Car Audio: I want a 4 channel amp to power 4 Infinity Kappas

[CTrain]

$70 is really cheap at that place.
Everywhere else has it for $90-100.
Just becareful when buying.
I try to look up more info on that Clarion with no luck.
Even Clarion site gave no info.
That AMP might not have outputs line if you want to connect a 2nd AMP later on. and its not as small as th picture. From other Pics, its about ~14 inches long.

Also, that site and discountave.net are almost identical and they are both in Cali.

 

[Thegonagle]

Originally posted by: CTrain
Anyway cut to the chase, I bought a 4 channel Profile AP1040 from Etronics for $103 shipped(its more now) where crutchfield has it for $150++.

Its a really good AMP. Need sufficient power to run it though.
Really good S/N ratio.
Really good power for a cheap AMP.
It fit under my seat and I have a Honda Civic Si.
That AMP will blow those Kappas easily.

The best recommendation I can ever give is if you ever do DIY AMP install, buy the $25 amp kit from WALMART. Its a Scosche brand and it has everthing you need to install an AMP.
Comes with 4 gauge wires too. The same type kit cost like $70-100 at rip-offs like BB, CC and Frys.
It even comes with a Distrubution block to split the power wire in 2 for a second AMP.

If you really want a super nice Cheap AMP(Its the Cadillac of inexpensive AMP), CarDomain has the US Acoustics USC4085 for $180. I can't seem to find it elsewhere cheaper. Car Domain prices are usually 10-20% higher.
I did see one on Ebay a week ago for ~120 so I should have grabed it.
Us Acoustics AMP require less power to run which is a good thing.

Let me warn you that once you get an AMP hooked up, you might want something better which is why you should just get something decent now. The Profile AP1040 is a really good cheap choice.

Another thing, you can always get a 2 channel amp to run the 4 speakers. By running 2 speakers in each channel, it will run at lower ohms(2 ohms as oppose to 4 ohms) and you actually get more power from the AMP that way but it will also run hotter. Most AMP are 2 ohms stable.

Lanzar, Power Acoustik, Profile, Us Acoustics....those are some inexpensive AMPS that will do the job just fine.

Good stuff. Where did you go to learn about those?

 

[Thegonagle]

Originally posted by: CTrain
$70 is really cheap at that place.
Everywhere else has it for $90-100.
Just becareful when buying.
I try to look up more info on that Clarion with no luck.
Even Clarion site gave no info.
That AMP might not have outputs line if you want to connect a 2nd AMP later on. and its not as small as th picture. From other Pics, its about ~14 inches long.

Also, that site and discountave.net are almost identical and they are both in Cali.

I can get the Clarion for $96.22 shipped from Cardomain, the best price they could offer me. If I order the Clarion, I'll just order it from Cardomain because they're an authorized dealer and I'll get a warranty.

But the Profile has more power for a little more money. Anything else that's a significant bump in power, with good SQ, for not much more money?

I'm not sure I want to spring for the $180 US Acoustics yet, considering that less money might do the trick just fine. I'm seriously thinking about it though. I'm going to need do some more looking/reading.

 

[CTrain]

I did alot of reading on forums such as carstereo.com, Caraudio.com, caraudioforum.com

I was in the boat. Always wanted to get an amp but knew nothing about.
I bought my stuff and they wanted $100+ to install the sucker and I browse the net and learn it myself.
Its quite easy actually....the hard part is where to tuck in all your lines.

The Profile is really a good AMP for $100.
I had problem at first installing it because it wasn;t getting enough power but now its kicking @ss.
That Profile is actually more power than the Kappas need.

Go to those forum and you'll see US acoustics is like the best among inexpensive AMP. The best thing about that AMP is the low power usage 12.9 as oppose to 14.4 for most other AMPS.
If I can find that AMP for under $150, I would get it.

That Clarion might not have the output lines for a 2nd AMP hookup(daisy chain like) so becareful.

I bought my first AMP from Etronics because of the liberal return policy incase I screw up.
Amazon has Power Acoustik amps too if you just want to play with and return for something better.

