Car problem: loud exhaust noise - flex pipe ?

[rh71]

90 Accord - car has been sounding pretty loud... coming from the underbody... probably a muffler/exhaust problem. Garage calls back and says there's "a hole in the flex pipe"... they say it's the pipe that leads to the engine? Does this sound right to you guys? $150... too much?

Thanx.

 

[KokomoGST]

Just a flex section? Sounds like they don't wanna try to repair the flex section but rather just replace the downpipe completely... you can probably take it to a muffler shop to have it done for less if it really is a busted flex section.
Could be a rusted out resonator or bad cat or something else like that too... all of which a muffler shop would do for cheaper than a general service garage anyways.

 

[Kadarin]

Agreed. Take it to a muffler shop for a 2nd opinion and estimate.

 

[TuffGuy]

could be the resonator. whatever you do, do NOT get it fixed at midas. they wanted to charge me $750 to replace the resonator and exhaust. got it done by my mechanic for $108; he just removed the resonator and exhaust, made a straight-thru pipe and added a quiet muffler.

 

[yakko]

That sounds about right.

 

[rh71]

THx guys. More opinions welcome.

 

[Thegonagle]

Midas sucks!

But that's a plausible explanation and a plausible price from your mechanic. I might even be a little cheap, the new part might be crappy. A Walker (decent brand) flex pipe for my 87 Accord was about $180 for the part at a parts store, plus I spent a few bucks at the dealership for the gaskets and hardware. Sure he could weld the old one it shut again for cheap, but it won't last.

 

[NutBucket]

I'm suprised if its a rust problem. Don't forget your Accord has a Stainless steel exhaust on it. Should quite a while. I hole in the flex pipe isn't uncommon I suppose and the $150 quoted to replace it doesn't sound bad. I think the part itself runs about $100. But you should see if you can't get under there and take a look for yourself. Course, a second opinion would be good to.

<-- Drives a 91 and couldn't be happier.

 

[rh71]

Hey... just got back with the price... $190 for the pipe, $12 for 2 gaskets... $112 for the labor !?!?!?! Does that sound right? Apparently 2 hours to do the job (@ $60/hr).

Also, Garfang, how long did it take you to put that in your 87 Accord? Thx.

 

[ttn1]

Yep that sounds about right. I think I would look around for a garage that has slightly cheaper labor though. I recently took my car in for a headgasket replacement, and the garage charged me $60/hour. This was for a small mom and pop operation. That just seemed a little too much like rape to me.

 

[NutBucket]

$60/hour is a fair labor rate.

 

[rh71]

Well anyone know if it should take 2 hours to do this kinda thing? I will feel better knowing they're not trying to pull a fast one on me.

 

[NutBucket]

The way shops work, for the most part, is as follows. There is literally a book that says it should take xx hours to do xx job. The shop charges for xx hours regardless of how long it takes. If it takes less time, they "make" more money. If it takes them longer they "lose" money. I know that dealers work this way and a shop my friend used to work for (Porsche BMW Mercedes) worked that way as well. If its a mom and pop shop then its a tough call as to whether they are doing that as well.

 

[Thegonagle]

Damn, it wasn't 2 hours. I did need to torch the old nuts and bolts to get them out of there, but it didn't take an incredibly long time.

The parts cost sounds right on ('cept they forgot the 6 new nuts and bolts), but I think the labor should only be an hour. But this was for my '87, a completely different car than your '90. I don't know what your car looks like underneath, I've never had an Accord of this vintage.

What happened to the $150? $150 is much less than $300.

Ask why it takes 2 hours on this particular car?

Also, call the dealership for an estimate on labor, they'd probably know without even looking it up.

 

[NutBucket]

If I remember right, the flex pipe on the 4th gens is welded to the downpipe and then the cat is bolted to it. So if they are just going to replace the flex pipe then they would have to cut it and weld in a new one. If they are just going to replace it then they would just have to unbolt (torch) the downpipe from the manifold and unbolt (torch) the cat.

And the dealers are ridiculous, especially Honda dealers. They quoted me $240 to replace a lock cylinder in the door and $1100 for a clutch. Both estimates including parts. The parts for the clutch were only quoted at $300. I know its a PITA to replace it, but .....

 

[amdskip]

<< The way shops work, for the most part, is as follows. There is literally a book that says it should take xx hours to do xx job. The shop charges for xx hours regardless of how long it takes. If it takes less time, they "make" more money. If it takes them longer they "lose" money. I know that dealers work this way and a shop my friend used to work for (Porsche BMW Mercedes) worked that way as well. If its a mom and pop shop then its a tough call as to whether they are doing that as well. >>



Exactly and this is why mechanics work so very fast in shops like this. The shorter it takes to get a job, the more money they are going to make.

 

[Thegonagle]

I know about the cost at dealerships, but I still buy lots of my parts there, because they are often better (not always though.) You've got to shop around.

At any rate, I was more concerned about the time it takes them to do it right, how Honda specifies, not what it would cost.

If the check engine light is on, I don't trust Bubba and Jed (refering to anyone with a room-temp IQ) down the street to solve it correctly the first time. Do they even know (or care) how to read a code from the computer, or will they just start throwing parts at it like they did in the old days?

I'm pretty anal about the mechanical maintenace of my cars, because I actually know that if you treat them right, they will be dependable for anything and everything for over 200,000 miles. My Civic has over 150,000 miles on it and it runs like new. Would I trust it to take a long trip? Hell yes, I would, because I know what I've got.

 

[ttn1]

<< $60/hour is a fair labor rate. >>






<< And the dealers are ridiculous, especially Honda dealers. They quoted me $240 to replace a lock cylinder in the door and $1100 for a clutch. >>



The first quote shows why the second quote prices are "fair".

I had my head gasket replaced and they charged 12 hours at $60/hour. I expect this from a dealer, but not from a low overhead Mom and Pop organization. I took it there because they said they sent the head to be reworked and I thought that was the price difference. Well they had the head checked, but nothing was done to it. On top of that they left the main motor mount bolt out. It is my own fault for not checking the garage out more thoroughly.

I still think in the $30-$40/hour range is more likely a "fair" labor rate. That is at least in my area of the country.

 

[rh71]

I'm doing it at Pep Boys... they checked it out for free and quoted me $150 including labor... but just got the actual price today. I just wonder if it'd be cheaper to go to Meineke... I guess the difference now is just the amount of labor hours... if another shop can do it in 1 hour... or willing to say they can