vacation" ...what does that mean? Did it take you 15 years to accumulate those 5 total weeks....so you haven't taken more than 5-7 days off per year in all that time? Is that true?

Or is it a shorter accumulation time and you are just re-accumulating that time. If the former: holy shit what an awful place to work.
 

Red Squirrel

No Lifer
May 24, 2003
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"close to getting 5th week of vacation" ...what does that mean? Did it take you 15 years to accumulate those 5 total weeks....so you haven't taken more than 5-7 days off per year in all that time? Is that true?

Or is it a shorter accumulation time and you are just re-accumulating that time. If the former: holy shit what an awful place to work.

Probably means to be able to have 5 weeks per year. It takes a while to get to that point. I'm at a bit over 10 years working at my job and I get 4 weeks. I'm not sure when I get 5, I think it's some odd ball number like 17 years. Or maybe it's actually further, like 20. I think it goes up to 6. Differs between companies though.

My job is shift work though, so I get tons of time off, which is great. I would hate having to go back to an 8x5 job. 2 day weekends are too short.
 
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zinfamous

No Lifer
Jul 12, 2006
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Probably means to be able to have 5 weeks per year. It takes a while to get to that point. I'm at a bit over 10 years working at my job and I get 4 weeks. I'm not sure when I get 5, I think it's some odd ball number like 17 years. Or maybe it's actually further, like 20. I think it goes up to 6. Differs between companies though.

My job is shift work though, so I get tons of time off, which is great. I would hate having to go back to an 8x5 job. 2 day weekends are too short.

Oh I see. I'm generally ignorant of how corporate cubicle monkey world works. I'm only familiar with academic lab bench monkey world.

Anyhoo, OP looks like he's in a good place especially if he's happy enough with his pay and the generally satisfied with work and life. Having decent benefits that help with the wife's lack of benefits is a big deal.