 

[Thegonagle]

Thanks for those sites. I noticed that the USA was rated at 12.9 instead of 14.4, so that alone makes me optimistic. (3 year warranty a good sign, too.) What do you think about the US Acoustics USC4065? (I could save a few bucks.) If the 4X80 watt Profile is overkill, than the 4X85 watt USC4085 must be, too. Could the 4065 be just right?

EDIT: USC4065 looking good

CEA-2006 compliant ratings.
3 year warranty.
RMS output measured at 12.6V instead of 14.4V.
0.01% THD @ Rated RMS and 101 dB SN ratio. (That's good, right? It looks pretty good to me.)

 

[Delleet]

Originally posted by: CTrain
I did alot of reading on forums such as carstereo.com, Caraudio.com, caraudioforum.com

I was in the boat. Always wanted to get an amp but knew nothing about.
I bought my stuff and they wanted $100+ to install the sucker and I browse the net and learn it myself.
Its quite easy actually....the hard part is where to tuck in all your lines.

The Profile is really a good AMP for $100.
I had problem at first installing it because it wasn;t getting enough power but now its kicking @ss.
That Profile is actually more power than the Kappas need.

Go to those forum and you'll see US acoustics is like the best among inexpensive AMP. The best thing about that AMP is the low power usage 12.9 as oppose to 14.4 for most other AMPS.
If I can find that AMP for under $150, I would get it.

That Clarion might not have the output lines for a 2nd AMP hookup(daisy chain like) so becareful.

I bought my first AMP from Etronics because of the liberal return policy incase I screw up.
Amazon has Power Acoustik amps too if you just want to play with and return for something better.

"12.9" and "14.4" have absolutely nothing to do with power consumption. Your car's electrical system is made up of, in simple terms, your battery and your alternator. Your battery is 12v, whereas alternators supply a higher voltage of typically mid 13's. When you see "12.x" or "14.4" in regards to an amplifier it's just telling you that the amp is rated to do X watts at that voltage. Most cars will never make 14.4 volts, so it's kind of a sham to make an amp look more powerful than it is. As long as you're comparing amps that have been rated at the same voltage, or take the difference into account, you'll be fine. Again, it has nothing to do with power usage/efficiency.

As for getting a 2 channel to run 4 speakers, I wouldn't. You're already losing fade ability at the HU, and with a 2 channel you'll either completely lose any ability to fade even at the amp, or lose the ability to balance.

As for the amp not having a set of line-out RCA's for daisy chaning amps, it's really not a big deal to again use splitters if you get another amp, and worst case scenario is you have to get a line driver to boost the signal.

 

[Thegonagle]

Originally posted by: Delleet

Originally posted by: CTrain
I did alot of reading on forums such as carstereo.com, Caraudio.com, caraudioforum.com

I was in the boat. Always wanted to get an amp but knew nothing about.
I bought my stuff and they wanted $100+ to install the sucker and I browse the net and learn it myself.
Its quite easy actually....the hard part is where to tuck in all your lines.

The Profile is really a good AMP for $100.
I had problem at first installing it because it wasn;t getting enough power but now its kicking @ss.
That Profile is actually more power than the Kappas need.

Go to those forum and you'll see US acoustics is like the best among inexpensive AMP. The best thing about that AMP is the low power usage 12.9 as oppose to 14.4 for most other AMPS.
If I can find that AMP for under $150, I would get it.

That Clarion might not have the output lines for a 2nd AMP hookup(daisy chain like) so becareful.

I bought my first AMP from Etronics because of the liberal return policy incase I screw up.
Amazon has Power Acoustik amps too if you just want to play with and return for something better.

"12.9" and "14.4" have absolutely nothing to do with power consumption. Your car's electrical system is made up of, in simple terms, your battery and your alternator. Your battery is 12v, whereas alternators supply a higher voltage of typically mid 13's. When you see "12.x" or "14.4" in regards to an amplifier it's just telling you that the amp is rated to do X watts at that voltage. Most cars will never make 14.4 volts, so it's kind of a sham to make an amp look more powerful than it is. As long as you're comparing amps that have been rated at the same voltage, or take the difference into account, you'll be fine. Again, it has nothing to do with power usage/efficiency.

As for getting a 2 channel to run 4 speakers, I wouldn't. You're already losing fade ability at the HU, and with a 2 channel you'll either completely lose any ability to fade even at the amp, or lose the ability to balance.

As for the amp not having a set of line-out RCA's for daisy chaning amps, it's really not a big deal to again use splitters if you get another amp, and worst case scenario is you have to get a line driver to boost the signal.

You're right; I don't want to lose the ability to fade at the amp, so I didn't seriously consider that using a 2 channel. It also seems easier on the circuitry to run at 4 ohms instead of 2. I'd only try that if somebody gave me a 2 channel and I didn't have the choice to buy a 4 channel.

Thanks for that explanation on the 12.9 vs. 14.4 volt thing. I already figured that's what it meant, but you confirmed it.

The daisy chaining outputs? Meh. I'm sure I could do without, but if I ever decide I want to use a sub with the current HU, it would be nice because I'm already splitting the signal from 2 channels to 4. (If need be, I'd buy a different HU with 4 or 6 pre-outs before I used an auxilliary line driver. That adds another stage of amplification that could color the sound or pick up noise if it's not high quality. It also adds complexity and it seems the money could be better spent if applied to a more capable HU.)

 

[Delleet]

That's true, which is why I have the 9833 I don't run rears though...no point, except perhaps for rear passengers, but they're rare

 

[Thegonagle]

Originally posted by: Delleet
That's true, which is why I have the 9833 I don't run rears though...no point, except perhaps for rear passengers, but they're rare

I know. But the factory speakers are 6X9s in back, so they can stand in somewhat for a sub. I bought the Kappas as replacements in part because they claim to have frequency response down to 35 Hz, and for now, I don?t want a sub taking up valuable space in a small car.

 

[CTrain]

I was going to recommend buying components but he already have the set of Kappas so make use of it.
Of course you can always Ebay those Kappas.
My next purchase is components speakers.
Too lazy cause I know it'll take me a day to get install in the car.

I think the USC4065 is perfect for you if you're keeping those Kappas.
I've seen the USC4065 on Ebay for ~$100.

 

[CTrain]

Originally posted by: Delleet

Originally posted by: CTrain
I did alot of reading on forums such as carstereo.com, Caraudio.com, caraudioforum.com

I was in the boat. Always wanted to get an amp but knew nothing about.
I bought my stuff and they wanted $100+ to install the sucker and I browse the net and learn it myself.
Its quite easy actually....the hard part is where to tuck in all your lines.

The Profile is really a good AMP for $100.
I had problem at first installing it because it wasn;t getting enough power but now its kicking @ss.
That Profile is actually more power than the Kappas need.

Go to those forum and you'll see US acoustics is like the best among inexpensive AMP. The best thing about that AMP is the low power usage 12.9 as oppose to 14.4 for most other AMPS.
If I can find that AMP for under $150, I would get it.

That Clarion might not have the output lines for a 2nd AMP hookup(daisy chain like) so becareful.

I bought my first AMP from Etronics because of the liberal return policy incase I screw up.
Amazon has Power Acoustik amps too if you just want to play with and return for something better.

"12.9" and "14.4" have absolutely nothing to do with power consumption. Your car's electrical system is made up of, in simple terms, your battery and your alternator. Your battery is 12v, whereas alternators supply a higher voltage of typically mid 13's. When you see "12.x" or "14.4" in regards to an amplifier it's just telling you that the amp is rated to do X watts at that voltage. Most cars will never make 14.4 volts, so it's kind of a sham to make an amp look more powerful than it is. As long as you're comparing amps that have been rated at the same voltage, or take the difference into account, you'll be fine. Again, it has nothing to do with power usage/efficiency.

As for getting a 2 channel to run 4 speakers, I wouldn't. You're already losing fade ability at the HU, and with a 2 channel you'll either completely lose any ability to fade even at the amp, or lose the ability to balance.

As for the amp not having a set of line-out RCA's for daisy chaning amps, it's really not a big deal to again use splitters if you get another amp, and worst case scenario is you have to get a line driver to boost the signal.

Good explaination.
So US acoustics AMPS will run what they're claining and other AMPS are just overrated....??
I always knew all of the cheap amps are overrated anyway but they still do the job.

 

[CTrain]

BTW, the Profile AP1040 I have, it seems like its not getting enough power from the battery.
When the engine is not on the AMP is putting out crappy sound. The sounds coming out is crackling like crazy.
When I turn the engine on(alternator running) its fine, its actually is a dandy AMP.
Is this normal for all AMPs ?? Does the alternator need to be running ??

 

[Delleet]

Originally posted by: CTrain

Originally posted by: Delleet

Originally posted by: CTrain
I did alot of reading on forums such as carstereo.com, Caraudio.com, caraudioforum.com

I was in the boat. Always wanted to get an amp but knew nothing about.
I bought my stuff and they wanted $100+ to install the sucker and I browse the net and learn it myself.
Its quite easy actually....the hard part is where to tuck in all your lines.

The Profile is really a good AMP for $100.
I had problem at first installing it because it wasn;t getting enough power but now its kicking @ss.
That Profile is actually more power than the Kappas need.

Go to those forum and you'll see US acoustics is like the best among inexpensive AMP. The best thing about that AMP is the low power usage 12.9 as oppose to 14.4 for most other AMPS.
If I can find that AMP for under $150, I would get it.

That Clarion might not have the output lines for a 2nd AMP hookup(daisy chain like) so becareful.

I bought my first AMP from Etronics because of the liberal return policy incase I screw up.
Amazon has Power Acoustik amps too if you just want to play with and return for something better.

"12.9" and "14.4" have absolutely nothing to do with power consumption. Your car's electrical system is made up of, in simple terms, your battery and your alternator. Your battery is 12v, whereas alternators supply a higher voltage of typically mid 13's. When you see "12.x" or "14.4" in regards to an amplifier it's just telling you that the amp is rated to do X watts at that voltage. Most cars will never make 14.4 volts, so it's kind of a sham to make an amp look more powerful than it is. As long as you're comparing amps that have been rated at the same voltage, or take the difference into account, you'll be fine. Again, it has nothing to do with power usage/efficiency.

As for getting a 2 channel to run 4 speakers, I wouldn't. You're already losing fade ability at the HU, and with a 2 channel you'll either completely lose any ability to fade even at the amp, or lose the ability to balance.

As for the amp not having a set of line-out RCA's for daisy chaning amps, it's really not a big deal to again use splitters if you get another amp, and worst case scenario is you have to get a line driver to boost the signal.

Good explaination.
So US acoustics AMPS will run what they're claining and other AMPS are just overrated....??
I always knew all of the cheap amps are overrated anyway but they still do the job.

It's always nice to get the ratings at 12v or 13v, but they're not "lying" if they say 1500w at 14.4v, although you'll probably never see the full 1500w. Typically you'd probably just hear that the US Acoustic amp (or whatever amp) is "underrated." There are some amps, like the hifonics brutus series, that people claim are very overrated and only put out 900w @ 1 ohm as opposed to their rated 1500w. That's a big difference...one that's probably not just due to a difference of 13 and 14.4 volts.

 

[Delleet]

Originally posted by: CTrain
BTW, the Profile AP1040 I have, it seems like its not getting enough power from the battery.
When the engine is not on the AMP is putting out crappy sound. The sounds coming out is crackling like crazy.
When I turn the engine on(alternator running) its fine, its actually is a dandy AMP.
Is this normal for all AMPs ?? Does the alternator need to be running ??

I would say that is _not_ normal. What gauge wire are you powering it with? I'm not familiar with that amp, but assuming it's something like 300w rms it should run fine off of just the battery. I'm running almost 3000w rms and can play to pretty high volume without my bass amp (2200w rms) going into protect due to lack of power. I've never heard of an amp causing distortion, they usually go into protect mode.

 

[Thegonagle]

Now I'm as confused as ever. Some say that US Acoustics isn't good anymore and their 4 channel amps are especially bad now, Profile is better for subs than SQ, etc. I want good SQ first, with adequate power to rock out, but not to be heard from a block away. (I like my hearing, so I'd like to keep it.) Is 4X50 watts from the Clarion APA450, my cheap and "safe" but not very powerful choice, going to be adequate to drive my Kappas to "as loud as stock but ZERO distortion" levels? That's really all I want. I'm all set to go on the purchase, but I'm still a little worried about power. I just don't know how much I need. The sensitivity of my Kappas is 90dB.

Is 4X50 watts good enough for the main speakers, with the 6X9 rears supplying the bass, just as in a factory setup?

 

[CTrain]

Originally posted by: Delleet

Originally posted by: CTrain
BTW, the Profile AP1040 I have, it seems like its not getting enough power from the battery.
When the engine is not on the AMP is putting out crappy sound. The sounds coming out is crackling like crazy.
When I turn the engine on(alternator running) its fine, its actually is a dandy AMP.
Is this normal for all AMPs ?? Does the alternator need to be running ??

I would say that is _not_ normal. What gauge wire are you powering it with? I'm not familiar with that amp, but assuming it's something like 300w rms it should run fine off of just the battery. I'm running almost 3000w rms and can play to pretty high volume without my bass amp (2200w rms) going into protect due to lack of power. I've never heard of an amp causing distortion, they usually go into protect mode.

I didn't think it was normal
The AMP is only 80x4 rms and it only work well when I turn the engine on.
I have 4 gauge for both the power and ground wire.
Its really not distortion...its more like sounds cutting out due to not getting enough power.
I had a cheap Power Acoustik and it worked fine with just the battery.

 

[CTrain]

Originally posted by: Thegonagle
Now I'm as confused as ever. Some say that US Acoustics isn't good anymore and their 4 channel amps are especially bad now, Profile is better for subs than SQ, etc. I want good SQ first, with adequate power to rock out, but not to be heard from a block away. (I like my hearing, so I'd like to keep it.) Is 4X50 watts from the Clarion APA450, my cheap and "safe" but not very powerful choice, going to be adequate to drive my Kappas to "as loud as stock but ZERO distortion" levels? That's really all I want. I'm all set to go on the purchase, but I'm still a little worried about power. I just don't know how much I need. The sensitivity of my Kappas is 90dB.

Is 4X50 watts good enough for the main speakers, with the 6X9 rears supplying the bass, just as in a factory setup?

Where did you read about US acoutics being bad ??
I've only read how they are great AMP for the price.

WHy don't you just buy from some place you know you can get a full refund in case you don't like it.
Sounddomain, crutchfield, Etronics....

I tried to get as many opinions as possible before I bought one but after a while it goes back and forth so I just bought a cheap one to play with.
When you're dealing with "cheap" AMPs, you're not going to get a consensus "YES". Read what people have to say and decide on your own.

 

[Dr. Detroit]

US Acoustics is a great amp for the money. Used to be Alphasonik for those ol skool car audio heads.


50W RMS is huge for door speakers. You will prolly never use all that power. No need to go above that.

 

[Dead3ye]

Probably way more than you want to spend.

I'm sure you could find it cheaper elsewhere.

You are doing almost exaclty what I first did with my truck and my original Alpine HU which only had 1 pre amp out. This amp will do everything you want. You can run your speaker level inputs to it and have complete control with the HU fader, and save the line level out for a sub later. The HU you have can switch the pre amp from rear out to be a sub out, and you can control the level of the sub with the HU as well.

If you decide to upgrade the HU later to one that has 3 sets of pre amp outs, this amp is ready for that to.

I have this amp in my truck now and it absolutely kicks ass. It's connected to two 6x9 Infinity references in the back, plus the second set of outputs are bridged to a 10" sub. I have an Alpine 90x2 connect to the 6 1/2"s up front. I upgrade to the CDE-9833 which has 3 sets of preamps, but I left the speaker levels wired because I didn't feel like running new wires for everything and all I had to do was pop out the old Apine and put in the new with no rewiring at all. Plus, I didn't hear any difference in sound quality when I "test" wired it with the preamp outs. All I did was run a line level wire for the sub.

 

[CTrain]

Heres a another really good AMP for you.
LINK

Its a Profile CL640. I've read that the Clarus line is better than their Cali line.
A guy on one of the forum swore that he has installed numerous Clarus with 0 problems...where he had problems with the Cali line.
I'm actually going to buy one. I'm returning my AP1040 to Etronics.

 

[Thegonagle]

Originally posted by: CTrain
Heres a another really good AMP for you.
LINK

Its a Profile CL640. I've read that the Clarus line is better than their Cali line.
A guy on one of the forum swore that he has installed numerous Clarus with 0 problems...where he had problems with the Cali line.
I'm actually going to buy one. I'm returning my AP1040 to Etronics.

I was just looking at that. (Also this.)

 

[CTrain]

Originally posted by: Thegonagle

Originally posted by: CTrain
Heres a another really good AMP for you.
LINK

Its a Profile CL640. I've read that the Clarus line is better than their Cali line.
A guy on one of the forum swore that he has installed numerous Clarus with 0 problems...where he had problems with the Cali line.
I'm actually going to buy one. I'm returning my AP1040 to Etronics.

I was just looking at that. (Also this.)

Actually, I already played with a Power Acoustik OV4-600 which is identical to that AMP in specs.
Power Acoustik has 3 lines and the Power and Gothic lines had identical specs.
The OV4-600 is not bad....typical of a cheap amp that does the job.
However the AP1040 is clearly better(when its getting enough juice).
I would just keep my AP1040 but as someone said, its not normal to need to alternator on for the AMP to run so I'm going to return it.
I'm gonna try the Clarus line and see what its like. ZEB has 100% return policy.

I would rather pay the extra $13 to get the Profile....just from my experience.
If you end up wanting the Power Acoustik....Amazon has the Gothic OV4-600 shipped FREE. Tax FREE.

Its funny but we are probably looking for the same type of AMP.
A cheap 4 channel that does the job.

 

[CTrain]

Ah...stop thinking so much and just borrow..I mean buy one.
I'll be on my 3rd one and if I don't like it, I'll return it too.

 

[Thegonagle]

Yeah, you're right. I think I'll just order the Profile CL640 already.

EDIT: But those aren't cooling fans on top, are they? That could be a deal breaker for me.

EDIT 2: Word at carstereo.com is that it uses cooling fans. I'm not going for it since I can't hear the fans before I buy. Plus, it looks like too much money went into the flashy looks for my taste (no use for chrome--it's going to spend its life hiding under a seat). I'm back to looking at the US Acoustics USC4065 and the Clarion. I'm not sold on Profile or Power Acoustik yet. (Power Acoustik can't spell for sh*t anyway. )

EDIT 3: I might spring for the US Acoustics USC4065 because the 3 year warranty and the CEA2006 specs give me some extra confidence.

I've noticed that Crutchfield used to sell US Acoustics. Crutchfield sells some lower brands, but never bottom-of-the-barrel garbage, so that makes me feel alright, too.

The only thing about the 4065 is that the only place that seems to have it right now is cardomain.com, so I can't do any pricematching to see how low they'll go. I psychologically need to "get a deal," so I'm off coupon hunting.

P.S. I totally like the no BS looks of the US Acoustic products.

 

[Thegonagle]

Update: I'm going to order the Clarion APA450 for $96 shipped from CarDomain.com later tonight. If it works to my satisfaction, I'll keep it. If it doesn't, I'll return it and try the US Acoustics USC4065 instead. But I'm going to see if the cheaper route works well enough first. (Hopefully, 4X50 watts is enough--I only have an 80 amp alternator so I'm a little worried about the electrical system.)

Thanks to everybody who replied.